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GPS Units = Show road steepness?



 
 
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  #21  
Old March 11th 19, 08:51 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Zen Cycle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 91
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:28:58 PM UTC-4, Radey Shouman wrote:
Zen Cycle writes:

On Sunday, March 10, 2019 at 6:35:02 PM UTC-4, Roger Merriman wrote:
Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Talking about GPS units on another thread reminded me of something else I
wondered if they do. Does a bicycle GPS unit show you the steepness of
roads? There's an area that I frequently ride where on road has short but
very steep hills, another road a mile or so east of it has much more
gradual hills whilst a third road to the west of the first one is a major
highway that can be ridden with a bicycle. What I'm wondering is this: if
someone unfamiliar with the area got there and used a GPS unit to show
those three roads, would the GPS unit show them the different gradients
of the roads? Or is that another function that they'd need to download or
otherwise install?

Cheers


Various mapping sites will show the gradient, and some GPS units will show
the gradient, in the same way that it can give improbable maximum speeds
they can also give improbable max gradients or sometimes on very short
ramps not notice it, there is a nasty little ramp nr my folks place, which
is the software flattens claiming 12% when it’s a fair cruel 25/30% even
more cruel this weekend with a 50mph headwind.


It's probably an averaging issue - taking enough samples before and
after the section so that it flattens the pitch.


It's the same basic issue as the speedometer kerfluffle. Numerical
differentiation amplifies noise.


Interesting how you characterize it as 'noise'.
Ads
  #23  
Old March 11th 19, 10:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,341
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On 3/11/2019 3:23 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 11:09:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:18:06 PM UTC+1, duane wrote:
On 11/03/2019 9:24 a.m., wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:52:23 AM UTC+1, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 20:01:13 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/10/2019 6:29 PM,
wrote:

GPS can show the actual gradient but it uses some sort of averaging algorithm which means it has a delay. This makes it pretty useless IMO. Besides this what are you gonna do if you know the exact gradient at that moment? GPS can tell you exactly were you are. For navigation you need a routable map and navigation software. Often people have a too high expectations of a GPS based cycling computer and end up never using the navigation capability and just have an expensive cycling computer or head unit as they are called now because speed sensors, cadence sensors, power meters, radar, lights, action camera's, HRM and your phone all connect to the unit and show their information on the head unit or can be operated using the head unit.

What?? No television??

The Electric Bike Worldwide Report predicts that the electric bike
industry is poised to grow to 2 billion by 2050. Eventually 84 million
e-bikes could be sold each year.

One can envision a day when bicycles will be totally enclosed and
equipped with air conditioning and stereophonic sound :-)

One can only assume that once the electric bike is established riding
a bicycle will equate with the exercise value of sitting in front of
the T.V.


--
Cheers,
John B.

40% of the bike sales last year in The Netherlands was an electric assisted bike. Get used to it.


A riding buddy of mine got his wife an e-bike last year. She used to
complain about his spending time on his bike. Now she's the one pushing
to ride. I'm not ready for one but I wouldn't necessarily equate an
e-bike with sitting in front of the T.V.


It is certainly not the same as sitting in front of the TV. You may make fun of it but the introduction of the E bike gave cycling an enormous boost in the last 5 years even here in The Netherlands. That is a good thing. Bike sales are way up.

Lou


I hate people on eBikes. But then again, I hate people on regular bikes. Traffic is traffic. With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.

-- Jay Beattie.


+1.
Just wait for eBikes with 'autonomous navigation' a.k.a.
'killer robots'.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #24  
Old March 11th 19, 10:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,159
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers.. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.


That same point has been made elsewhere by John Schubert,
who's a pretty notable bike expert. As he explained, it
usually takes quite a lot of riding to get fast on a bike.
During that time, you tend to learn from your mistakes,
if nothing else, and most of those mistakes happen at
low speed.

Now you can get fast on a bike by buying or renting one
with an electric motor. You get to make all your
beginner mistakes at 18 mph. Whee!

A similar situation happens with motorcycles. And the
terrible safety stats for motorcycles are dominated by
beginners.

- Frank Krygowski
  #25  
Old March 11th 19, 11:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 805
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 13:56:42 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 11:09:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:18:06 PM UTC+1, duane wrote:
On 11/03/2019 9:24 a.m., wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:52:23 AM UTC+1, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 20:01:13 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/10/2019 6:29 PM,
wrote:

GPS can show the actual gradient but it uses some sort of averaging algorithm which means it has a delay. This makes it pretty useless IMO. Besides this what are you gonna do if you know the exact gradient at that moment? GPS can tell you exactly were you are. For navigation you need a routable map and navigation software. Often people have a too high expectations of a GPS based cycling computer and end up never using the navigation capability and just have an expensive cycling computer or head unit as they are called now because speed sensors, cadence sensors, power meters, radar, lights, action camera's, HRM and your phone all connect to the unit and show their information on the head unit or can be operated using the head unit.

What?? No television??

The Electric Bike Worldwide Report predicts that the electric bike
industry is poised to grow to 2 billion by 2050. Eventually 84 million
e-bikes could be sold each year.

One can envision a day when bicycles will be totally enclosed and
equipped with air conditioning and stereophonic sound :-)

One can only assume that once the electric bike is established riding
a bicycle will equate with the exercise value of sitting in front of
the T.V.


--
Cheers,
John B.

40% of the bike sales last year in The Netherlands was an electric assisted bike. Get used to it.


A riding buddy of mine got his wife an e-bike last year. She used to
complain about his spending time on his bike. Now she's the one pushing
to ride. I'm not ready for one but I wouldn't necessarily equate an
e-bike with sitting in front of the T.V.

It is certainly not the same as sitting in front of the TV. You may make fun of it but the introduction of the E bike gave cycling an enormous boost in the last 5 years even here in The Netherlands. That is a good thing. Bike sales are way up.

Lou


I hate people on eBikes. But then again, I hate people on regular bikes. Traffic is traffic. With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.

-- Jay Beattie.


I just LOVE those ebikers who zoom up and pass you on the right

just as you're moving to the right. There's a intersection here in
town that's like a shallow with the right hand lane going onto
another street and that lane is right hand only no through traffic. So
many times I've nearly been hit as I continued along the straight
through lane and then begun to move to my right to allow the big
trucks room. That's because some idiot ebiker (and sometimes a regular
bicyclist) continues straight instead of following the right hand lane
onto the other road like they're supposed to. Being passed on the
right is NOT something you normally expect to happen on the road or
trail yet a large n umber of ebikers I've seen do precisely that.
That's not to mention other illegal and dangerous behaviours I see
them do on the roads. I often wonder if eventually ebikes will require
a license in order to operate? Like you said a fast unskilled rider on
an ebike can be a hazard to everyone else in
their vicinity.

Cheers



Singapore requires e-bikes to be registered and carry a registration
plate and imposes a speed limit which is enforced, the penalty is a
$1,000 fine and/or a three month jail sentence. The speed limit is
10kph on foot paths and 25kph on "shared paths".

--
Cheers,
John B.


  #26  
Old March 12th 19, 12:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,226
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 7:32:42 PM UTC-4, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 13:56:42 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 11:09:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:18:06 PM UTC+1, duane wrote:
On 11/03/2019 9:24 a.m., wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:52:23 AM UTC+1, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 20:01:13 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/10/2019 6:29 PM,
wrote:

GPS can show the actual gradient but it uses some sort of averaging algorithm which means it has a delay. This makes it pretty useless IMO. Besides this what are you gonna do if you know the exact gradient at that moment? GPS can tell you exactly were you are. For navigation you need a routable map and navigation software. Often people have a too high expectations of a GPS based cycling computer and end up never using the navigation capability and just have an expensive cycling computer or head unit as they are called now because speed sensors, cadence sensors, power meters, radar, lights, action camera's, HRM and your phone all connect to the unit and show their information on the head unit or can be operated using the head unit.

What?? No television??

The Electric Bike Worldwide Report predicts that the electric bike
industry is poised to grow to 2 billion by 2050. Eventually 84 million
e-bikes could be sold each year.

One can envision a day when bicycles will be totally enclosed and
equipped with air conditioning and stereophonic sound :-)

One can only assume that once the electric bike is established riding
a bicycle will equate with the exercise value of sitting in front of
the T.V.


--
Cheers,
John B.

40% of the bike sales last year in The Netherlands was an electric assisted bike. Get used to it.


A riding buddy of mine got his wife an e-bike last year. She used to
complain about his spending time on his bike. Now she's the one pushing
to ride. I'm not ready for one but I wouldn't necessarily equate an
e-bike with sitting in front of the T.V.

It is certainly not the same as sitting in front of the TV. You may make fun of it but the introduction of the E bike gave cycling an enormous boost in the last 5 years even here in The Netherlands. That is a good thing. Bike sales are way up.

Lou

I hate people on eBikes. But then again, I hate people on regular bikes. Traffic is traffic. With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.

-- Jay Beattie.


I just LOVE those ebikers who zoom up and pass you on the right

just as you're moving to the right. There's a intersection here in
town that's like a shallow with the right hand lane going onto
another street and that lane is right hand only no through traffic. So
many times I've nearly been hit as I continued along the straight
through lane and then begun to move to my right to allow the big
trucks room. That's because some idiot ebiker (and sometimes a regular
bicyclist) continues straight instead of following the right hand lane
onto the other road like they're supposed to. Being passed on the
right is NOT something you normally expect to happen on the road or
trail yet a large n umber of ebikers I've seen do precisely that.
That's not to mention other illegal and dangerous behaviours I see
them do on the roads. I often wonder if eventually ebikes will require
a license in order to operate? Like you said a fast unskilled rider on
an ebike can be a hazard to everyone else in
their vicinity.

Cheers



Singapore requires e-bikes to be registered and carry a registration
plate and imposes a speed limit which is enforced, the penalty is a
$1,000 fine and/or a three month jail sentence. The speed limit is
10kph on foot paths and 25kph on "shared paths".

--
Cheers,
John B.


Sounds like what we are going to need here. How about bicycles? Do those require registration too?

Cheers
  #27  
Old March 12th 19, 12:37 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 805
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 17:07:44 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 7:32:42 PM UTC-4, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 13:56:42 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 11:09:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:18:06 PM UTC+1, duane wrote:
On 11/03/2019 9:24 a.m., wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:52:23 AM UTC+1, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 20:01:13 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/10/2019 6:29 PM,
wrote:

GPS can show the actual gradient but it uses some sort of averaging algorithm which means it has a delay. This makes it pretty useless IMO. Besides this what are you gonna do if you know the exact gradient at that moment? GPS can tell you exactly were you are. For navigation you need a routable map and navigation software. Often people have a too high expectations of a GPS based cycling computer and end up never using the navigation capability and just have an expensive cycling computer or head unit as they are called now because speed sensors, cadence sensors, power meters, radar, lights, action camera's, HRM and your phone all connect to the unit and show their information on the head unit or can be operated using the head unit.

What?? No television??

The Electric Bike Worldwide Report predicts that the electric bike
industry is poised to grow to 2 billion by 2050. Eventually 84 million
e-bikes could be sold each year.

One can envision a day when bicycles will be totally enclosed and
equipped with air conditioning and stereophonic sound :-)

One can only assume that once the electric bike is established riding
a bicycle will equate with the exercise value of sitting in front of
the T.V.


--
Cheers,
John B.

40% of the bike sales last year in The Netherlands was an electric assisted bike. Get used to it.


A riding buddy of mine got his wife an e-bike last year. She used to
complain about his spending time on his bike. Now she's the one pushing
to ride. I'm not ready for one but I wouldn't necessarily equate an
e-bike with sitting in front of the T.V.

It is certainly not the same as sitting in front of the TV. You may make fun of it but the introduction of the E bike gave cycling an enormous boost in the last 5 years even here in The Netherlands. That is a good thing. Bike sales are way up.

Lou

I hate people on eBikes. But then again, I hate people on regular bikes. Traffic is traffic. With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.

-- Jay Beattie.

I just LOVE those ebikers who zoom up and pass you on the right

just as you're moving to the right. There's a intersection here in
town that's like a shallow with the right hand lane going onto
another street and that lane is right hand only no through traffic. So
many times I've nearly been hit as I continued along the straight
through lane and then begun to move to my right to allow the big
trucks room. That's because some idiot ebiker (and sometimes a regular
bicyclist) continues straight instead of following the right hand lane
onto the other road like they're supposed to. Being passed on the
right is NOT something you normally expect to happen on the road or
trail yet a large n umber of ebikers I've seen do precisely that.
That's not to mention other illegal and dangerous behaviours I see
them do on the roads. I often wonder if eventually ebikes will require
a license in order to operate? Like you said a fast unskilled rider on
an ebike can be a hazard to everyone else in
their vicinity.

Cheers



Singapore requires e-bikes to be registered and carry a registration
plate and imposes a speed limit which is enforced, the penalty is a
$1,000 fine and/or a three month jail sentence. The speed limit is
10kph on foot paths and 25kph on "shared paths".

--
Cheers,
John B.


Sounds like what we are going to need here. How about bicycles? Do those require registration too?

Cheers


As far as I know human powered bicycles do not require registration
but there are rules and regulations. For example: Wear a helmet when
cycling on roads, obey all traffic signals and travel in the same
direction as the traffic flow, cycle in a single file on single lane
roads, turn on a white front light and a red rear light in the dark.
Note that the penalty for failing to follow these rules is a $1,000
fine and/or a three month prison sentence.

There are a bunch of other rules, like giving hand signals and only
carrying a maximum of one other person and so on.

They also have a law that states that the use of "a mobile telephone
and any hand-held device which is designed or capable of being used
for a communicative function" while the vehicle is moving is subject
to a penalty of a $1,000 fine and/or a six month prison sentence.

And more to the point, they do enforce these rules.

--
Cheers,
John B.


  #28  
Old March 12th 19, 12:55 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 805
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

On Tue, 12 Mar 2019 07:37:30 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 17:07:44 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 7:32:42 PM UTC-4, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 13:56:42 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 11:09:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 3:18:06 PM UTC+1, duane wrote:
On 11/03/2019 9:24 a.m., wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:52:23 AM UTC+1, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 20:01:13 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 3/10/2019 6:29 PM,
wrote:

GPS can show the actual gradient but it uses some sort of averaging algorithm which means it has a delay. This makes it pretty useless IMO. Besides this what are you gonna do if you know the exact gradient at that moment? GPS can tell you exactly were you are. For navigation you need a routable map and navigation software. Often people have a too high expectations of a GPS based cycling computer and end up never using the navigation capability and just have an expensive cycling computer or head unit as they are called now because speed sensors, cadence sensors, power meters, radar, lights, action camera's, HRM and your phone all connect to the unit and show their information on the head unit or can be operated using the head unit.

What?? No television??

The Electric Bike Worldwide Report predicts that the electric bike
industry is poised to grow to 2 billion by 2050. Eventually 84 million
e-bikes could be sold each year.

One can envision a day when bicycles will be totally enclosed and
equipped with air conditioning and stereophonic sound :-)

One can only assume that once the electric bike is established riding
a bicycle will equate with the exercise value of sitting in front of
the T.V.


--
Cheers,
John B.

40% of the bike sales last year in The Netherlands was an electric assisted bike. Get used to it.


A riding buddy of mine got his wife an e-bike last year. She used to
complain about his spending time on his bike. Now she's the one pushing
to ride. I'm not ready for one but I wouldn't necessarily equate an
e-bike with sitting in front of the T.V.

It is certainly not the same as sitting in front of the TV. You may make fun of it but the introduction of the E bike gave cycling an enormous boost in the last 5 years even here in The Netherlands. That is a good thing. Bike sales are way up.

Lou

I hate people on eBikes. But then again, I hate people on regular bikes. Traffic is traffic. With eBikes, though, you end up with otherwise unskilled riders who ride really fast in bike traffic. Fast dopes. Really fast unassisted riders are generally skilled -- not always, but generally. Imagine a pack of eBikers. It would make a Cat 5 race look safe.

-- Jay Beattie.

I just LOVE those ebikers who zoom up and pass you on the right
just as you're moving to the right. There's a intersection here in
town that's like a shallow with the right hand lane going onto
another street and that lane is right hand only no through traffic. So
many times I've nearly been hit as I continued along the straight
through lane and then begun to move to my right to allow the big
trucks room. That's because some idiot ebiker (and sometimes a regular
bicyclist) continues straight instead of following the right hand lane
onto the other road like they're supposed to. Being passed on the
right is NOT something you normally expect to happen on the road or
trail yet a large n umber of ebikers I've seen do precisely that.
That's not to mention other illegal and dangerous behaviours I see
them do on the roads. I often wonder if eventually ebikes will require
a license in order to operate? Like you said a fast unskilled rider on
an ebike can be a hazard to everyone else in
their vicinity.

Cheers


Singapore requires e-bikes to be registered and carry a registration
plate and imposes a speed limit which is enforced, the penalty is a
$1,000 fine and/or a three month jail sentence. The speed limit is
10kph on foot paths and 25kph on "shared paths".

--
Cheers,
John B.


Sounds like what we are going to need here. How about bicycles? Do those require registration too?

Cheers


As far as I know human powered bicycles do not require registration
but there are rules and regulations. For example: Wear a helmet when
cycling on roads, obey all traffic signals and travel in the same
direction as the traffic flow, cycle in a single file on single lane
roads, turn on a white front light and a red rear light in the dark.
Note that the penalty for failing to follow these rules is a $1,000
fine and/or a three month prison sentence.

There are a bunch of other rules, like giving hand signals and only
carrying a maximum of one other person and so on.

They also have a law that states that the use of "a mobile telephone
and any hand-held device which is designed or capable of being used
for a communicative function" while the vehicle is moving is subject
to a penalty of a $1,000 fine and/or a six month prison sentence.

And more to the point, they do enforce these rules.


As an addendum, the average monthly salary in Singapore is about
S$5,700 so based on an average month of 30.42 days and a 6 day work
week is about 26 work days per month so average working day's salary
is about $219 and a $1,000 fine then amounts to about 5 days salary.

--
Cheers,
John B.


  #29  
Old March 12th 19, 01:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 344
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?

Radey Shouman wrote:
Zen Cycle writes:

On Sunday, March 10, 2019 at 6:35:02 PM UTC-4, Roger Merriman wrote:
Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Talking about GPS units on another thread reminded me of something else I
wondered if they do. Does a bicycle GPS unit show you the steepness of
roads? There's an area that I frequently ride where on road has short but
very steep hills, another road a mile or so east of it has much more
gradual hills whilst a third road to the west of the first one is a major
highway that can be ridden with a bicycle. What I'm wondering is this: if
someone unfamiliar with the area got there and used a GPS unit to show
those three roads, would the GPS unit show them the different gradients
of the roads? Or is that another function that they'd need to download or
otherwise install?

Cheers


Various mapping sites will show the gradient, and some GPS units will show
the gradient, in the same way that it can give improbable maximum speeds
they can also give improbable max gradients or sometimes on very short
ramps not notice it, there is a nasty little ramp nr my folks place, which
is the software flattens claiming 12% when it’s a fair cruel 25/30% even
more cruel this weekend with a 50mph headwind.


It's probably an averaging issue - taking enough samples before and
after the section so that it flattens the pitch.


It's the same basic issue as the speedometer kerfluffle. Numerical
differentiation amplifies noise.


I would think it was the opposite. Numerical integration suppresses spikes.


  #30  
Old March 12th 19, 02:00 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Mike A Schwab
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 427
Default GPS Units = Show road steepness?




On Saturday, March 9, 2019 at 6:46:44 PM UTC-6, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Talking about GPS units on another thread reminded me of something else I wondered if they do. Does a bicycle GPS unit show you the steepness of roads? There's an area that I frequently ride where on road has short but very steep hills, another road a mile or so east of it has much more gradual hills whilst a third road to the west of the first one is a major highway that can be ridden with a bicycle. What I'm wondering is this: if someone unfamiliar with the area got there and used a GPS unit to show those three roads, would the GPS unit show them the different gradients of the roads? Or is that another function that they'd need to download or otherwise install?

Cheers


For an instant reading, you can get a bubble inclineometer, properly calibrated measures the incline between the front and rear contact patches.
 




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