Ultegra/105 STI Shifter Compatability

java- Are you saying that you can use an 8 speed brifter on a nine speed
cassette? BRBR

I am not nor is Mr. Dacey. If he has a 8s shifter, replace with a 8s, if a 9s,
replace with a 9s.

question was is a ultegra shifter compatible with a 105 rear der...answer
yes...but get the same 'speed' as previously, match the cassette...

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 16:54:43 GMT, Steve Juniper
wrote:
TDF climb segment). As Joe Friel ('Cyclist's Training Bible') says, high
rpms for speed and endurance, lower for those shorter distances where
more power is needed briefly.

That may be a good general rule of thumb, but it
should always be tempered by experimentation and
experience.

Until recently, I always tried to spin 80 rpm or
so, matching my gear to that cadence.

Then I decided to do something a little different,
and found that I go faster and last much, much
longer by torquing a taller gear.

That is my observation about _me_. Every person's
body and psychology is different; and each should
feel free to experiment to find what works. Also,
each should repeatedly experiment, especialyl with
things like cadence which don't cost anything other
than a few minutes.

Yes, I said psychology. I meant it in so far as
whatever excites you will help your riding...and
finding my lower cadence, as well as finding my
new long-distance ability, excites me to no end.

After taking my longest ride ever on Saturday, my
legs continue to feel it; I am supressing the excited urge to ride right
now, lest I damage my
muscles.

--
Rick Onanian

On Sun, 17 Aug 2003 03:27:15 GMT,
wrote:

I'm sure you don't turn 72rpm on any 18% or greater grade a 1/4 mile
or longer. I've watched many races and seen tourist riders on passes
like the Gavia and Gerlos and the only riders I saw pedaling that fast
were substantially under-geared (less than 1:1 aka 20t-30t) riders
making little headway. I suspect I never saw them again because they
never got up the hill. The same is true for hiking. The quick-step
guys don't climb steep trails but talk about it.

If 18% or greater grades 1/4 mile or longer are normal cycling, then
why do you post your ride reports detailing the long grades? Why are
there so many web pages describing bicycle rides over the Sierra
passes? Sorry, I think this argument is a red herring.

Pat

Patrick Lamb writes:

I'm sure you don't turn 72rpm on any 18% or greater grade a 1/4
mile or longer. I've watched many races and seen tourist riders on
passes like the Gavia and Gerlos and the only riders I saw pedaling
that fast were substantially under-geared (less than 1:1 aka
20t-30t) riders making little headway. I suspect I never saw them
again because they never got up the hill. The same is true for
hiking. The quick-step guys don't climb steep trails but talk
about it.

If 18% or greater grades 1/4 mile or longer are normal cycling, then
why do you post your ride reports detailing the long grades? Why
are there so many web pages describing bicycle rides over the Sierra
passes? Sorry, I think this argument is a red herring.

I don't get your tangential reference to ride reports. Right here in
my area we have plenty of roads with 18-20 percent grades for more
than a quarter mile. My point is that first you proposed lower gears
and then say that the purpose of keeping cadence at what I see as
artificially high levels, levels that riders imagine are effective. I
propose they are not and that no one in fact rides that way, and I do
so from many rides I have taken in the mountains with other riders,
tourists and racers.

http://www.paloaltobicycles.com/alps_photos/s10.html

Here I am with the California State Road champion a week after he won
the race. He did not spin up these hills nor did I. We rode as TdF
riders do today at less than 60rpm here and on the Gavia, Stelvio,
Grossglockner and Gerlos, all passes with longer steep sections. Lots
of these roads are on that web site and many more.

Jobst Brandt

Palo Alto CA

On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 16:22:01 GMT, (Eric Murray) may have
said:

I guess you are not going to let any pesky facts
get in the way of your theory. Go check out the gearing
on new bikes in your LBS and get back to us.

If 95% of the bikes were being sold by an LBS, that would be a
relevant place to look. I suspect it's more like 5%.

More relevant to the road bike segment is what's in stock at the local
major sporting goods stores and (in snobbish neighborhoods) bike
boutiques. Of course, road bikes account for relatively little of the
overall bike sales, but it's my observation that at these two
categories of store, the majority of sales of that class will take
place. And if the stock on the floor at the local places which meet
that description are any example, the ones being pumped out by these
big sporting goods chains and bike boutiques (the latter of which, as
far as I am concerned, lose their right to LBS status by virtue of
selling status instead of bikes) often tend *not* to have a deep
enough low gear. Yes, I've looked.

Usually the same stores also have touring (sometimes termed
"performance"; go figure) bikes with a deeper low end as well, but the
salescritters are all too willing, ready and eager to drive the
testosterone-endowed customer right into the sport bikes with the tall
gears when they'd be better off in a touring or hybrid unit. It's
really just as much the customer's fault, though; they go in saying
they want a bike that can go fast, and the salescritter sells them
what they asked for.

I don't blame the stores in such an instance entirely, but an LBS
would probably have steered the customer to a more appropriate unit
because their people know more than just what it says in the glossy
brochures that the makers provide. And the problem isn't really with
the manufacturers either; they make what their wholesale customers
tell them is needed to put on display in the stores...but who's doing
the buying for a chain like Oshman's? A cycling specialist, or a
marketing droid?

A real LBS will tell a prospective customer both the up side of a pure
sport road bike and the down side, but a boutique will sell the
customer whatever he asks for, and tell him he has made a wise choice
without the slightest admonition that the choice has its
drawbacks...and the sporting goods stores often have no guidance to
offer at all. There are exceptions; the local REI has at least one
guy in the bike department who knows which pedal is left-hand threaded
and why you don't want to run in the small/small cog pair, but at the
big sporting goods store a couple of miles down the road (where they
have probably 5 times as many bikes for sale) it would be amazing to
me if the department had someone in it who could spell derailleur.
And yes, the same store had three (of 5) road bikes in there with no
lower gear pair than 39/23; that's probably OK here in Houston, where
the steepest grades you'll find are on a traffic overpass, but they
buy for the whole chain from a central location; those same choices
would be wrong for Austin. On the other hand, I didn't see a single
MTB in that display that had a low cog pair higher than 32/28, and
many were lower than that. And the MTBs outnumbered the road bikes by
something like 8 to 1. Has the public's choice become clear?

People outside of the cycling enthusiast market are buying a lot more
MTBs than any other category. Some of that's really image, but if you
ask people why they bought an MTB, the answers tend to run to ride
harshness, ride position, and, yes, gearing. MTBs typically have
lower gearing than either road, touring, or (as the industry seems to
have euphemised them) "comfort" bikes. (If harshness and position
were really the serious issues, the "comfort" bikes should be
dominating, but they're not. I would tend to put image ahead of
reality in that area, though.) I've heard the "racing bikes are just
too hard to ride" refrain from non-enthusiasts too often over the
years, and while the definition of "hard to ride" varies, gearing is
mentioned as often as not. Some of the people making that particular
complaint, in my opinion, should buy a fixed-gear bike and be done
with it, because what they're *really* griping about is the fact that
they don't remember to shift down out of the top cog when coming to a
stop, but they gripe a lot less with an MTB. (I was married to one of
these untill not too long ago.)

So, would more road bikes be sold if they were marketed with "touring"
gears more often? The only way to find out would be to try...and it
looks like there's way too much resistance to road bikes in the
marketplace right now for that to be an experiment worth staking any
money on. As a result, the manufacturers who are aiming more narrowly
at the real racers (and grabbing volume from the wannabes) by gearing
tall probably are just reflecting the reality that they see; I can't
really blame them for not wanting to try to *change* it, since they
most likely are making more bike sales in the MTB division than they
ever had when road bikes were popular.

--
My email address is antispammed;
pull WEEDS if replying via e-mail.
Yes, I have a killfile. If I don't respond to something,
it's also possible that I'm busy.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 04:38:48 GMT, Werehatrack
wrote:
If 95% of the bikes were being sold by an LBS, that would be a
relevant place to look. I suspect it's more like 5%.

Road bikes? Where else can you even FIND a road bike?

More relevant to the road bike segment is what's in stock at the local
major sporting goods stores and (in snobbish neighborhoods) bike
boutiques. Of course, road bikes account for relatively little of the

Huh?

I guess it's different in Texas, but here in Rhode
Island (and nearby Massachusettes) the only place to
get a road bike, or any bike manufactured by a real
bike company (not a Huffy/Magna/Next/Roadmaster/etc),
is at an LBS.

The exceptions are the borderline market, that is,
Mongoose (which can be found at LBS and sporting
good chains) and the newly-acquired GT/Schwinn, which
can be found at Wal Mart and Dick's Sporting Goods.

In fact, the _only_ road bike I've ever seen anywhere
other than a LBS is a low-end Diamondback model at
Dick's Sporting Goods, which very recently put up it's
first few stores in this area. I had never heard of
them before.

They keep a stock of one of these bikes, as far as I
can tell, in each store; there is no price tag on it,
and it's generally not obvious that it's even for sale.
It looks more like a display, they've usually got it
hanging on a bike rack they're selling, or something.

I asked how much, and found it was something like $325.
That's great, if it's any good; I'd rather pay $325 for
that than $600 for a bottom-of-the-barrel Trek that's
not any better. Luckily, I bought a nice Giant that I
love, instead (before Dick's showed up).

far as I am concerned, lose their right to LBS status by virtue of
selling status instead of bikes) often tend *not* to have a deep

I'll concede that some LBS's are not run well, and so
are almost as bad as department stores. At least you
can be sure you're getting a quality bike, usually
put together safely, even if you then have to fool
around with making it fit and changing the gearing...

--
Rick Onanian