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  #11  
Old November 2nd 18, 08:45 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 200
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 20:04:26 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 7:54:46 PM UTC-7, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html



It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html


What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.

Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.


I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick. Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


There is no justification, but that does not excuse assault. It is questionable

whether you could even effect a citizen's arrest for minor property
damage. The most reasonable approach would be to photograph or maybe
follow to an address. I really don't know, but running the guy down
is clearly not acceptable.

-- Jay Beattie.


I suppose that my attitude is largely influenced by living in a
foreign country for so many years, but the several thousand dollars I
mentioned - say two thousand - is not "minor property damage" here.
Using the legal minimum salary here, that is about 7 month's wages for
a working man.

(In Australia, where the event took place, US$2,000 amounts to about a
month's pay for a working man.)
cheers,

John B.



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  #12  
Old November 2nd 18, 10:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,378
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html




It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html



What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.


Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.


I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick. Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?

cheers,

John B.





Maybe you doored him two blocks before. Or maybe he’s a nutcase and
generally likes keying cars.

--
duane
  #13  
Old November 2nd 18, 11:47 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
James[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,771
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On 2/11/18 8:52 pm, Duane wrote:


Maybe you doored him two blocks before. Or maybe he’s a nutcase and
generally likes keying cars.


The rider is apparently studying mathematics. Nutcase then ;-)

--
JS
  #14  
Old November 2nd 18, 01:38 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,779
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On 11/1/2018 9:54 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html



It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html


What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle. I have been in contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk. Hmm.


Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.


I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick. Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


Uh, texting while drifting into my lane for starts.



--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #15  
Old November 2nd 18, 03:58 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,339
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On 11/2/2018 8:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 11/1/2018 9:54 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html




It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html



What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in
contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.

Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.


I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick.* Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


Uh, texting while drifting into my lane for starts.


One guy I knew back in the 1960s or 1970s was riding his 250cc
motorcycle in traffic and had a motorist tailgating him mercilessly and
aggressively. They ended up side by side at a red light shouting at each
other. The guy on the motorcycle kicked the driver's door then took off
and got away.

I suspect something similar must have happened with the cyclist and
driver. I think avid bicyclists (judging by his bike) essentially never
deliberately damage cars for no reason.

One book on my shelf is Dave Glowacz's _Urban Bikers' Tricks & Tips_. He
has a couple pages about serious conflicts with motorists. One
illustration there shows a particular spot on a windshield, midway up
and about 1/4 way across. He warns that if you "accidentally" hit that
spot with your fist or your U-lock, you might crack the windshield.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #16  
Old November 2nd 18, 11:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 200
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 10:58:56 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/2/2018 8:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 11/1/2018 9:54 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html




It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html



What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in
contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.

Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.

I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick.* Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?


Uh, texting while drifting into my lane for starts.


One guy I knew back in the 1960s or 1970s was riding his 250cc
motorcycle in traffic and had a motorist tailgating him mercilessly and
aggressively. They ended up side by side at a red light shouting at each
other. The guy on the motorcycle kicked the driver's door then took off
and got away.

I suspect something similar must have happened with the cyclist and
driver. I think avid bicyclists (judging by his bike) essentially never
deliberately damage cars for no reason.

One book on my shelf is Dave Glowacz's _Urban Bikers' Tricks & Tips_. He
has a couple pages about serious conflicts with motorists. One
illustration there shows a particular spot on a windshield, midway up
and about 1/4 way across. He warns that if you "accidentally" hit that
spot with your fist or your U-lock, you might crack the windshield.


Or, in other words, it is all right to be a "horses ass" if the other
guy is a "horses ass" :-)
cheers,

John B.



  #17  
Old November 3rd 18, 12:38 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,339
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On 11/2/2018 6:19 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 10:58:56 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/2/2018 8:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 11/1/2018 9:54 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html




It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html



What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in
contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.

Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.

I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick.* Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?

What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?

Uh, texting while drifting into my lane for starts.


One guy I knew back in the 1960s or 1970s was riding his 250cc
motorcycle in traffic and had a motorist tailgating him mercilessly and
aggressively. They ended up side by side at a red light shouting at each
other. The guy on the motorcycle kicked the driver's door then took off
and got away.

I suspect something similar must have happened with the cyclist and
driver. I think avid bicyclists (judging by his bike) essentially never
deliberately damage cars for no reason.

One book on my shelf is Dave Glowacz's _Urban Bikers' Tricks & Tips_. He
has a couple pages about serious conflicts with motorists. One
illustration there shows a particular spot on a windshield, midway up
and about 1/4 way across. He warns that if you "accidentally" hit that
spot with your fist or your U-lock, you might crack the windshield.


Or, in other words, it is all right to be a "horses ass" if the other
guy is a "horses ass" :-)


That's a conundrum. It seems wiser to rise above it all and maintain
dignity but...

Without going into ugly and complicated detail, there's a sort of small
scale power struggle going on locally over an institution we care deeply
about. The main guy on the other side is an arrogant, obnoxious bully
and con man. He's been insulting and condescending to those who oppose
him, and Machiavellian in his scheming.

Trouble is, he's winning. I know at least three good people who have
abandoned positions on boards, committees, etc. largely because they
can't stand to be in the same room with him. I've known members of the
public who have walked out of meetings for the same reason. The result
has been fewer votes against his power grabbing.

Seems we need someone willing to be a "horse's ass" as necessary to give
him his own medicine.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #18  
Old November 3rd 18, 01:54 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 200
Default bicycle lane in Melbourne

On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 19:38:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/2/2018 6:19 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 10:58:56 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/2/2018 8:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 11/1/2018 9:54 PM, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 22:01:30 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 11/1/2018 5:44 PM, James wrote:
On 30/10/18 9:27 am, AMuzi wrote:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ke-bushes.html




It has emerged that the bike rider had keyed the vehicle before this
incident.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ent-viral.html



What hasn't emerged is why he keyed the vehicle.* I have been in
contact
with the person who broke the story, and apparently the cyclist is no
longer willing to talk.* Hmm.

Yes, we don't know why he keyed the vehicle; and I don't think that act
is usually unprovoked. In any case, it doesn't justify an attack with a
deadly weapon.

Damaging a person's car is not the same as damaging his body. But one
weird psychological side effect of motoring is that many people react
the same way. I've seen guys get enraged when someone leaned on their
car, as they would if someone grabbed their neck.

I certainly understand what you are saying but we just bought a new
car - some $27,000 in U.S. money - and if some nitwit on a bicycle
were to carve a groove down the side of the new car I might not run
his bike off the road with the car but I'd be tempted, probably beyond
my ability to resist, to hit him with a stick.* Just to test the
effectiveness of his helmet, so to speak.

Depending on the severely of the "keying" it can cost several thousand
dollars (here, in a decent shop) to return the car to its like new
condition. What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?

What justifies a cyclist doing that sort of damage to my
new car?

Uh, texting while drifting into my lane for starts.

One guy I knew back in the 1960s or 1970s was riding his 250cc
motorcycle in traffic and had a motorist tailgating him mercilessly and
aggressively. They ended up side by side at a red light shouting at each
other. The guy on the motorcycle kicked the driver's door then took off
and got away.

I suspect something similar must have happened with the cyclist and
driver. I think avid bicyclists (judging by his bike) essentially never
deliberately damage cars for no reason.

One book on my shelf is Dave Glowacz's _Urban Bikers' Tricks & Tips_. He
has a couple pages about serious conflicts with motorists. One
illustration there shows a particular spot on a windshield, midway up
and about 1/4 way across. He warns that if you "accidentally" hit that
spot with your fist or your U-lock, you might crack the windshield.


Or, in other words, it is all right to be a "horses ass" if the other
guy is a "horses ass" :-)


That's a conundrum. It seems wiser to rise above it all and maintain
dignity but...

Without going into ugly and complicated detail, there's a sort of small
scale power struggle going on locally over an institution we care deeply
about. The main guy on the other side is an arrogant, obnoxious bully
and con man. He's been insulting and condescending to those who oppose
him, and Machiavellian in his scheming.

Trouble is, he's winning. I know at least three good people who have
abandoned positions on boards, committees, etc. largely because they
can't stand to be in the same room with him. I've known members of the
public who have walked out of meetings for the same reason. The result
has been fewer votes against his power grabbing.

Seems we need someone willing to be a "horse's ass" as necessary to give
him his own medicine.


Well, it works :-)

Back when I was in grade school my mother ran to be elected to the
school board - I guess she figured that if HER kids were in school
SHE'd better be in a position to manage things.

Well, she was elected and she did get her way... From having lived
with her for a lot of years I know that she was never "insulting and
condescending" just "set in her ways" and "never gave up the fight",
so to speak.

In thinking back I don't believe my mother ever referred to my father
directly, it was always in the 3rd person, "Your Father says", or
"Your Father wants" and in really bad times, "Just wait 'till your
Father gets home".
cheers,

John B.



 




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