Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On Dec 10, 8:48*pm, Tºm Shermªn™ °_° ""twshermanREMOVE\"@THI
$southslope.net" wrote:

Fun to play the straight man, it is.
Play? So you're not straight? You and Frank?
DR

On 12/11/2010 12:26 AM, DirtRoadie wrote:
On Dec 10, 8:48 pm, Tºm Shermªn™ °_°""twshermanREMOVE\"@THI
$southslope.net" wrote:

Fun to play the straight man, it is.
Play? So you're not straight? You and Frank?
DR

Lacking comprehension, DirtRoadie is.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.

On Dec 10, 10:29*pm, Frank Krygowski wrote:

I agree, that's a minimal first step for someone willing to do a
little learning. *I wonder how many cyclists ever bother to read
those?

Lots of people seem to assume they're expert cyclists, even though
they've never bothered to try to learn from anything other than their
own imagination. *They think there's really nothing to learn about
bicycling.

Speaking of imagination -
Who are these unidentified straw people that you constantly rant about
but who never seem to exist?

Reading is the first step to doing better.

It helps but it is the comprehending the makes the difference. And
experience is the real teacher, for without it the reading gives no
context.

DR

On Dec 10, 7:55 pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:

Your response was much more polite than mine. You must be new dealing with
this
guy.

Truthfully I first experienced the whole ordeal maybe 10 or more years
ago. The ordeal loses its effect after you've experienced it 30 or 40
times.

I'm aware of how MIME works. It doesn't change the underlying
foundation of Usenet, it just makes it possible to piggyback
non-ASCII content onto an ASCII medium of transport.

=v= There aren't so many NNTP servers as there used to be.
Are any of them really so old that they still choke on 8 bits?
_Jym_

On Dec 10, 7:55 pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:

Your response was much more polite than mine. You must be new dealing with
this
guy.

Here's an old exchange with Frank where, in exasperation, I reply to
his formulaic spiel using using recycled responses from older threads.
In the recycled quotes there are references to still older threads.

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.b...38159264d66f1e

"Tºm ShermªnT °_°" " wrote in
message ...
On 12/10/2010 9:16 PM, Duane Hebert wrote:
"T?m Sherm?n? " wrote in
message ...
On 12/10/2010 10:00 AM, Duane H?bert wrote:
On 12/10/2010 10:48 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
[...]
Read the first two chapters of Mionske's _Bicycling& The Law_ for
discussion of rights to the road.

He doesn't seem to be offering a free copy at his website so why don't
you tell me what it says?[...]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library

I would have figured that you would get sarcasm.

Fun to play the straight man, it is.

Ok Master Yoda. I was worried there a minute. You know that
the inability to detect sarcasm can be a symptom of greater
problems...

"Jay Beattie" wrote in message
...
On Dec 10, 8:00 am, Duane Hébert wrote:

I would skip his book and buy whatever the Province is publishing for
bicyclists. Every government seems to have its bicycle book. The one
in Oregon is nice, but it's wrong in a number of respects (ignores two
recent CA opinions). The ultimate authorities are the police and
common sense. The police do not care about Bob Mionske books or
glossy pamphlets. They read the law and apply it -- usually wiith an
institutional spin (the allowed passing on the right in PDX long
before it was made legal because it kept traffic moving. They want to
keep bikes out of traffic). Not that they are always right, but they
know the traffic court judges a whole lot better than the pierced
Bohemian fixie poseurs claiming that a fixed gear is a "brake" for
purposes of the UVC equipment rules for bikes.

I have several cycling handbooks and ride with a club that specifies
its own rules. When I moved here, I read through some handbooks at our
local
library to familiarize myself with local laws. For example, I know that I
am
supposed to ride in bike lanes when they exist.

My favorite LBS has a coffee bar so I frequent it often and talk to local
riders.

Now I've also read the Quebec Highway Code which
is the basis of local law.


Finally, common sense tells you that some legal maneuvers are idiotic
and counter productive in terms of usual driver response -- the "you
we're in the right but dead" scenario DR (I think) mentioned.
Bicycling is not rocket science. You don't need an advanced degree or
even a special certificate to be competent in traffic.

It's good to know where you stand with the law but like a lot of
cyclists that I know I tend to do what I think is right. We're supposed
to treat stop signs and red lights here the same as cars. I tend to treat
stop signs as yield signs and red lights as stop signs, depending on
the circumstance.

And I agree, it's not rocket science.

"DirtRoadie" wrote in message
...
On Dec 10, 10:09 pm, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Look: When I take a typical bike ride, I'm probably passed by
hundreds of motorists. I know all about that situation. The typical
motorist around here probably doesn't pass even one cyclist per day.

Holy crap! No wonder you think you can get away with the **** you do.
On many of the roads around here a half hour drive would probably take
a driver past 50 or more cyclists. If even a few of them tried your
antics regularly there would be an army of hostile drivers. There are
roads here where there are no shoulders and it is NOT possible for a
driver to pass a cyclist without crossing into the oncoming lane, even
if the cyclist is riding safely competently, legally and courteously
at the right side of the road. Add a ****tard who thinks he is going
to dictate to the driver when it is safe to pass by riding in the
middle of the lane (forcing the driver completely into the other lane
in order to pass) and see if you don't encounter some overt
hostility.

+1

Exactly the problem with trying to dictate behavior to everyone,
without regard to differences in circumstance.
Hell I saw more than 1 cyclist on my drive to work yesterday and there's
2 feet of snow on the ground.

"Tºm Shermªn™ °_°" " wrote in
message ...
On 12/11/2010 12:01 AM, DirtRoadie wrote:
Holy crap! No wonder you think you can get away with the **** you do.
On many of the roads around here a half hour drive would probably take
a driver past 50 or more cyclists.

I doubt that I have passed 50 cyclists in a motor vehicle this year.

Have you driven a motor vehicle this year?