hybrid cars ?

We'll all find alternative transportation when the oil runs out.

I suspect it will be before then. Right now the Chinese hold all the cards;
they're sitting on large reserves of petroleum, and their economy is
expanding at a nightmarish pace... but they're not extensively tapping their
own stockpiles at the moment. Meanwhile, worldwide oil production isn't
going up significantly. At some point the demand/supply equation requires
that pricing goes significantly higher, and the Chinese are most definitely
in control of when that happens. And, of course, that dramatically
increases the value of their own holdings.

Neat trick. We were so concerned they were going to bomb us to oblivion,
while it's a simple economic tour de force that will do the damage. And, of
course, cheap oil being national foreign policy for the US, we're actually
helping them along. The increase in pricing, when it happens, will be a
very un-natural one (because we're doing so much to resist the normal
economic forces that would create a gradual rise in pricing, which in turn
would provide incentives to move away from petroleum as a primary source of
energy).

So oil won't run out in the near future, but it may get very, very
expensive.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"AustinMN" wrote in message
...
Mike Jacoubowsky:
It's an attitude thing, and could finally force the automakers and Feds
to require more stringent standards for mileage on cars in general, not
to mention get rid of the ridiculous loopholes that call our minivan (and
most SUVs) a truck.

Minivans actually owe their existence to laws that were intended to make
automaker's "fleets" more fuel-efficient. The tax penalty on full-size
station wagons is high enough that they often cost more than minivans
(which don't have the penalty imposed on them). So people buy the
minivans and the full-size station wagons (which can easily be made more
fuel-efficient than minivans) all but disappear. Law meant to make things
better makes things worse.

We'll all find alternative transportation when the oil runs out.

Austin

"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote in message
m...
We'll all find alternative transportation when the oil runs out.

I suspect it will be before then. Right now the Chinese hold all the
cards;
they're sitting on large reserves of petroleum, and their economy is
expanding at a nightmarish pace... but they're not extensively tapping
their
own stockpiles at the moment. Meanwhile, worldwide oil production isn't
going up significantly. At some point the demand/supply equation requires
that pricing goes significantly higher, and the Chinese are most
definitely
in control of when that happens. And, of course, that dramatically
increases the value of their own holdings.

Neat trick. We were so concerned they were going to bomb us to oblivion,
while it's a simple economic tour de force that will do the damage. And,
of
course, cheap oil being national foreign policy for the US, we're actually
helping them along. The increase in pricing, when it happens, will be a
very un-natural one (because we're doing so much to resist the normal
economic forces that would create a gradual rise in pricing, which in turn
would provide incentives to move away from petroleum as a primary source
of
energy).

So oil won't run out in the near future, but it may get very, very
expensive.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


From today's Morning Edition on NPR, "Experts: Oil Production Peak
Inevitable" :
http://www.npr.org/rundowns/segment.php?wfId=3870191

--
~_-*
....G/ \G
http://www.CycliStats.com
CycliStats - Software for Cyclists

suspect it will be before then. Right now the Chinese hold all the cards;
they're sitting on large reserves of petroleum, and their economy is
expanding at a nightmarish pace...

Why is their coming out of third world status a nightmare to you?
Damn, talk about selfish.

From today's Morning Edition on NPR, "Experts: Oil Production Peak
Inevitable" :
http://www.npr.org/rundowns/segment.php?wfId=3870191


I heard it this morning.
It also commented on the stories they ran years ago that said we'd be dry by
now.
It also said higher prices will make exploration more feasible.

I have been doing this for a Prius vs. an Echo (which I currently have).
With the Echo getting ~41/mpg and the Prius about 54/mpg (is that the
right figure), then at the first level the Prius is ~$10,000 USD more
than the Echo so there's ~5000 gallons of fuel which for the Echo takes
me ~210000 miles or maybe eight or nine years of vehicle use.

The Echo is a lot cheaper for me.

Mike








Good call

equalizing at
300,000-400,000 miles, depending on $/gal, and maintenance issues

IMHO, hybrids are but an intermediate step.

Pete


Shouldn't the tevhnology begin with engines that run all the time?
Busses, trucks....talk about fuel usage

i too agree that hybrids are a good idea but since i have eliminated 90% of
my driving by cycling instead i would never find them cost efficient. i'll
continue to drive my '64 plymouth /6 occasionally (currently avg about one
mile per week) but forever (or as long as the oil lasts). btw. i would like
to see gas at $5 a gallon.










That's way better than a Prius....Think of all the energy used MAKING a
Prius...HELLO


Of course you're "no good" because of the old polluter/classic.

$5 a gallon gas? That's a great idea. Then the price of EVERYTHING will go
up.

But if you feel so strongly about it, I'm pretty sure no gas station owner
would mind if you offered them $5 a gallon for their product. People like
you could subsidize it for those of us who really need it.

Dave









Everyone's in complete denial of how much they consume and how it gets there.
As well as how much their job depends on it.

1) Love my Toyota Prius, love my Prius, love my Prius.
Quiet, quick, smooth, commodius, reliable, economical,
_more_ environmentally friendly. My wife's been on the
waiting list for a new one for nearly six months!

Yippidee do dah....did your teeth get whiter too?

VW sells a car that gets 99 miles to the gallon, that's the one I want.

FWIW, I'm pretty sure that most hybrids will run just fine, even in "cold
and snowy Indiana".

For what it's worth, you'd be wrong.
I need four wheel drive in "snow Indiana".

As for the payback period on a hybrid - I think most folks who purchase them
are looking at larger issues than just the economics of ownership.

Yep, it's a social statement.