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Driverless cars



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 1st 18, 08:32 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
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Posts: 200
Default Driverless cars


The news today has an article stating that Waymo, the robotic car
company created by Google is poised to attempt a major technological
leap in California, where its vehicles will hit the roads without a
human on hand to take control in emergencies.

"The regulatory approval announced on Tuesday allows Waymo's
driverless cars to cruise through California at speeds up to 104.6
kilometers per hour". Or about 65 MPH.

See
https://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/new...s-to-hit-roads

The article goes on to say that "Waymo's cars with safety drivers have
been involved in dozens of accidents in California, but those have
mostly been minor fender benders at low speeds."

cheers,

John B.



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  #2  
Old November 1st 18, 01:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Emanuel Berg[_3_]
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Posts: 16
Default Driverless cars

John B. slocomb wrote:

The news today has an article stating that
Waymo, the robotic car company created by
Google is poised to attempt a major
technological leap in California, where its
vehicles will hit the roads without a human
on hand to take control in emergencies.

"The regulatory approval announced on Tuesday
allows Waymo's driverless cars to cruise
through California at speeds up to 104.6
kilometers per hour". Or about 65 MPH.

See
https://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/new...s-to-hit-roads

The article goes on to say that "Waymo's cars
with safety drivers have been involved in
dozens of accidents in California, but those
have mostly been minor fender benders at
low speeds."


I suppose riderless bikes is the next step

--
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
  #3  
Old November 1st 18, 03:18 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 334
Default Driverless cars

On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 12:32:18 AM UTC-7, John B. slocomb wrote:
The news today has an article stating that Waymo, the robotic car
company created by Google is poised to attempt a major technological
leap in California, where its vehicles will hit the roads without a
human on hand to take control in emergencies.

"The regulatory approval announced on Tuesday allows Waymo's
driverless cars to cruise through California at speeds up to 104.6
kilometers per hour". Or about 65 MPH.

See
https://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/new...s-to-hit-roads

The article goes on to say that "Waymo's cars with safety drivers have
been involved in dozens of accidents in California, but those have
mostly been minor fender benders at low speeds."

cheers,

John B.


As I've written here before - self driving cars do not have the ability to EXPECT problems and take them into account. So if they are to be safe they have to be programmed to be too safe and they must drive slowly. If they are driving at 65 mph it won't be long before the company is sued out of business. Tesla has just been sued yet again for their "autopilot". The owner said that he only used that function so that he would not have to pay 100% attention to the road. Tesla claims that you are supposed to be in control of the vehicle all of the time but that is NOT going to make it passed a jury since "autopilot" has connotations of NOT having to pay attention 100% of the time.
  #4  
Old November 1st 18, 04:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 5,553
Default Driverless cars

On 2018-11-01 07:18, wrote:
On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 12:32:18 AM UTC-7, John B. slocomb
wrote:
The news today has an article stating that Waymo, the robotic car
company created by Google is poised to attempt a major
technological leap in California, where its vehicles will hit the
roads without a human on hand to take control in emergencies.

"The regulatory approval announced on Tuesday allows Waymo's
driverless cars to cruise through California at speeds up to 104.6
kilometers per hour". Or about 65 MPH.

See
https://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/new...s-to-hit-roads



The article goes on to say that "Waymo's cars with safety drivers have
been involved in dozens of accidents in California, but those have
mostly been minor fender benders at low speeds."



A fender bender at low speed can result in serious injury if the other
vehicle is a bicycle.


cheers,

John B.


As I've written here before - self driving cars do not have the
ability to EXPECT problems and take them into account.



That can become the main problem for cyclists who also make mistakes.
I've had that about 20 years ago here in town. Major thoroughfare, well
after dark, some fast movements behind the bushes in a side road didn't
feel right. Maybe a deer? So my foot was already over the brake pedal
and my car was slowing down. That was the "Expect" phase which is likely
going to be completely missing in an autonomous vehicle. Sure enough a
guy on a dark road bike, dark jersey, dark helmet and without any light
shot across the main road. I braked, swerved over the double yellow
using the oncoming lane where traffic was far enough away and barely
missed his rear wheel. I don't think a driverless vehicle could have
avoided a collision.

Then there are the situations with cars. Like on a freeway when several
cars before me someone made a less than professional attempt to change
lanes and I thought "This might not end well". It didn't. I came to a
full stop before barreling into the result but the driver behind me
didn't and left onto the median. Even his maneuver (which I thought was
brilliant because he kept his car stable) would likely not have been
done by a driverless car because it can't gauge the condition of the
vegetation on the median or remember it from previous trips (the driver
was a daily commuter on that section).

Remembrance is also a big part, like knowing "Oh, that corner over there
often ices up a bit in this weather so let's slow down". Or one road in
town where I know that, for whatever reason, drivers coming out of a
parking lot often fail to look left again and just pull out. Or the
neighbor's kid that I saw behind bushes and then it ran into the road. I
had started to brake hard before it even was there and because such
things can be anticipated in this 25mph street I never go much above
15mph there, not even on a bike. A driverless car can't make heads or
tails of a soccer game going on in a yard. We can.


So if they are
to be safe they have to be programmed to be too safe and they must
drive slowly. If they are driving at 65 mph it won't be long before
the company is sued out of business. Tesla has just been sued yet
again for their "autopilot". The owner said that he only used that
function so that he would not have to pay 100% attention to the road.
Tesla claims that you are supposed to be in control of the vehicle
all of the time but that is NOT going to make it passed a jury since
"autopilot" has connotations of NOT having to pay attention 100% of
the time.


"But your honor, the owners manual clearly says not to ...". Now they
even call it "Enhanced Autopilot". Don't they have lawyers who guide
them in what to say publicly and what not to say?

https://www.tesla.com/support/enhanced-autopilot-trial


Then there are episodes such as a driverless car not recognizing a red
light.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ve_iOblltWo

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/dr...uns-red-light/

Quote "It came out a few months later by way of a report from the New
York Times that although Uber had said this traffic violation was due to
"human error," the vehicle was, in fact, driving itself at the time of
the incident. The newspaper spoke to two anonymous employees and viewed
internal company documents which stated that Uber’s mapping program
failed to recognize not one, but six traffic lights in San Francisco".

Any system that too heavily relies on mapping methods is IMO inherently
unsafe. If there truly was an attempt by the company to cover it up, as
alleged above, that isn't helpful.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 




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