Canada's most dangerous city for cyclists

On May 4, 12:33 pm, Radey Shouman wrote:
writes:
On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:02:09 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that
really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that
bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many
bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it
pleases tthem.

Yep. Two days ago, I was on a narrow-ish two lane street that I
frequently ride. One car was hanging back behind me, waiting for
oncoming traffic to clear, then began to go around just as a punk on a
mountain bike was heading right at me, riding facing traffic.

As we all passed, I said "What are you doing on the wrong side of the
road???" He immediately began yelling at me, claiming he knew what he
was doing, and that I was on the wrong side of the road.

Of _course_ he felt that he was really competent. They all do.

A few years ago, shortly after daylight savings time had passed, and a
little while after the sun had gone down, I was heading home down an
unlighted road. I had a nice front light, two rear lights, a bright
yellow jacket, reflectors, all that jazz. In the gloaming ahead I
managed to see a ninja-clad bike salmon, with no jazz at all.

I slowed a bit, because you never know which side they're going to want,
and we passed each other without injury. I said not a word, but he
shook his head sadly and said "Gotta ride slower in the winter time,
bro".


I was riding one morning on the narrow paved shoulder of a fairly
busy, high-speed road with deep, steep ditches. A guy on a bike with
no lights emerged out of the darkness coming at me head on.
"Expletive deleted!", I ejaculated as passed.

Trouble is he was out there day after day - I just could never know
precisely when or where.

However, I have had more trouble with non-human creatures doing
effectively the same thing (although most of thsoe are either smart
enough or lucky enough not to pop out when there are cars coming).

Oh, well. I judge such critters (even salmon) less harshly than
asshole cagers.

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?

- Frank Krygowski

On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:
On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?


Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.

How does this question bear on my learning?

C'mon, professor.

On May 4, 1:53 pm, Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?

Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.

How does this question bear on my learning?


A: I have had *far* more opportunity to know all the factors that
acually result in crashes, and *far* more experience with the actual
results than you have in your entire life.

Seems you have a lot to learn before you start presuming to know the
first thing about it.

C'mon, professor.

Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:53 pm, Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?

Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.

How does this question bear on my learning?


A: I have had *far* more opportunity to know all the factors that
acually result in crashes, and *far* more experience with the actual
results than you have in your entire life.

Seems you have a lot to learn before you start presuming to know the
first thing about it.

C'mon, professor.

After a week skiing the wife of my friend once said, 'I didn't crash this
week at all'. After ten years she still skis like a beginner.... On
beginners slopes.

--
Lou

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 2:51:50 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 2, 8:14 pm, wrote:

On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:02:09 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it pleases tthem.



Yep. Two days ago, I was on a narrow-ish two lane street that I frequently ride. One car was hanging back behind me, waiting for oncoming traffic to clear, then began to go around just as a punk on a mountain bike was heading right at me, riding facing traffic.



As we all passed, I said "What are you doing on the wrong side of the road???" He immediately began yelling at me, claiming he knew what he was doing, and that I was on the wrong side of the road.





That seems like a lot of dialog "as we... passed". I usually only

have time for, "expletive deleted!" - if that.



Moreover, how did it play out? Personally, when that happens to me

(and it does), I usually shoulder check to see if I can move out and

give this salmon the gutter; if not, I stay right and let him veer

into traffic (or more usually up onto the sidewalk).

I already knew I couldn't move over. I had been glancing at the car just behind in my mirror, and I heard him moving forward just as the punk passed me. Those few blocks have a curb, but no sidewalk.

And yes, we had time for more dialog, because when I yelled something back at him, he turned around and tried to catch up to me, yelling as he was riding, something like "What are you going to tell me??? Come on, tell me!!" aggressive as hell and apparently itching for a fight. I had been riding slow (especially because of the near-head-on conflict), but I raised my speed to stay just in front of him (which required only about 18 mph). He followed me, yelling, for about a city block. Muscular, heavily tattooed, sort of scrappy clothes, and loudly aggressive and obnoxious. A punk.





And this driver that was so reasonably "hanging back", waiting for a

good opportunity to pass: They suddenly decided to stuff it in there

at the worst possible juncture (?) (This sort of thing happens to me,

too, but it's inconsiderate cager idiocy, not solely the salmon's

fault.) Sounds like the cager wasn't hanging back to cooperatively

share the road with you; sounds more like he regarded you as "in his

way" and just waiting for oncoming traffic to clear so he could get

around your road hogging ass and the hell with those damned

bicyclists.

I don't recall quite as much about the motorist, but I had no problem with his behavior.

Let me guess? The salmon passed on your right - because you're no

"gutter bunny".

Correct. I'm not going to scrape the curb to avoid such a twerp. I've heard of other people forcing the salmon out into oncoming traffic, but I didn't do that.

- Frank Krygowski

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 4:53:02 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:



Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to



answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)



OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?





Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.



How does this question bear on my learning?



C'mon, professor.

I've had one in the last ten years, when the forks on our tandem failed catastrophically without warning. I've had two moving on-road falls in my life.

This provides some evidence of who is a competent rider and who's not.

- Frank Krygowski

On May 4, 1:53 pm, Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?

Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.


.... probably less than thrity, though - naybe less than twenty (that's
pretty iffy, though), including this day:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.b...95fb10aea46f08

snip

On May 4, 2:07 pm, wrote:
On Saturday, May 4, 2013 2:51:50 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 2, 8:14 pm, wrote:

On Thursday, May 2, 2013 9:02:09 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

Whilst the article is interesting it's the comments below it that really get me thinking. It's amazing how many people think that bicyclists do NOT belong on the roads. Also interesting how many bicyclists delight in flaunting the Rules of the Road whenever it pleases tthem.

Yep. Two days ago, I was on a narrow-ish two lane street that I frequently ride. One car was hanging back behind me, waiting for oncoming traffic to clear, then began to go around just as a punk on a mountain bike was heading right at me, riding facing traffic.

As we all passed, I said "What are you doing on the wrong side of the road???" He immediately began yelling at me, claiming he knew what he was doing, and that I was on the wrong side of the road.

That seems like a lot of dialog "as we... passed". I usually only

have time for, "expletive deleted!" - if that.

Moreover, how did it play out? Personally, when that happens to me

(and it does), I usually shoulder check to see if I can move out and

give this salmon the gutter; if not, I stay right and let him veer

into traffic (or more usually up onto the sidewalk).

I already knew I couldn't move over. I had been glancing at the car just behind in my mirror, and I heard him moving forward just as the punk passed me. Those few blocks have a curb, but no sidewalk.

And yes, we had time for more dialog, because when I yelled something back at him, he turned around and tried to catch up to me, yelling as he was riding, something like "What are you going to tell me??? Come on, tell me!!" aggressive as hell and apparently itching for a fight. I had been riding slow (especially because of the near-head-on conflict), but I raised my speed to stay just in front of him (which required only about 18 mph). He followed me, yelling, for about a city block. Muscular, heavily tattooed, sort of scrappy clothes, and loudly aggressive and obnoxious. A punk.


What, you mean *other* people react to your supercilious Hall Monitor
crap like I do? Ithought it was just me.





And this driver that was so reasonably "hanging back", waiting for a

good opportunity to pass: They suddenly decided to stuff it in there

at the worst possible juncture (?) (This sort of thing happens to me,

too, but it's inconsiderate cager idiocy, not solely the salmon's

fault.) Sounds like the cager wasn't hanging back to cooperatively

share the road with you; sounds more like he regarded you as "in his

way" and just waiting for oncoming traffic to clear so he could get

around your road hogging ass and the hell with those damned

bicyclists.

I don't recall quite as much about the motorist, but I had no problem with his behavior.


You mena he couldn't see the oncoming bicyclist and you and... and he
stuffed it in there at the worst possible moment?

Let me guess? The salmon passed on your right - because you're no

"gutter bunny".

Correct. I'm not going to scrape the curb to avoid such a twerp. I've heard of other people forcing the salmon out into oncoming traffic, but I didn't do that.


Well, it's not forcing (I don't *really* control them, and won't pinch
myself into the curb), but yeah I figured you for the type to "take
the lane" even with overtaking traffic.

On May 4, 2:11 pm, wrote:
On Saturday, May 4, 2013 4:53:02 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:
On May 4, 1:50 pm, wrote:

On Saturday, May 4, 2013 1:26:37 PM UTC-4, Dan O wrote:

Test me. Come on, ask me something. See if I know (I *promise* to

answer straight out of my head without looking *anything* up.)

OK. How many crashes have you had in the past ten years?

Hmm... more than ten, less than a hundred.

How does this question bear on my learning?

C'mon, professor.

I've had one in the last ten years, when the forks on our tandem failed catastrophically without warning. I've had two moving on-road falls in my life.

This provides some evidence of who is a competent rider and who's not.


In your rmind. But that's okay. The world *needs* all kinds to be
what it is.

I'm going to try and stop now. Peace out. Where have I been all
week? In a class (gasp). Mostly it's a lot of playing with the
pencils and listening to the "instructor" - noticing how he starts to
gloss over the stuff he doesn't really understand with "yada-yada-
yada". It was about computer intrusion prevention systems and network
firewalls - stuff that I have quite a sound fundamental understanding
of plus experience from kernel hacking to ipfilter in BSD and ipchains
in Slackware and... but this class was on the spiffy big bucks point-
and-click whiz bang thing most people need to do everything for them,
which my employer is springing for; and it's pretty cool stuff (man,
they really have to trust their IPS admin - even though they have no
idea how much).