Odd interaction with a road rager

Dave Mount wrote:
On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 16:05:42 GMT, "S o r n i"
wrote:

Thirty of the 142
people on these flights were interviewed by the FBI, including 22 of
the 26 people (23 passengers and 3 private security guards) on the
Bin Ladin flight. Many were asked detailed questions. None of the
passengers stated that they had any recent contact with Usama Bin
Ladin or knew anything about terrorist activity.

ROTFLMAO

Oh, so that's all right then.

You snipped the claim that this was refuting. ("PArticularly if by "bin
Laden" you mean the Saudi bin Laden family who are such good and loyal
friends of Dubya that they were allowed to flee the country after 9/11 while
just about everything else was grounded...")

It isn't true.

Bill "I know it doesn't please you to read facts" S.

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 16:45:40 GMT, "S o r n i" wrote:

You snipped the claim that this was refuting. ("PArticularly if by "bin
Laden" you mean the Saudi bin Laden family who are such good and loyal
friends of Dubya that they were allowed to flee the country after 9/11 while
just about everything else was grounded...")

What I wrote had nothing to do with any claim.

It was purely laughing at the idiocy of allowing people to leave the country
just because they didn't *say* they were terrorists.

Rather like the way they somberly ask you if you are intending to commit any
acts of terrorism when you enter the US.

Now, why didn't *that* one catch the 9/11 terrorists, I wonder?


Dave "You won't catch teorrorists by asking them if they're terrorists" Mount

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 16:45:40 GMT, "S o r n i" wrote:

You snipped the claim that this was refuting. ("PArticularly if by "bin
Laden" you mean the Saudi bin Laden family who are such good and loyal
friends of Dubya that they were allowed to flee the country after 9/11 while
just about everything else was grounded...")

What I wrote had nothing to do with any claim.

It was purely laughing at the idiocy of allowing people to leave the country
just because they didn't *say* they were terrorists.

Rather like the way they somberly ask you if you are intending to commit any
acts of terrorism when you enter the US.

Now, why didn't *that* one catch the 9/11 terrorists, I wonder?


Dave "You won't catch teorrorists by asking them if they're terrorists" Mount

Wed, 01 Sep 2004 11:19:33 -0400,
, Badger_South
wrote:

The key phrase, for me, is 'this encourges the same behavior'

So why add this dreck?
...towards
other bikers, or towards yourself should you encounter the cager in the
future.

Scud jockeys give each other all the encouragement and reinforcement
they need to continue their loathsome detestable ways. The skanky
asswipes who threaten and menace cyclists behave the same toward other
drivers too.
--
zk

Wed, 01 Sep 2004 11:19:33 -0400,
, Badger_South
wrote:

The key phrase, for me, is 'this encourges the same behavior'

So why add this dreck?
...towards
other bikers, or towards yourself should you encounter the cager in the
future.

Scud jockeys give each other all the encouragement and reinforcement
they need to continue their loathsome detestable ways. The skanky
asswipes who threaten and menace cyclists behave the same toward other
drivers too.
--
zk

I slightly disagree. In my experience, most drivers have very few
encounters with bikers. I've been driving for 35 years and have rarely
encountered a biker on the road...

I guess it depends on where you live. New York is a heavily populated
city - and its suburbs, especially here on Long Island, are pretty crowded,
too. My "little" town (population 20,000) is definitely an automobile
community. There are no bike lanes, no bike paths, and drivers have very
little patience for cyclists who try to share the road with them. To
survive a bike ride to the local Dunkin' Donuts means being an extremely
vigilant cyclist with a good sense of what the average auto driver is
thinking at any given time --especially now that one out of every three cars
in our town is driven by someone with a cell phone to his/her ear virtually
all the time.

All this said, there is no room for bicyclists who fly around town with the
attitude that they can go anywhere and do anything they please and, as long
as they make it to the other side of the road, they are OK. I watched a kid
get knocked at least 10 feet into the center of a very busy four lane
turnpike the other day. The driver was simply waiting at a red light. He
wasn't on the phone, wasn't talking to a passenger, and wasn't sipping a
Starbuck's. The light turned green, a young teenager who was zipping along
the sidewalk on the wrong side of the road made an uninformed decision about
his ability to beat all the cars through the intersection, the driver tapped
his gas pedal, and the next thing you know, cars are skidding and swerving
all over the road to avoid crushing the kid's head. The driver did nothing
wrong. The kid was coming from the wrong direction, on the wrong side of
the road, but he probably didn't know any better. It could have changed his
life forever - and it certainly could have changed the driver's life
forever.

Not to sound cold or unsympathetic to people who get injured on bicycles,
but I resent that my life as a driver can be altered in a split second by a
poorly trained or irresponsible cyclist. And, unfortunately, most of the
cyclists in my community are exactly that. As I said earlier, this being a
pretty bustling suburb, I see these guys, literally, every day. It wouldn't
matter to me as much if dangerous bicycling was something that only popped
up every once in a while.

Anyway, my point in the original post was that I think we should understand
that, among the many jerky, road-raging drivers out there, there are also
lots of people like me who are wound just a little bit tight when we get
behind the wheel and have to try to second-guess what the bicycles around us
will do next. I can't assume any other cyclist is going to ride the way I
do when I'm on the bike. And I can't assume that every bicyclist
understands what it takes to operate a car.

So when I'm driving and I see a cyclist do something that looks to be
dangerous or stupid, chances are I might slip into a momentary rage, too. I
might honk my horn or yell some kind of obscenity with my windows rolled all
the way up. Then it goes away, and by that time, the cyclist may have
caught up to me, as was the case with the guy who started this thread. And
by this point, I may have lost my urge to confront him, knowing that nothing
I can say or do will get through to him. That doesn't make me a baby or a
wimp, and it doesn't, by any means, make him right.

I slightly disagree. In my experience, most drivers have very few
encounters with bikers. I've been driving for 35 years and have rarely
encountered a biker on the road...

I guess it depends on where you live. New York is a heavily populated
city - and its suburbs, especially here on Long Island, are pretty crowded,
too. My "little" town (population 20,000) is definitely an automobile
community. There are no bike lanes, no bike paths, and drivers have very
little patience for cyclists who try to share the road with them. To
survive a bike ride to the local Dunkin' Donuts means being an extremely
vigilant cyclist with a good sense of what the average auto driver is
thinking at any given time --especially now that one out of every three cars
in our town is driven by someone with a cell phone to his/her ear virtually
all the time.

All this said, there is no room for bicyclists who fly around town with the
attitude that they can go anywhere and do anything they please and, as long
as they make it to the other side of the road, they are OK. I watched a kid
get knocked at least 10 feet into the center of a very busy four lane
turnpike the other day. The driver was simply waiting at a red light. He
wasn't on the phone, wasn't talking to a passenger, and wasn't sipping a
Starbuck's. The light turned green, a young teenager who was zipping along
the sidewalk on the wrong side of the road made an uninformed decision about
his ability to beat all the cars through the intersection, the driver tapped
his gas pedal, and the next thing you know, cars are skidding and swerving
all over the road to avoid crushing the kid's head. The driver did nothing
wrong. The kid was coming from the wrong direction, on the wrong side of
the road, but he probably didn't know any better. It could have changed his
life forever - and it certainly could have changed the driver's life
forever.

Not to sound cold or unsympathetic to people who get injured on bicycles,
but I resent that my life as a driver can be altered in a split second by a
poorly trained or irresponsible cyclist. And, unfortunately, most of the
cyclists in my community are exactly that. As I said earlier, this being a
pretty bustling suburb, I see these guys, literally, every day. It wouldn't
matter to me as much if dangerous bicycling was something that only popped
up every once in a while.

Anyway, my point in the original post was that I think we should understand
that, among the many jerky, road-raging drivers out there, there are also
lots of people like me who are wound just a little bit tight when we get
behind the wheel and have to try to second-guess what the bicycles around us
will do next. I can't assume any other cyclist is going to ride the way I
do when I'm on the bike. And I can't assume that every bicyclist
understands what it takes to operate a car.

So when I'm driving and I see a cyclist do something that looks to be
dangerous or stupid, chances are I might slip into a momentary rage, too. I
might honk my horn or yell some kind of obscenity with my windows rolled all
the way up. Then it goes away, and by that time, the cyclist may have
caught up to me, as was the case with the guy who started this thread. And
by this point, I may have lost my urge to confront him, knowing that nothing
I can say or do will get through to him. That doesn't make me a baby or a
wimp, and it doesn't, by any means, make him right.

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 18:20:52 GMT, "NYRides"
wrote:

Not to sound cold or unsympathetic to people who get injured on bicycles,
but I resent that my life as a driver can be altered in a split second by a
poorly trained or irresponsible cyclist. And, unfortunately, most of the
cyclists in my community are exactly that. As I said earlier, this being a
pretty bustling suburb, I see these guys, literally, every day. It wouldn't
matter to me as much if dangerous bicycling was something that only popped
up every once in a while.

Anyway, my point in the original post was that I think we should understand
that, among the many jerky, road-raging drivers out there, there are also
lots of people like me who are wound just a little bit tight when we get
behind the wheel and have to try to second-guess what the bicycles around us
will do next. I can't assume any other cyclist is going to ride the way I
do when I'm on the bike. And I can't assume that every bicyclist
understands what it takes to operate a car.

So when I'm driving and I see a cyclist do something that looks to be
dangerous or stupid, chances are I might slip into a momentary rage, too. I
might honk my horn or yell some kind of obscenity with my windows rolled all
the way up. Then it goes away, and by that time, the cyclist may have
caught up to me, as was the case with the guy who started this thread. And
by this point, I may have lost my urge to confront him, knowing that nothing
I can say or do will get through to him. That doesn't make me a baby or a
wimp, and it doesn't, by any means, make him right.

Right, but in a way, you -know- to expect this behavior and are less
susceptible to it. It's certainly not 'right', but if you're surrounded by
dumb kids in bikes, then that's your milieu, and you are more-or-less
prepared, or should be. Not to sound preachy, but it's just another thing
you have to add to your mental checklist, and be thankful that you're more
attentive than most.

If it is that bad though, maybe the people in your suburb should get more
police patrols so they can look at the problem?

-B

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 18:20:52 GMT, "NYRides"
wrote:

Not to sound cold or unsympathetic to people who get injured on bicycles,
but I resent that my life as a driver can be altered in a split second by a
poorly trained or irresponsible cyclist. And, unfortunately, most of the
cyclists in my community are exactly that. As I said earlier, this being a
pretty bustling suburb, I see these guys, literally, every day. It wouldn't
matter to me as much if dangerous bicycling was something that only popped
up every once in a while.

Anyway, my point in the original post was that I think we should understand
that, among the many jerky, road-raging drivers out there, there are also
lots of people like me who are wound just a little bit tight when we get
behind the wheel and have to try to second-guess what the bicycles around us
will do next. I can't assume any other cyclist is going to ride the way I
do when I'm on the bike. And I can't assume that every bicyclist
understands what it takes to operate a car.

So when I'm driving and I see a cyclist do something that looks to be
dangerous or stupid, chances are I might slip into a momentary rage, too. I
might honk my horn or yell some kind of obscenity with my windows rolled all
the way up. Then it goes away, and by that time, the cyclist may have
caught up to me, as was the case with the guy who started this thread. And
by this point, I may have lost my urge to confront him, knowing that nothing
I can say or do will get through to him. That doesn't make me a baby or a
wimp, and it doesn't, by any means, make him right.

Right, but in a way, you -know- to expect this behavior and are less
susceptible to it. It's certainly not 'right', but if you're surrounded by
dumb kids in bikes, then that's your milieu, and you are more-or-less
prepared, or should be. Not to sound preachy, but it's just another thing
you have to add to your mental checklist, and be thankful that you're more
attentive than most.

If it is that bad though, maybe the people in your suburb should get more
police patrols so they can look at the problem?

-B

"NYRides" wrote in message .net...

Sadly, I think the "other thing" that many people have going on in their
lives is an underlying frustration with bicyclists who constantly ignore the
rules of the road and are frequently a menace to drivers as they weave in
and out of traffic, ride on the wrong side of the road, and blow through
traffic lights.



It is true that unruly cyclist give everyone a bad name. But in this
case, the OP was not (at least did not say he was) breaking traffic
laws.

Peeling-out, unecessary horn-honking, aggressive lane changes are all
hallmarks of road-ragers especially if the cyclist does not impede the
travel of the car in any real way.

I don't think that road-ragers have a special thing for cyclists.
Slow, or temporarily stopped cars bring similar responses out of them.
The difference is that the cyclist is in a vastly more vulnerable
situation than a car.

As I said before, road-ragers have some personal conflict going on
that is unrelated to traffic. No one flys into a blood rage at a
stranger over trivial traffic issues unless something much deeper is
bugging them.

The typical advice that authorities give to potential victims of road
rage applies to cyclists too:

1) Don't provoke/escalate a confrontation by responding aggressively
2) Diffuse the situation by backing off, create distance, get out of
the way