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#62
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 3:03:22 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-05-09 11:52, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? No but a large adjustable wrench fits. It scuffs the scallops of the nut a little but I do not care about such aesthetics. ... Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Yup. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ GOOD GRIEF! Do you use a SECOND wrench to hold the upper bearing cup as you tighten the top lock nut? As Andrew said, you CAN tighten thosewith REGULAR headset wrenches. Gads! To think that someone uses a large adjustavble wrench on a nice headset likethat. it's obvious you don't care aboutthe appearance or the proper use of your equipment. No wonder you have such problems with things breaking. Cheers |
#63
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 5/9/2017 1:52 PM, wrote:
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Not essential. They accept a regular 32mm (Campagnolo preferred) headset wrench, or just a BFW on the locknut. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#64
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:49:45 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
I had a Citroen 2CV and it came standard with a crank. Which I used a lot because as a student I couldn't bring myself to spend the equivalent of half a dozen crates of beer on a 6V battery. This tupe of car: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citro%...0288067%29.jpg AFAIK they delivered them with crank until production ended around 1980. No electronic components whatsoever, not even a diode, so it was EMP-proof. One could fix just about anything with a minimum amount of tools. And you had a top speed of about 45-50 mph. They made a VW bug look like a rocket ship. |
#65
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 3:18:48 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 5/9/2017 1:52 PM, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Not essential. They accept a regular 32mm (Campagnolo preferred) headset wrench, or just a BFW on the locknut. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 I remember rounding off the ends of the lock that way. |
#66
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 2017-05-09 14:03, wrote:
On Tue, 09 May 2017 13:49:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 19:16, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 14:45:24 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 5/8/2017 2:37 PM, Duane wrote: On 08/05/2017 3:27 PM, AMuzi wrote: On 5/8/2017 1:33 PM, wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 9:06:57 AM UTC-5, wrote: It's no surprise that not only have they survived but they still work almost as well as new. The problem is even when new, the old stuff did not work nearly as well as any of the new stuff today. Kind of like a fool saying the drum brakes and carburetor on his 65 Pontiac was better than the new fancy dandy computer cars today. Agreed, dependable/repairable/cheap is not the same as best performance. People have personal preferences based on various not-shared criteria. That said, after the Chinese run their high altitude EMP device, my no-electronics cars will run and yours won't. You have a crank on the front of that model A Andrew? Unless you mean your bike and then I'm all in with that idea. 12V electrical system without semiconductors, EPROMS or ICs. p.s. Model T had a crank (at first anyway through 1919), model A are electric start. I own neither. No electronics on my bikes either. The crank came as standard equipment right up to about 1948 in north america and well into the 60s in britain. (Anflias, Prefects,) I know a lot of the mid 60's BMC stuff still had cranks in the boot - the MG right up untill the end of the MGA. I had a Citroen 2CV and it came standard with a crank. Which I used a lot because as a student I couldn't bring myself to spend the equivalent of half a dozen crates of beer on a 6V battery. This tupe of car: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citro%...0288067%29.jpg AFAIK they delivered them with crank until production ended around 1980. No electronic components whatsoever, not even a diode, so it was EMP-proof. One could fix just about anything with a minimum amount of tools. My '49 beetle didn't come with a crank, but when a new 6 volt battery was worth a month's pay, it didn't take me long to graft a crank nut from a "landy" to the VW crank bolt, punch a hole in the rear sheet metal., and bolt a "crank guide" to the rear bumper to make it crankable!!! Pop the engine cover, slap the distributor back to full retard, pull the crank, slap the didtrubutor to full advance, pull the crank, slam the engine cover and GO. Forget to slap the distributor to retard and it would attempt to tear your hand off at the wrist. The Citroen 2CV was special in that they left anything off that was not absolutely needed. Such as a distributor. It simply had none. The coil had a secondary that was insulated at both ends. One end went to spark plug #1, the other to spark plug #2. Meaning there would always be a spark in both cylinders and thus also during the exhaust phase. The crank could really wreck the thumb joint if not careful. Also, you had to make sure that no clean white car or well-dressed pretty woman was standing behind the Citroen because sometimes the car "cleared its throat" with an impressive soot plume. Big embarrassment one fine day. Phutah .. phutah .. phutah ... POOF .. *BAM* ... chingalingaling ... and the 2nd muffler pot was rolling down the street. It had blown clear off the pipes. However, the engine was running except now it sounded like a helicopter. No distributor also meant that retarding the point contact timing was not really an option because that required disassembly of the fan plus the generator, both of which were riding on the crankshaft. Because they (rightfully) figured that a car without belts is more reliable than a car with belts. Around 1971 they switched to 12V and an alternator on a belt. Not surprisingly that failed at times. The routine in winter was: Lift hood. Pop lid of regulator (mine was off most of the time anyhow). Place wood piece under one of the solenoids inside of it. Connect a stack of four D-cells to a plugs under the dash. Run around and start cranking. After start pull off the D-cells, pull out the little wood stick and all was well. And then people think a wee hose clamp on a headset is odd :-) -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#67
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 2017-05-09 15:52, wrote:
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:49:45 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: I had a Citroen 2CV and it came standard with a crank. Which I used a lot because as a student I couldn't bring myself to spend the equivalent of half a dozen crates of beer on a 6V battery. This tupe of car: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citro%...0288067%29.jpg AFAIK they delivered them with crank until production ended around 1980. No electronic components whatsoever, not even a diode, so it was EMP-proof. One could fix just about anything with a minimum amount of tools. And you had a top speed of about 45-50 mph. They made a VW bug look like a rocket ship. It could do 55mph. With a tail wind even 60mph. But woe to anyone who was behind me on a hill because it only had 16 horses. There were "other editions" though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjQCXkCkPeQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RB3hPmq65FM A local Citroen dealer in the city of Aachen had a version with a Citroen GS engine in there, street-leagl and registered. He would show up in the fast lane on the autobahn behind BMWs and flash the headlights, then roar past and watch the jaws drop. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#68
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 2017-05-09 14:37, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 3:03:22 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 11:52, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? No but a large adjustable wrench fits. It scuffs the scallops of the nut a little but I do not care about such aesthetics. ... Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Yup. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ GOOD GRIEF! Do you use a SECOND wrench to hold the upper bearing cup as you tighten the top lock nut? As Andrew said, you CAN tighten thosewith REGULAR headset wrenches. Don't read stuff into text that isn't there. Of course I use a 2nd wrench to hold the other. I believe the spacer has a lock but I wouldn't trust that. Anyhow, I don't care anymore because that problem is fixed. Gads! To think that someone uses a large adjustavble wrench on a nice headset likethat. it's obvious you don't care aboutthe appearance or the proper use of your equipment. No wonder you have such problems with things breaking. In case it hasn't occurred to you there are very nice and accurate adjustable wrenches. Ones that are actually more precise that a "real" wrench. I inherited two from my grandpa. You can even adjust the play in the worm gear. Each weighs at least 2lbs. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#69
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 2017-05-09 16:31, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-05-09 14:37, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 3:03:22 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 11:52, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? No but a large adjustable wrench fits. It scuffs the scallops of the nut a little but I do not care about such aesthetics. ... Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Yup. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ GOOD GRIEF! Do you use a SECOND wrench to hold the upper bearing cup as you tighten the top lock nut? As Andrew said, you CAN tighten thosewith REGULAR headset wrenches. Don't read stuff into text that isn't there. Of course I use a 2nd wrench to hold the other. I believe the spacer has a lock but I wouldn't trust that. Anyhow, I don't care anymore because that problem is fixed. Gads! To think that someone uses a large adjustavble wrench on a nice headset likethat. it's obvious you don't care aboutthe appearance or the proper use of your equipment. No wonder you have such problems with things breaking. In case it hasn't occurred to you there are very nice and accurate adjustable wrenches. Ones that are actually more precise that a "real" wrench. I inherited two from my grandpa. You can even adjust the play in the worm gear. Each weighs at least 2lbs. Oh, and from the way you worded the last paragraph I think you don't know this trick either: Stick a clean layer of Kapton tape to the insides of the adjustable wrenches and it will protect whatever surface it touches. Life can be very simple. One only has to see it. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#70
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14 year-old Campy Record shifts like new...
On 2017-05-09 15:54, wrote:
On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 3:18:48 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote: On 5/9/2017 1:52 PM, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 11:01:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-09 06:23, wrote: On Tuesday, May 9, 2017 at 1:06:01 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote: On Mon, 8 May 2017 19:27:20 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, May 8, 2017 at 10:10:59 PM UTC-4, wrote: On Mon, 08 May 2017 11:52:58 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-05-08 10:55, Sir Ridesalot wrote: [...] At some point in time either you or a shop did something that knackered your top nut on your 600EX headset. I am not the only one who has that problem. Except the others eventually didn't have the bikes anymore, which "fixed" it for them. I keep technical things for a long time. Anyhow, the hose clamp fixes it for me. When I get around to it I'll put in a new non-600 headset. I wonder if someone over tightened Joerg's 600EX headset top nut and stripped it? Or if he has the right top nut on it? ANyhow, lots of them were sold and lots of them were used without Joerg's problem showing up. Joerg seems to think that he's the ONLY ONE who rides a road bike on trails. Cheers Actually I have had the same problem that Joerg has. Adjust and tighten the steering bearings and in a few days the bearings would be loose. A little investigation showed that the top nut instead of bottoming out on the upper bearing race and locking it, it was bottoming out on a very slightly too long steerer tube. I added a washer, perhaps 3/32" thick so the top nut actually tightened against the bearing race and have had no more problems in the last couple of years :-) -- Cheers, John B. I'll bet that this is what Joerg's problem is. It's almost impossible to tell a steering tube that's fractionally too long. Like yours it will appear to tighten up because it will bend just enough to appear to be tight. Then the extra pressure will cause it to loosen up. Got that Joerg? Try a small washer and see if that doesn't solve your problem. I took it apart to make sure there wasn't any other gremlin causing this and everything was alright. The lock nut does push down as it's supposed to do but that just isn't good enough for rides that include dirt paths or dirt roads. Which is almost inevitable where I live. As I wrote I was not the only one. Back in the 80's many of the more serious riders had Shimano 600 or 600EX. I lived in the Netherlands but close to Germany and Belgium. The riders who only did fitness rounds in Zuid Limburg (Dutch side) didn't have problems with the headset. Belgians and riders like me who ventured out into Belgium had them come loose a lot. Regardless of whether they had Gazelle, Merckx or other frames. The roads over there were often in bad shape, especially in the Wallonie (French-speaking area). Those guys also broke spokes as often as I do. Full confession: I often rode in Belgium because I loved their pubs and the Abbey Ales. Still do. That's why I have a Belgian Tripel carbonating right now and another set of ingredients ready to brew. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Do you have the required star wrench to tighten it properly? Do you also have the stock spacer between the race and the lockbolt? Not essential. They accept a regular 32mm (Campagnolo preferred) headset wrench, or just a BFW on the locknut. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 I remember rounding off the ends of the lock that way. Sometimes a high-end adjustable wrench is better for that because nuts and other stuff are always slightly smaller than the stated wrench size. So if it is 31.7mm the adjustable wrench can snugly be set to 31.7mm, not 32mm. Just don't use cheap wrenches. Mine look like this (often called a French Key) but all metal and with a more precise worm gear and alignment.: https://d2ydh70d4b5xgv.cloudfront.ne...a226bb3b44.jpg You can actually clamp the nut tightly before turning it. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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