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#11
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
Ryan Cousineau wrote: A compellingly simple idea. I'm pretty lazy, and the fact this would defeat my basic desire to quickly switch wheels between bikes (of course, I would usually be moving tires around regardless...) is a major point against. But I could put 1.25mm spacers on each side, and build 132.5mm wheels.... If you can find a frame with 132.5mm spacing you can use both 130mm and 135mm hubs without having to resort to spacers. Specialized does this with their Allez frames. I'm sure others do too. This is only likely to work well with all metal rear ends. i.e. no carbon stays. |
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#12
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
jim beam wrote:
Chalo wrote: Ryan Cousineau wrote: Any thoughtful opinions on the idea of squeezing (NOT cold-setting) these frames to fit 130mm OLN wheels? Any offers to sell me a 130mm vertical-dropout frame real cheap? I'll offer my not-particularly-thoughtful opinion that it's no big deal; that's not a lot of stress to impose on your frame (compared to riding it); and you should probably just go for it. i agree. i've also cold set an aluminum frame with no apparent ill effects. Ever done a Cannondale? I just bought an '86 that I figured I'd just spread to get the wheel in -- impossible (or I'm getting really weak). Looks like it's a cold set or make it a fixer. |
#13
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
jim beam wrote: Chalo wrote: Ryan Cousineau wrote: Any thoughtful opinions on the idea of squeezing (NOT cold-setting) these frames to fit 130mm OLN wheels? Any offers to sell me a 130mm vertical-dropout frame real cheap? I'll offer my not-particularly-thoughtful opinion that it's no big deal; that's not a lot of stress to impose on your frame (compared to riding it); and you should probably just go for it. i agree. i've also cold set an aluminum frame with no apparent ill effects. I rode aluminum frames sprung open (not cold set) from 126mm to 135mm for years with no apparent ill effects. They eventually cracked, but not at the chainstays or dropouts. Chalo I'd appreciate if you could share exactly how you were able to cold set the rear triangle of aluminum frame. If you can outline the tools and procedure used, and in particular, the make of the frame (and the alloy 6xxx or 7xxx, if known), that would be great. Thanks! |
#14
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
damyth wrote:
jim beam wrote: Chalo wrote: Ryan Cousineau wrote: Any thoughtful opinions on the idea of squeezing (NOT cold-setting) these frames to fit 130mm OLN wheels? Any offers to sell me a 130mm vertical-dropout frame real cheap? I'll offer my not-particularly-thoughtful opinion that it's no big deal; that's not a lot of stress to impose on your frame (compared to riding it); and you should probably just go for it. i agree. i've also cold set an aluminum frame with no apparent ill effects. I rode aluminum frames sprung open (not cold set) from 126mm to 135mm for years with no apparent ill effects. They eventually cracked, but not at the chainstays or dropouts. Chalo I'd appreciate if you could share exactly how you were able to cold set the rear triangle of aluminum frame. If you can outline the tools and procedure used, and in particular, the make of the frame (and the alloy 6xxx or 7xxx, if known), that would be great. Thanks! i used a plank of wood across the axle end of the triangle and "bounced" it into position with a 4lb lump hammer. crude, and you have to be careful to not over-do it, but it seems to have worked ok. i started with the sheldon brown method, but was afraid of taking it too far. |
#15
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
jim beam wrote:
damyth wrote: jim beam wrote: Chalo wrote: Ryan Cousineau wrote: Any thoughtful opinions on the idea of squeezing (NOT cold-setting) these frames to fit 130mm OLN wheels? Any offers to sell me a 130mm vertical-dropout frame real cheap? I'll offer my not-particularly-thoughtful opinion that it's no big deal; that's not a lot of stress to impose on your frame (compared to riding it); and you should probably just go for it. i agree. i've also cold set an aluminum frame with no apparent ill effects. I rode aluminum frames sprung open (not cold set) from 126mm to 135mm for years with no apparent ill effects. They eventually cracked, but not at the chainstays or dropouts. Chalo I'd appreciate if you could share exactly how you were able to cold set the rear triangle of aluminum frame. If you can outline the tools and procedure used, and in particular, the make of the frame (and the alloy 6xxx or 7xxx, if known), that would be great. Thanks! i used a plank of wood across the axle end of the triangle and "bounced" it into position with a 4lb lump hammer. crude, and you have to be careful to not over-do it, but it seems to have worked ok. i started with the sheldon brown method, but was afraid of taking it too far. whoops, forgot, it's allegedly 7005. cheapo nashbar. |
#16
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
Ryan Cousineau wrote:
So here I am, with a bit of a dilemma: I want, for no very good reason (okay, vertical dropouts) to upgrade from my current very funny CX bike (Japanese-made early-80s Canadian "Bianchi") to something cheap. I don't need any parts, so a frame-upgrading we go. The other part of this is I want to be able to use the same wheels as I use all summer on my road bike, so 130mm spacing is a must. cannondale optimo 9? i've been considering one. Many of the cheap frames with vertical dropouts are aluminum*, and a surprising number are 135mm (mountain bike) spaced. Great, I suppose, for the 29er crowd, not so great for me. Planet X Bikes explicitly says their frame can be squeezed to 130mm: http://www.planet-x-bikes.com/road/i...ter&PAGE_user_ op=view_page&PAGE_id=158 Nashbar and NYCBikes are silent on the issue. Any thoughtful opinions on the idea of squeezing (NOT cold-setting) these frames to fit 130mm OLN wheels? Any offers to sell me a 130mm vertical-dropout frame real cheap? Thanks, *please don't let this thread turn into a metal/alloy/whatever flamewar. These frames are all pretty much 6061 or 7005 Al-plus-something alloys, but it's not like mainstream "Aluminum" bikes of the last 15 years have been made of anything else; I don't even think you can find oddball glued frames except the Vitus 997 and one or two other freaks. |
#17
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
damyth wrote: jim beam wrote: i agree. i've also cold set an aluminum frame with no apparent ill effects. I'd appreciate if you could share exactly how you were able to cold set the rear triangle of aluminum frame. If you can outline the tools and procedure used, and in particular, the make of the frame (and the alloy 6xxx or 7xxx, if known), that would be great. Aluminum is just metal, and the mild alloys (e.g. 6061, 7005) used in most aluminum bike frames are even reasonably ductile. The main reason to refrain from small amounts of cold setting is that the stays of some aluminum bikes are very stiff due to their large diameter, and that a high amount of force may be required to accomplish the permanent set is difficult to control precisely. It's also difficult to anchor a frame against high amounts of bending force without subjecting it to the risk of dents or crimps elsewhere on the frame (where it is being held). Chalo |
#18
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
Chalo wrote: Aluminum is just metal, and the mild alloys (e.g. 6061, 7005) used in most aluminum bike frames are even reasonably ductile. The main reason to refrain from small amounts of cold setting is that the stays of some aluminum bikes are very stiff due to their large diameter... Speaking of large diameter Cannondale chainstays: When my family and I rode coast to coast a few years ago, I started with nominal 37 mm tires (actual width, closer to 32mm) on my C'dale touring bike, since part of our planned route was off-road, on the C&O trail. They fit fine at the seat stays, but barely cleared the chainstays, which had between 36 & 37 mm clearance. Still, I started the ride with those tires. Oddly enough, the tires grew; after a couple weeks, they'd expanded to where they scraped the chainstays. I didn't know tires would grow. I switched to nominal 32 mm tires for the rest of the trip... But I wondered, has anyone tried crushing the inside surface of those stays to gain clearance for a tire size? The 6061 aluminum has a ductility of about 17%, which isn't bad, but I was afraid to try it. Much later in the ride, we were hosted by a guy who had ridden a similar Cannondale on a very long tour, but his involved lots of dirt & gravel roads of some sort. He showed me the frame. Abrasion from mud and stones had literally worn holes in the chainstays at the spots I'd thought about crushing! He had no problems riding the bike even with the holes. Seems like you don't need a lot of strength in that area. So, has anyone taken a vise to Cannondale chainstays? - Frank Krygowski |
#19
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Al frames: "squeeze spacing" okay?
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