A Cycling & bikes forum. CycleBanter.com

Go Back   Home » CycleBanter.com forum » rec.bicycles » Techniques
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Making America into Amsterdam



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #151  
Old July 16th 18, 06:20 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,041
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Wednesday, July 4, 2018 at 11:21:46 AM UTC-5, duane wrote:

Is there any place that is seriously looking at bike infrastructure to
increase revenues?

Here the motivation is to reduce the number of cars in a city that can't
handle much more traffic. Cycling is treated in much the same way as
public transit. The city wants to reduce motor vehicle traffic in town.


In my city, which has many miles of bike paths, the bike paths are under the parks and recreation department of the government. In my city we treat bike paths as parks. Recreational areas. I doubt any park in the country has paid for itself. Parks are generally built as a quality of life enhancement. Although there are a few miles of bike paths alongside the busy roads going into the downtown. I suppose those are for vehicle reduction purposes.
Ads
  #153  
Old July 16th 18, 02:29 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 1:14 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 4, 2018 at 11:13:59 AM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:

The issue was whether separated bicycle facilities have any effect on the economy, which is probably "no."
-- Jay Beattie.


I'd dispute that. I live in a city with lots of bike paths. I use them a lot. I probably bicycle more due to having the paths. Its so easy to ride. I stop at convenience stores and restaurants more due to cycling. I spend more of my money locally because I bicycle. Without the paths, I might not ride. And I would not go to the convenience stores or restaurants. Less of my money would be spent locally. My money would stay in my bank account until I spend it on stuff ordered from Amazon or invested in the stock market. It definitely would not go to local merchants.


I don't doubt that you and Joerg use bike paths and buy things. But
that's a long, long way from saying that bike paths have any
(significant) effect on the economy.

The longest bike path in our area has obviously allowed one bike shop to
thrive. But two other bike shops opened at other locations along the
same bike path. One moved after a few years to a better location, where
they are making much more money. The other closed down maybe a week ago.
They said it was unprofitable.

The net overall effect on the economy of that path is very close to zero.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #154  
Old July 16th 18, 03:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 6:29:58 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 1:14 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 4, 2018 at 11:13:59 AM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:

The issue was whether separated bicycle facilities have any effect on the economy, which is probably "no."
-- Jay Beattie.


I'd dispute that. I live in a city with lots of bike paths. I use them a lot. I probably bicycle more due to having the paths. Its so easy to ride. I stop at convenience stores and restaurants more due to cycling. I spend more of my money locally because I bicycle. Without the paths, I might not ride. And I would not go to the convenience stores or restaurants. Less of my money would be spent locally. My money would stay in my bank account until I spend it on stuff ordered from Amazon or invested in the stock market. It definitely would not go to local merchants.


I don't doubt that you and Joerg use bike paths and buy things. But
that's a long, long way from saying that bike paths have any
(significant) effect on the economy.

The longest bike path in our area has obviously allowed one bike shop to
thrive. But two other bike shops opened at other locations along the
same bike path. One moved after a few years to a better location, where
they are making much more money. The other closed down maybe a week ago.
They said it was unprofitable.

The net overall effect on the economy of that path is very close to zero.


It's probably worthy of a study and highly dependent on location, city density, etc. I've never spent any money at a store because it was accessible by a separate path -- except I bought an ice cream sandwich at Cartlandia while riding back from the Gorge.
http://www.cartlandia.com/ Those food carts are on the Springwater Corridor in a crummy part of town. Some separated facilities are highly useful to me, but not for shopping or entertainment..

-- Jay Beattie.
  #155  
Old July 16th 18, 03:54 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 401
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 16/07/2018 10:11 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 6:29:58 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 1:14 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 4, 2018 at 11:13:59 AM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:

The issue was whether separated bicycle facilities have any effect on the economy, which is probably "no."
-- Jay Beattie.

I'd dispute that. I live in a city with lots of bike paths. I use them a lot. I probably bicycle more due to having the paths. Its so easy to ride. I stop at convenience stores and restaurants more due to cycling. I spend more of my money locally because I bicycle. Without the paths, I might not ride. And I would not go to the convenience stores or restaurants. Less of my money would be spent locally. My money would stay in my bank account until I spend it on stuff ordered from Amazon or invested in the stock market. It definitely would not go to local merchants.


I don't doubt that you and Joerg use bike paths and buy things. But
that's a long, long way from saying that bike paths have any
(significant) effect on the economy.

The longest bike path in our area has obviously allowed one bike shop to
thrive. But two other bike shops opened at other locations along the
same bike path. One moved after a few years to a better location, where
they are making much more money. The other closed down maybe a week ago.
They said it was unprofitable.

The net overall effect on the economy of that path is very close to zero.


It's probably worthy of a study and highly dependent on location, city density, etc. I've never spent any money at a store because it was accessible by a separate path -- except I bought an ice cream sandwich at Cartlandia while riding back from the Gorge.
http://www.cartlandia.com/ Those food carts are on the Springwater Corridor in a crummy part of town. Some separated facilities are highly useful to me, but not for shopping or entertainment.

-- Jay Beattie.


I think that any time you can create an influx of people, there will be
vendors there to serve them. In Quebec the is La Route Verte. Parts of
it are just regular roads but some sections like Le Petit Train du Nord
are cycling only in the summer.

http://gobiking.ca/quebec-rides/ptit-train-du-nord/

This was basically a train that went up to the Laurentians to bring
skiers. It was converted into a cycling path in the summer and cross
country ski in the winter. The train stopped at a series of small ski
towns. They didn't do well in the summer seasons but now they get a
decent business from cyclists. Also the small ice cream places and
snack bars that sprung up along the path.

This has nothing to do with transportation though. It's mostly a linear
park that people use for recreation. I guess a few of the bikes on it
are commuting from town to town but that would be mostly restaurant
workers etc.
  #156  
Old July 16th 18, 03:56 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 2018-07-15 15:01, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


We met at a coffee shop this morning, but I didn't partake. Got up to
95F, and I ran out of water, so I stopped at a market with my
cohorts. Also stopped for a little ferry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfIcrKZesw&t=3s What a beautiful day
it was. No pubs. Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and no pubs
-- although I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol. Obviously two
no-fun rides because they didn't involve a pub of any kind.


Somewhere between 95-100F yesterday, did a 20-miler after church.

http://mikebikehike.com/wp-content/u...6/IMG_0140.jpg

No, this ain't my bike. In contrast to some here who find that "unusual"
lots of people in our area ride with panniers. For longer rides in hilly
terrain without water spigots there is no alternative other that
schlepping a hydration pack which will result in profuse sweating. Or
drink American River water and get E-Coli.

Oh, and I had an IPA on the way back 8-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #157  
Old July 16th 18, 04:17 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,018
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Sun, 15 Jul 2018 15:01:58 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and no pubs -- although
I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol. Obviously two no-fun
rides because they didn't involve a pub of any kind.
-- Jay Beattie.


Careful when mixing alcohol and Tylenol (acetaminophen). The
combination can cause liver damage:
https://www.healthline.com/health/pain-relief/acetaminophen-alcohol
Methinks that aspirin is safer, as long as you don't have a problem
with stomach bleeding or ulcers.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #158  
Old July 16th 18, 05:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 7:56:37 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-15 15:01, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


We met at a coffee shop this morning, but I didn't partake. Got up to
95F, and I ran out of water, so I stopped at a market with my
cohorts. Also stopped for a little ferry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfIcrKZesw&t=3s What a beautiful day
it was. No pubs. Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and no pubs
-- although I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol. Obviously two
no-fun rides because they didn't involve a pub of any kind.


Somewhere between 95-100F yesterday, did a 20-miler after church.

http://mikebikehike.com/wp-content/u...6/IMG_0140.jpg

No, this ain't my bike. In contrast to some here who find that "unusual"
lots of people in our area ride with panniers. For longer rides in hilly
terrain without water spigots there is no alternative other that
schlepping a hydration pack which will result in profuse sweating. Or
drink American River water and get E-Coli.

Oh, and I had an IPA on the way back 8-)


Again, you're mixing road and trail. That's a road bike with panniers with probably 28mm tires and, gasp, ordinary rim brakes. It's not going trail riding any time soon.

I don't think it's unusual to see road bikes with panniers. I probably saw 20-30 cyclists with panniers on the way to work this morning. I think its unusual to need panniers with tons of junk in them for a recreational weekend ride with friends, and in your case, drinking at a pub. I suppose if the table is wobbly, you could always find something in your panniers to shim it. It's always good to have rope, particularly if you want to practice your knots while drinking.

I take no position on what is necessary for the brutal, godforsaken, mountain lion infested trail riding around Cameron Park. You might need air support for all I know.

-- Jay Beattie.
  #159  
Old July 16th 18, 05:38 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sepp Ruf
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 454
Default Making America into Amsterdam

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 15 Jul 2018 15:01:58 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie wrote:


Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and no pubs -- although
I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol. Obviously two no-fun
rides because they didn't involve a pub of any kind.
-- Jay Beattie.


Careful when mixing alcohol and Tylenol (acetaminophen). The
combination can cause liver damage:
https://www.healthline.com/health/pain-relief/acetaminophen-alcohol
Methinks that aspirin is safer, as long as you don't have a problem
with stomach bleeding or ulcers.


Speaking of stomach ulcers and straining to keep up with the RARE faster
rider:
Does anyone have an idea how strong an "emergency fluid" needs to be to kill
ingested helicobacter-pylori that a fly occasionally carries into the
carelessly opened mouth during strenuous cycling, especially when riding
dangerously upright (Dutch-geometry) cycles? There rarely are any St.
Bernard dogs around any more I could ask for a double brandy. So I tend to
just have a yoghurt with cayenne pepper and a garlic clove asap if it's too
late to spit the insect out. But I'd really prefer to apply some kind of
cold beer or whiskey-cola. Any ideas, home-brew or not?
  #160  
Old July 16th 18, 06:06 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 11:38 AM, Sepp Ruf wrote:
Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 15 Jul 2018 15:01:58 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie wrote:


Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and no pubs -- although
I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol. Obviously two no-fun
rides because they didn't involve a pub of any kind.
-- Jay Beattie.


Careful when mixing alcohol and Tylenol (acetaminophen). The
combination can cause liver damage:
https://www.healthline.com/health/pain-relief/acetaminophen-alcohol
Methinks that aspirin is safer, as long as you don't have a problem
with stomach bleeding or ulcers.


Speaking of stomach ulcers and straining to keep up with the RARE faster
rider:
Does anyone have an idea how strong an "emergency fluid" needs to be to kill
ingested helicobacter-pylori that a fly occasionally carries into the
carelessly opened mouth during strenuous cycling, especially when riding
dangerously upright (Dutch-geometry) cycles? There rarely are any St.
Bernard dogs around any more I could ask for a double brandy. So I tend to
just have a yoghurt with cayenne pepper and a garlic clove asap if it's too
late to spit the insect out. But I'd really prefer to apply some kind of
cold beer or whiskey-cola. Any ideas, home-brew or not?


Those Spagnoli have just the thing for you:

http://destileriaslh.com/web/eng/ind...Cour#contenido

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Looking like Amsterdam Alycidon UK 23 August 15th 15 06:45 PM
A bicycle not wood, Black & Decker's feeble attempts at making bicycletools and tire-not-making Doug Cimperman Techniques 7 December 9th 12 12:40 AM
Tire-making, episode {I-lost-track} --- making inner-tubes DougC Techniques 1 September 11th 10 03:43 PM
TT: 1. Deutschland Uber Alles 2. America 3. America Ted van de Weteringe Racing 4 September 25th 08 07:26 PM
These mp3 interviews -Air America -Know why there is about to be civil war in America. A MUST LISTEN harbinger Australia 17 June 4th 06 12:16 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 CycleBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.