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#32
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NYC cycling update
On 10/7/2017 2:45 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 12:17:24 PM UTC-7, wrote: On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 8:28:16 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote: On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 7:24:26 AM UTC-7, wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 5:59:00 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 12:25:57 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote: On 10/6/2017 2:13 PM, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 11:35:56 AM UTC-7, wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 11:05:40 AM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 9:50:55 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 11:45 AM, AMuzi wrote: On 10/6/2017 10:26 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 9:52 AM, AMuzi wrote: -snip snip snip- Don't you trust the Air Force? Uh, you mean _after_ John Slocumb retired? -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#33
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NYC cycling update
On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 11:28:39 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote: On 10/7/2017 10:22 AM, wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 2:18:22 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 2:35 PM, wrote: Drunk driving is an offense that is particularly prone to repetition. According to MADD statistics, "an average drunk driver has driven drunk 80 times before first arrest" and "every day in America, another 27 people die as a result of drunk driving crashes" and "about one-third of all drivers arrested or convicted of drunk driving are repeat offenders." Any individual who is arrested for DUI or DWI has likely, therefore, driven drunk tens of times before, and has an extremely high chance of doing so again. But this is all a joke and should be demonstrated with sarcasm - right? The question was: What exactly do you propose should be done about it, Tom? You provide lots of ranting, but very few realistic answers. And as usual the obvious flies right past you. All it takes is enforcing traffic laws since the danger to the public comes from people breaking these laws. Let me here you say "duhhhhhhh" as usual. Wow, how simple! Just "enforce traffic laws." OK, so a guy gets caught driving drunk. They give him the maximum fine allowed by law, and let him go, as the law demands. They've just enforced the traffic law. You need better laws :-) Read up on the Maine laws: http://www.maine.gov/dps/bhs/impaired-driving/laws.html Note that Driving Under the Influence is a criminal act and that loss of license, for a period and a 500 fine is the penalty for the first offence. And, if you are under 21 years of age the penalty is much more serious. Driving with any measurable level of BAC results in loss of license for one year. Arizona, and quite a number of other states have, I believe, even stricter laws. -- Cheers, John B. |
#34
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NYC cycling update
On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 11:31:28 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote: On 10/6/2017 9:12 PM, John B. wrote: On Fri, 6 Oct 2017 12:50:51 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 11:45 AM, AMuzi wrote: On 10/6/2017 10:26 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 9:52 AM, AMuzi wrote: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.3545213 We need sensible regulation, dammit. Drunk driving ought to be against the law.Â* Anyone piloting a motor vehicle on a public road should have to pass a skills competence test and a written statute-based test and then carry a document with their picture on it. More laws! Yep that oughta do it. Your sarcasm is noted. But what do you propose? No requirement for driver's licenses, no limit on blood alcohol while driving? Since those great ideas are hardly practiced, back at you. Our local news regularly notes arrests for 6th, 8th, 12th offense DUI. We don't have as many illegal aliens (no registration, no license, no speak English) as they do in SoCal but the trend is clear. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_2490337.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-15-times.html http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/l...307-story.html The topic seems to have suddenly shifted from drunk drivers to illegal aliens. Those topics may overlap, but they are not one and the same. The guy in your article is Hispanic, but I didn't see that he was in the U.S. illegally. For the record: I'm not in favor of illegal immigration any more than I'm in favor of drunk driving. But I haven't heard much here about really practical ways of stopping either. I'm not impressed by arguments that say things like "Here's a guy who committed a crime despite a law, so laws do no good." If someone makes such an argument, I think it's fair to ask them what _should_ be done. I suggest "just enforce the laws you've got". Years ago people were actually scared to get arrested for drunken driving as the penalties handed down were severe. Now, apparently, as I read about "6th, 8th, 12th offense", it is more of a slap on the wrist sort of thing. Suppose that drunk driving was punished by a minimum sentence of 6 months loss of license for first offence and permanent loss for second, and driving without a license was a minimum of 6 months imprisonment for first attempt and one year for second. Would there be as much crime? I'll note that what you're proposing is not "enforce the laws you've got." You're proposing new, much harsher laws. And while I don't necessarily disagree with the concept, I think those will be politically impossible to get written into law. I suggest that you read up on the various states laws about DUI. Arizona, for example: When you are stopped on suspicion of a DUI by a police officer and either fail or refuse to take the BAC/breathalyzer test, the Arizona Motor Vehicle Division will typically suspend your driver's license (regardless of any criminal findings) on the spot for: 12 months. OR 24 months, for a 2nd refusal or failure within 84 months. For a 1st offense of a standard DUI, you may face: 10 days in jail. A fine of $1,250. Required completion of an alcohol/drug screening, treatment, and education program. An ignition interlock requirement for every vehicle you drive. Community service. I've been involved with passage of a few state laws, plus several village ordinances. Simplistic solutions run into practical and political roadblocks. -- Cheers, John B. |
#35
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NYC cycling update
On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 12:45:24 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
Considering that everyone entering the base has to pass through a security check-point, I leave it to the Air Force to decide who will and won't be allowed on the premises. Don't you trust the Air Force? Absolutely - so why the whining about illegal aliens being arrested for being in a national security area? |
#36
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NYC cycling update
On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 7:55:34 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 11:31:28 -0400, Frank Krygowski I'll note that what you're proposing is not "enforce the laws you've got." You're proposing new, much harsher laws. And while I don't necessarily disagree with the concept, I think those will be politically impossible to get written into law. I suggest that you read up on the various states laws about DUI. Arizona, for example: When you are stopped on suspicion of a DUI by a police officer and either fail or refuse to take the BAC/breathalyzer test, the Arizona Motor Vehicle Division will typically suspend your driver's license (regardless of any criminal findings) on the spot for: 12 months. OR 24 months, for a 2nd refusal or failure within 84 months. For a 1st offense of a standard DUI, you may face: 10 days in jail. A fine of $1,250. Required completion of an alcohol/drug screening, treatment, and education program. An ignition interlock requirement for every vehicle you drive. Community service. Which is the reason I have a medical exemption from taking those "head back, look straight up and walk three steps to the left" tests. With the medication I'm taking I cannot even walk a straight line. That doesn't mean my driving or bicycling is impaired save that I can no longer ride with no hands.. I am still required to use a breathalyzer or give a blood sample. But I don't drink more than I should unless I'm sitting around watching the TV in evening and there's a little wine left after dinner. |
#37
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NYC cycling update
On 10/7/2017 9:50 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 7 Oct 2017 11:28:39 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/7/2017 10:22 AM, wrote: On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 2:18:22 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 10/6/2017 2:35 PM, wrote: Drunk driving is an offense that is particularly prone to repetition. According to MADD statistics, "an average drunk driver has driven drunk 80 times before first arrest" and "every day in America, another 27 people die as a result of drunk driving crashes" and "about one-third of all drivers arrested or convicted of drunk driving are repeat offenders." Any individual who is arrested for DUI or DWI has likely, therefore, driven drunk tens of times before, and has an extremely high chance of doing so again. But this is all a joke and should be demonstrated with sarcasm - right? The question was: What exactly do you propose should be done about it, Tom? You provide lots of ranting, but very few realistic answers. And as usual the obvious flies right past you. All it takes is enforcing traffic laws since the danger to the public comes from people breaking these laws. Let me here you say "duhhhhhhh" as usual. Wow, how simple! Just "enforce traffic laws." OK, so a guy gets caught driving drunk. They give him the maximum fine allowed by law, and let him go, as the law demands. They've just enforced the traffic law. You need better laws :-) Read up on the Maine laws: http://www.maine.gov/dps/bhs/impaired-driving/laws.html Note that Driving Under the Influence is a criminal act and that loss of license, for a period and a 500 fine is the penalty for the first offence. And, if you are under 21 years of age the penalty is much more serious. Driving with any measurable level of BAC results in loss of license for one year. Arizona, and quite a number of other states have, I believe, even stricter laws. I do not know and I have no opinion but I strongly suspect that the practice of charging or not charging DUI[1] may vary a lot from State to State as I strongly doubt that actual DUI varies so much among populations: http://www.statisticbrain.com/number...sts-per-state/ Note that Wisconsin shows one per 140 persons and then next door Illinois is rated 1:2621. I know that Illinois has a history of vacated charges for DUI which are both ridiculously expensive and also routine in the Chicago metro area, but that rate seems unconnected to reality. NJ with 1:362 versus NY at 1:773 are not as dramatic as a comparison to DE at an unbelievable one to 4219 persons. In sum, I believe there are significant factors we have not considered. You can't make the case that a legal (by statue or by prosecution or sentencing practice) could make that magnitude+ sized difference. [1] Perhaps reporting/not reporting? p.s. I dropped that list into a spreadsheet with ratios. State DUI Arrests in 2015 Population Size RATE Alabama 14,991 4,802,740 320.4 Alaska 5,538 722,718 130.5 Arizona 39,746 6,482,505 163.1 Arkansas 11,707 2,937,979 251.0 California 214,828 37,691,912 175.5 Colorado 28,198 5,116,769 181.5 Connecticut 8,235 3,580,709 434.8 Delaware 215 907,135 4 219.2 Florida 61,852 19,057,542 308.1 Georgia 25,421 9,815,210 386.1 Hawaii 5,812 1,374,810 236.5 Idaho 11,850 1,584,985 133.8 Illinois 4,909 12,869,257 2621.6 Indiana 23,475 6,516,922 277.6 Iowa 14,147 3,062,309 216.5 Kansas 13,080 2,871,238 219.5 Kentucky 2,363 4,369,356 1849.1 Louisiana 7,977 4,574,836 573.5 Maine 7,270 1,328,188 182.7 Maryland 23,714 5,828,289 245.8 Massachusetts 12,941 6,587,536 509.0 Michigan 35,534 9,876,187 277.9 Minnesota 29,832 5,344,861 179.2 Mississippi 11,629 2,978,512 256.1 Missouri 34,004 6,010,688 176.8 Montana 4,240 998,199 235.4 Nebraska 13,692 1,842,641 134.6 Nevada 14,445 2,723,322 188.5 New Hampshire 4,571 1,318,194 288.4 New Jersey 24,313 8,821,155 362.8 New Mexico 9,741 2,082,224 213.8 New York 25,169 19,465,197 773.4 North Carolina 49,599 9,656,401 194.7 North Dakota 4,003 683,932 170.9 Ohio 19,088 11,544,951 604.8 Oklahoma 18,980 3,791,508 199.8 Oregon 17,015 3,871,859 227.6 Pennsylvania 53,319 12,742,886 239.0 Rhode Island 2,778 1,051,302 378.4 South Carolina 14,742 4,679,230 317.4 South Dakota 6,190 824,082 133.1 Tennessee 26,322 6,403,353 243.3 Texas 90,066 25,674,681 285.1 Utah 6,894 2,817,222 408.6 Vermont 2,647 626,431 236.7 Virginia 27,732 8,096,604 292.0 Washington 34,952 6,830,038 195.4 West Virginia 4,429 1,855,364 418.9 Wisconsin 40,549 5,711,767 140.9 Wyoming 7,159 568,158 79.4 -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#38
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NYC cycling update
Strata your organization n get back to us
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#39
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NYC cycling update
similar to our current goverment product
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#40
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NYC cycling update
Nightmare ?
Rump Fed with 10 year trillions deficits in tax cuts eliminating the Fed Gov ... Kansas city gona KC here we go...sung to Eliot Wave Theory...Savings n Loan ballad |
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