Sturdy mountain bike tail light?

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jun 2014 10:07:49 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jun 2014 16:56:37 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Plastic on mountain bikes is junk. It doesn't belong there.
Sniff. I guess you're not ready for the all plastic bicycle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_bicycle

Yikes, that would be a horror for me. Or for the bike. I am pretty sure
that it would not even survive my first ride.

If you just replaced the metal frame and forks of your MTB with
plastic equivalents, that would be the probable result. However, most
well designed plastic bicycles have internal metal reinforcements and
are therefore not 100.0% plastic. It's much like concrete, which is
structurally useless unless stuffed full of rebar. There are also
hybrid compsites:
http://www.ptonline.com/articles/plastic-metal-hybrids-make-headway-on-and-off-the-road
They are aleady being used heavily in aircraft:
http://www.omnexus.com/resources/editorials.aspx?id=17128
Maybe some day the bicycle industry will catch up.


As long as I don't have to buy them. Aircraft are operated in a very
controlled fashion. No rocks flying at them, only so many G's, and so
on. I can't even count the number of hard hits of big rocks my bike had
to endure ... THWOCK ... *KANGGG* ... and when one ricocheted towards
my shin that resulted in quite some blood. A friend had a rock take out
a chunk of the bottom bracket area on his Specialized Enduro. A carbon
frame would likely be toast after that.


Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.


I'd rather make it from a chunk of aluminum. I've seen a photo of a guy
who make a "quick and dirty" mud guard for his MTB and then turfed it
badly somewhere. It cut through a leg muscle and into bone.


For emergency lighting only:
http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/bicycle-flashlight.html


Cool :-)

BTW, those V-pull brakes were one of the reasons why I replaced my old
MTB. They just won't hold the bike on steep downhill sections. I had one
episode where I was leaning into the brakes real hard and it would still
accelerate. The "J-pull" rim brakes on my wifes bike are much better.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

yes not too far into the conversation J begins to argue for plastic...only rational course.

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.

Those are kludges.

You want a hack, not a kludge.

On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 00:50:06 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.
Those are kludges.
You want a hack, not a kludge.

Sorry. I forgot that everything on a bicycle needs to be exotic.
There, may I suggest carbon fiber duct tape:
http://www.tapebrothers.com/Tape-Brothers-Black-Carbon-Fiber-2-x-10-yards-p/tt809cfb2x10.htm
titanium hose clamps:
http://www.extreme-bolt.com/Products-Titanium-Hose-Clamps.html
and stainless angle bracket:
http://www.amazon.com/DEGREE-Stainless-Steel-ANGLE-BRACKET/dp/B000Y84C5M
Unfortunately, I couldn't find a suitable real silk bungee cord for my
emergency flashlight mount.

Selection of the flashlight might be a problem. The lighting is
fairly easy as anything above some minimum intensity is effective at
blinding oncoming traffic. What's important is that off road mountain
bicycles are really two wheel assault vehicles in disguise and should
be designed to look as aggressive as possible. The idea is to
intimidate any approaching vehicle or cyclist, while deflecting any
comments that the lighting system is a kludge. Therefore, the
flashlight should look more like a weapon than an instrument. An
attached bayonet might be a little over the top, but a repurposed gun
mounted light should work:
http://www.surefire.com/illumination/weaponlights.html
http://www.surefire.com/illumination/weaponlights/heavy-gun.html
A bargain at only $4,000 to $6,000 each.

A rear mounted tail light is somewhat more problematic. While great
attention and effort has been expended on the design of the forward
facing photon torpedo device, that aft weapons system is seriously
lacking. One should recognize that if the driver does not see you, it
doesn't matter if they're approaching from fore or aft. They'll
clobber you either way. Therefore, tiny rear facing red LED's powered
by coin cells are inadequate protection.

I Googled for 2 watt red LED's and couldn't find any. Apparently if
you want high power, it has to be white. White phosphor LED's do not
have much output in the red region, and are therefore not going to
work with a red filter. So, while waiting for the industry to produce
the required high brightness red tail light, I have a different
idea... use the reflected light from the approaching vehicles
headlights using a mirror. The mirror mount would have a tracking
mechanism that automatically aims it at the source of light
(headlights) and reflects some of the light back towards the source.
To be legal, it should probably have a red filter, but that would
reduce its effectiveness. Some oscillatory motion would simulate a
flasher. Even better, the closer the approaching vehicle, the
brighter the reflection. Time to file for a patent...




--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 6/28/2014 2:22 PM, Joerg wrote:
-snip snip-
As long as I don't have to buy them. Aircraft are operated in a very
controlled fashion. No rocks flying at them, only so many G's, and so
on. I can't even count the number of hard hits of big rocks my bike had
to endure ... THWOCK ... *KANGGG* ... and when one ricocheted towards
my shin that resulted in quite some blood. A friend had a rock take out
a chunk of the bottom bracket area on his Specialized Enduro. A carbon
frame would likely be toast after that.


Yeah like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwFzBrJ79qI

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 6/29/2014 8:39 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 00:50:06 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.
Those are kludges.
You want a hack, not a kludge.

Sorry. I forgot that everything on a bicycle needs to be exotic.

Not exotic. But not a kludge. Duct tape is a kluge. Jubilee clamps are a
horrible kludge. Never use them on a bicycle for any purpose.

On Sat, 28 Jun 2014 12:22:27 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

If you just replaced the metal frame and forks of your MTB with
plastic equivalents, that would be the probable result. However, most
well designed plastic bicycles have internal metal reinforcements and
are therefore not 100.0% plastic. It's much like concrete, which is
structurally useless unless stuffed full of rebar. There are also
hybrid compsites:
http://www.ptonline.com/articles/plastic-metal-hybrids-make-headway-on-and-off-the-road
They are aleady being used heavily in aircraft:
http://www.omnexus.com/resources/editorials.aspx?id=17128
Maybe some day the bicycle industry will catch up.

As long as I don't have to buy them.

Oh, you want affordable? Well, perhaps:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardboard_bicycle
Probably too crude. Maybe a wooden mountain bike?
http://www.renovobikes.com/badash-29er/

More plastic:
http://www.bikerumor.com/2013/01/24/crisp-transparent-bike-design-aircraft-grade-plastic-used-for-frame-build/

Try to visualize an aircraft style composite design, where each
material is selected to be optimum in one particular characteristic,
and the combination of materials results in optimum characteristics in
ALL areas. You would probably destroy a CF or plastic frame in short
order. It might take you longer to destroy a composite frame, made
from a combination of these materials with aluminum or steel
reinforcing.

Aircraft are operated in a very
controlled fashion. No rocks flying at them,
only so many G's, and so on.

Ummm... bird strike? Ever see the mess created behind a dirt field
landing? The jet wash launches rocks at impressive velocities.
Harrier VTOL dirt field landings usually require some rocks to be
pried out of the lower fuselage and wings.

I can't even count the number of hard hits of big rocks my bike had
to endure ... THWOCK ... *KANGGG* ... and when one ricocheted towards
my shin that resulted in quite some blood.

Wear shin guards.
https://www.google.com/search?q=shin+guard&tbm=isch

A friend had a rock take out
a chunk of the bottom bracket area on his Specialized Enduro.

That's odd, because I would have expected high centering it on a
boulder would take out the chain wheel before damaging the bottom
bracket. Did he hit bottom on the port side of the bicycle instead of
coming straight down? If so, adding a motorcycle style skid guard to
the bottom bracket should prevent any further damage.

A carbon
frame would likely be toast after that.

Maybe. Sprung carbon fiber mountain bike frames tend to be heavier
built to compensate. Unfortunately, I have zero experience with these
and can't claim that they'll survive your aerobatics. Some CF mtn
bikes look flimsy, while others are rather beefy:
http://www.sicklines.com/reviews/2013-evil-undead-carbon-fiber-mountain-bike-review/

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

I'd rather make it from a chunk of aluminum.

To be of equal strength, an aluminum L bracket would need to be
thicker and heavier. You would also need to be rather careful of the
built in stress riser at the bend. Compromise... use stainless.
http://www.amazon.com/DEGREE-Stainless-Steel-ANGLE-BRACKET/dp/B000Y84C5M

I've seen a photo of a guy
who make a "quick and dirty" mud guard for his MTB and then turfed it
badly somewhere. It cut through a leg muscle and into bone.

Ouch. Part of the design of anything is to visualize what will happen
if the device fails. Bicycle manufacturers put considerable effort
into this question, mostly to avoid liability litigation. It's not
unusual to weaken one part of the structure, just so that it will fail
in a controlled and hopefully safe manner. This is often not the case
with do-it-thyself bolt on designs, which can easily become impromptu
meat cutter.

I don't believe that my L-bracket head/tail light idea qualifies,
mostly because it's in a protected area in either mounting location.
However, I'm open to suggestions in case I missed something.

BTW, those V-pull brakes were one of the reasons why I replaced my old
MTB. They just won't hold the bike on steep downhill sections. I had one
episode where I was leaning into the brakes real hard and it would still
accelerate. The "J-pull" rim brakes on my wifes bike are much better.

Probably a good idea if plan to stop after a landing. In my case, the
center pull cantilevers are adequate because that's my office
"errands" cruiser, which rarely goes off the pavement. Note the slick
tires.
http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/bicycle-flashlight.html
Older photo, before I change tires, saddle, stem, pedals, etc. Every
time I get a new component, I try it out on this machine:
http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/bicycles/slides/Gary-Fisher-Tassajara.html
Incidentally, I fished the frame out of garbage pile and built it up.




--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 09:10:17 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/29/2014 8:39 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 00:50:06 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.
Those are kludges.
You want a hack, not a kludge.

Sorry. I forgot that everything on a bicycle needs to be exotic.

Not exotic. But not a kludge. Duct tape is a kluge.

You realize that civilization would collapse without duct tape. It's
what holds together all the kludges that make up modern technology.
Without duct tape, many things would just fall apart. I've performed
many impromptu repairs using duct tape, where the proper fasteners
were either not available or where nothing but duct tape would work.
It's axiomatic that "if it works, it's permanent" making many of my
duct tape repairs pass the survivability test. It may look like a
kludge, but if it works, it's generally considered a good thing.
http://search.cheezburger.com/?q=duct+tape
http://cheezburger.com/7130323200

Jubilee clamps are a
horrible kludge. Never use them on a bicycle for any purpose.

Is this hose clamp any better? It's more elegant and aerodynamic:
http://www.fisheriessupply.com/awab-316-ss-trunnion-hose-clamps

On one of my machines, I have a Bike Planet 1w headlight with a truly
lousy mounting contrivance. It's a cam actuated clamping mechanism
that is always loose:
http://mikesbikes.com/images/library/zoom/planet-bike-blaze-2-watt-led-headlight-61056-1.jpg
No matter how tightly I adjust it, the plastic bends causing the clamp
to loosen. If the mount were based on a hose clamp style design, it
would never slip. The light has a functional release mechanism so
there's no need for a quick release on the mounting. If I park the
bicycle somewhere insecure, I remove the light, leaving the mount on
the bicycle. I don't need two quick release mechanism. Oddly, most
headlight mounts work on the same flimsy cam principle. My best
conspiracy theory is that the industry wants the mount to fall off or
stolen separately from the light, so that there's a market for parts
and replacements.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 09:10:17 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/29/2014 8:39 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 00:50:06 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.
Those are kludges.
You want a hack, not a kludge.

Sorry. I forgot that everything on a bicycle needs to be exotic.

Not exotic. But not a kludge. Duct tape is a kluge. Jubilee clamps are a
horrible kludge. Never use them on a bicycle for any purpose.

Why ever not?

A nice all stainless clamp tastefully polished and drilled for
lightness is a thing of beauty. and lasts practically for ever.

--
Cheers,

John B.

On 30/06/14 12:17, John B. slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 09:10:17 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/29/2014 8:39 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 00:50:06 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 6/28/2014 8:32 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Incidentally, if you want a really cheap metal mount for your
lighting, just take a hardware store L-bracket and attach it to the
seat post or stem with automotive hose clamps. Bend slightly to
obtain a level platform. Attach a commodity LED flashlight with more
hose clamps or duct tape.

Do not use hose clamps.
Do not use duct tape.
Those are kludges.
You want a hack, not a kludge.

Sorry. I forgot that everything on a bicycle needs to be exotic.

Not exotic. But not a kludge. Duct tape is a kluge. Jubilee clamps are a
horrible kludge. Never use them on a bicycle for any purpose.

Why ever not?

A nice all stainless clamp tastefully polished and drilled for
lightness is a thing of beauty. and lasts practically for ever.


Even without any holes...

http://www.mackengineering.co.uk/pro...%252d63mm.html

--
JS