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Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets



 
 
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  #41  
Old August 4th 19, 10:59 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 11:32:31 AM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 5:23:28 PM UTC-7, news18 wrote:
On Fri, 02 Aug 2019 15:21:48 -0700, Tom Kunich wrote:

I just got an advertisement from Trek in which they now claim that the
latest Wavecell has not 28 times but 48 times the protection for your
head than normal foam.


The question to ask yourself is "where is the point of failure now".

When mushroom style bicycle helmets, aka bell, first came out, there was
a nasty rise in a spine based injury of a rather severe and fatal type.


Please don't publish crap like this without references.


Tom, I'm hoping you will someday post something _with_ a reference!

- Frank Krygowski

Ads
  #42  
Old August 4th 19, 11:06 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 2:24:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 7:47:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 1:09 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 12:13:14 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 11:54 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

VBEG We all know you're extremely anti-helmet. LOL

I'm actually for honesty, for truthful presentation of data, and for
individual choice.

If I were anti-helmet, I'd be working to outlaw them. It would be
parallel to the helmeteers efforts to outlaw riding bikes without helmets.

Is there a mandatory helmet law where you live? (I believe so.) Which
side is imposing its will on the other side?

Wrong again Frank. There's no mandatory helmet law where I live.


Really? I thought you lived in Ontario.

From Wikipedia:
"The use of bicycle helmets is compulsory in the provinces of British
Columbia, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, and
Prince Edward Island.[12] In the provinces of Alberta, Manitoba, and
Ontario, the use of helmets is mandatory for cyclists under the age of
18 years of age.[13][14][15][16]"

Perhaps you're unaware of the law? If so, perhaps you should read up
before arguing.


Last time I looked this is rec.BICYCLES.tech not rec.pedestrians.tech or
rec.car.tech. Therefore most of us who talk about helmets here are
talking about helmets as they pertain to BICYCLING.

If that's how you feel, you should have taken your "smash a melon"
helmet promoting argument to rec.melons.tech, or some other such newsgroup.

Why are so many people so dedicated to claiming that only _bicyclists_
should (or must) wear helmets, as if bicycling has tremendous brain
injury risk? Do those people not understand the numbers? Or, like the
laws, do those people just not bother to examine them?

--
- Frank Krygowski


I'm over 18 thus there is NO mandatory helmet law for me.


I'm aware of that. But your statement was "There's no mandatory helmet law
where I live." That was clearly false. You should admit it.

There is a MHL in Ontario, but due largely to the efforts of a guy I happen to
correspond with, the law was amended so it doesn't apply to adults.

I'm quite sure that if the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL
would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski

  #43  
Old August 4th 19, 11:10 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 4:25:04 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 5:15:03 PM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/4/2019 8:21 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 12:21:50 AM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
I just got an advertisement from Trek in which they now claim that the latest Wavecell has not 28 times but 48 times the protection for your head than normal foam.

I wonder if this is advertising BS or an actual improvement of the cell shape design. Since they are manufactured using a 3-D printing technology it is very simple for them to make improvements to the design.

At 28 times the protection I wouldn't have had a concussion in the first place so it is actually something to think about. I am paying about $400 a month for medication and in a constant worry that I will grow used to the medication and its effectiveness will fail. I already discovered that if I take these Saw Palmetto pills for enlarged prostate that it makes you pass the medication out more rapidly that you're supposed to and I start having micro-seizures.

I can't take any larger doses so that is always a problem.

I absolutely do not believe that a helmet can save your life and we've discussed this many times before. But I do believe that it can make the life you wouldn't have lost more livable.

F*cking hell another silly helmet thread. Well it keeps Frank and John B busy.......


Could you not tell the subject from the subject header? Sheesh!

If you don't want to read them, don't read them, Lou! What could be simpler?


--
- Frank Krygowski


I can do that as you can try not to respond to every helmet post. It took you less than 30 min for your first respond to the original post and after that another 8 posts of your usual same old same old. Do you have an algorithm running in the background scanning the word helmet and get a notification on you smartphone? Hey you are talking to us we can think for ourselves.. What is that obsession of yours about helmets? You don't wear one? OK. No one is forcing you. Have a nice day.

Lou


Good grief, what is YOUR obsession with what I choose to discuss? You don't
have to read about helmets, OK? No one is forcing you. Have a nice day.

(Oh, BTW: I was once stopped by police for riding without a helmet. I was on
vacation, stopped for the night at a B&B in a tiny town and had ridden three
blocks to and from a restaurant on a Sunday night in a zero-traffic residential
neighborhood. This was in New Brunswick, Canada. The cop claimed helmets were
mandatory in all of Canada. She was wrong, of course.)

- Frank Krygowski
  #44  
Old August 4th 19, 11:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,488
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 5:58:07 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 11:30:27 AM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 3:47:26 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/2/2019 6:21 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I just got an advertisement from Trek in which they now claim that the latest Wavecell has not 28 times but 48 times the protection for your head than normal foam.

I wonder if this is advertising BS or an actual improvement of the cell shape design. Since they are manufactured using a 3-D printing technology it is very simple for them to make improvements to the design.

At 28 times the protection I wouldn't have had a concussion in the first place so it is actually something to think about. I am paying about $400 a month for medication and in a constant worry that I will grow used to the medication and its effectiveness will fail. I already discovered that if I take these Saw Palmetto pills for enlarged prostate that it makes you pass the medication out more rapidly that you're supposed to and I start having micro-seizures.

I can't take any larger doses so that is always a problem.

I absolutely do not believe that a helmet can save your life and we've discussed this many times before. But I do believe that it can make the life you wouldn't have lost more livable.

Perhaps, for certain values of "can."

Maybe we'll someday see if the Wavecell makes a difference. In that
case, perhaps they can sell it to those that actually has the largest
number of TBI injuries. That surely does not include bicyclists, despite
all the dishonest hype. Ask any honest ER doctor or TBI specialist.

In any case, it's pretty clear conventional bike helmets aren't working.
Cyclist concussions have soared since bike helmets became popular - just
the opposite of what was promised.


--
- Frank Krygowski


Frank, please stop your invention. TBI has not "soared". In fact we have a smaller percentage of injuries and fatalities of bicyclists because they are more familiar to motorists these days and cycling becomes more common..


From "Senseless" in _Bicycling_ magazine, June 2013:

"Stat #3: As more people buckled on helmets, brain injuries also increased. Between 1997 and 2011 the number of bike-related concussions suffered annually by American riders *increased by 67 percent, from 9,327 to 15,546..."

See http://fliphtml5.com/yilc/ntnn/basic

- Frank Krygowski


That article makes no sense at all the way it's posted!

Cheers
  #45  
Old August 4th 19, 11:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,488
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:06:16 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 2:24:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 7:47:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 1:09 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 12:13:14 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 11:54 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

VBEG We all know you're extremely anti-helmet. LOL

I'm actually for honesty, for truthful presentation of data, and for
individual choice.

If I were anti-helmet, I'd be working to outlaw them. It would be
parallel to the helmeteers efforts to outlaw riding bikes without helmets.

Is there a mandatory helmet law where you live? (I believe so.) Which
side is imposing its will on the other side?

Wrong again Frank. There's no mandatory helmet law where I live.

Really? I thought you lived in Ontario.

From Wikipedia:
"The use of bicycle helmets is compulsory in the provinces of British
Columbia, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, and
Prince Edward Island.[12] In the provinces of Alberta, Manitoba, and
Ontario, the use of helmets is mandatory for cyclists under the age of
18 years of age.[13][14][15][16]"

Perhaps you're unaware of the law? If so, perhaps you should read up
before arguing.


Last time I looked this is rec.BICYCLES.tech not rec.pedestrians.tech or
rec.car.tech. Therefore most of us who talk about helmets here are
talking about helmets as they pertain to BICYCLING.

If that's how you feel, you should have taken your "smash a melon"
helmet promoting argument to rec.melons.tech, or some other such newsgroup.

Why are so many people so dedicated to claiming that only _bicyclists_
should (or must) wear helmets, as if bicycling has tremendous brain
injury risk? Do those people not understand the numbers? Or, like the
laws, do those people just not bother to examine them?

--
- Frank Krygowski


I'm over 18 thus there is NO mandatory helmet law for me.


I'm aware of that. But your statement was "There's no mandatory helmet law
where I live." That was clearly false. You should admit it.

There is a MHL in Ontario, but due largely to the efforts of a guy I happen to
correspond with, the law was amended so it doesn't apply to adults.

I'm quite sure that if the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL
would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski


BULL****! Frank. You do NOT know what I think!

Cheers
  #46  
Old August 4th 19, 11:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 4:36:55 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 5:47:38 PM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Yesterday evening, my wife and I rode the tandem out to a nearby town to
get dinner. We returned after sunset, happy to have our generator
headlight running.

But the sky still had quite a bit of light, especially as we started
home. In that situation, I find the bill of my cycling cap handy.
Shading the sky's brightness helps with low light vision. And it's even
handier when a car approaches with bright headlights.

The cycling cap makes it easy to adjust the position of the bill so the
glare is blocked but the road surface is visible.


--
- Frank Krygowski


I agree with Joy. Visors or a cap annoyingly block you field of view when riding in the drops or even low on the hoods. They are OK when riding more upright on a utility bike or ATB. I rely on good sunglasses when on my road bike.


Wear what you like. But the ride I described was on our drop bar tandem. I find
it perfectly easy to adjust the tilt of the cycling cap to put the visor in
precisely the right position. I did that several times during that ride.

You can't do that with a helmet that's cinched down as tight as specified.
I can do that easily with a cap.

(And I note that you're still following the dreaded helmet thread! How odd!)

- Frank Krygowski

  #47  
Old August 4th 19, 11:17 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:11:10 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 5:58:07 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 11:30:27 AM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, August 2, 2019 at 3:47:26 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/2/2019 6:21 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
I just got an advertisement from Trek in which they now claim that the latest Wavecell has not 28 times but 48 times the protection for your head than normal foam.

I wonder if this is advertising BS or an actual improvement of the cell shape design. Since they are manufactured using a 3-D printing technology it is very simple for them to make improvements to the design.

At 28 times the protection I wouldn't have had a concussion in the first place so it is actually something to think about. I am paying about $400 a month for medication and in a constant worry that I will grow used to the medication and its effectiveness will fail. I already discovered that if I take these Saw Palmetto pills for enlarged prostate that it makes you pass the medication out more rapidly that you're supposed to and I start having micro-seizures.

I can't take any larger doses so that is always a problem.

I absolutely do not believe that a helmet can save your life and we've discussed this many times before. But I do believe that it can make the life you wouldn't have lost more livable.

Perhaps, for certain values of "can."

Maybe we'll someday see if the Wavecell makes a difference. In that
case, perhaps they can sell it to those that actually has the largest
number of TBI injuries. That surely does not include bicyclists, despite
all the dishonest hype. Ask any honest ER doctor or TBI specialist.

In any case, it's pretty clear conventional bike helmets aren't working.
Cyclist concussions have soared since bike helmets became popular - just
the opposite of what was promised.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Frank, please stop your invention. TBI has not "soared". In fact we have a smaller percentage of injuries and fatalities of bicyclists because they are more familiar to motorists these days and cycling becomes more common.


From "Senseless" in _Bicycling_ magazine, June 2013:

"Stat #3: As more people buckled on helmets, brain injuries also increased. Between 1997 and 2011 the number of bike-related concussions suffered annually by American riders *increased by 67 percent, from 9,327 to 15,546..."

See http://fliphtml5.com/yilc/ntnn/basic

- Frank Krygowski


That article makes no sense at all the way it's posted!


Yes, it's garbled. I have a printed copy of the original. It used to be available
by searching www.bicycling.com but I just gave the first hit I came to. My
quotation is accurate.

- Frank Krygowski

  #48  
Old August 4th 19, 11:25 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,290
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:12:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:06:16 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 2:24:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 7:47:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 1:09 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 12:13:14 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 11:54 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

VBEG We all know you're extremely anti-helmet. LOL

I'm actually for honesty, for truthful presentation of data, and for
individual choice.

If I were anti-helmet, I'd be working to outlaw them. It would be
parallel to the helmeteers efforts to outlaw riding bikes without helmets.

Is there a mandatory helmet law where you live? (I believe so.) Which
side is imposing its will on the other side?

Wrong again Frank. There's no mandatory helmet law where I live.

Really? I thought you lived in Ontario.

From Wikipedia:
"The use of bicycle helmets is compulsory in the provinces of British
Columbia, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, and
Prince Edward Island.[12] In the provinces of Alberta, Manitoba, and
Ontario, the use of helmets is mandatory for cyclists under the age of
18 years of age.[13][14][15][16]"

Perhaps you're unaware of the law? If so, perhaps you should read up
before arguing.


Last time I looked this is rec.BICYCLES.tech not rec.pedestrians.tech or
rec.car.tech. Therefore most of us who talk about helmets here are
talking about helmets as they pertain to BICYCLING.

If that's how you feel, you should have taken your "smash a melon"
helmet promoting argument to rec.melons.tech, or some other such newsgroup.

Why are so many people so dedicated to claiming that only _bicyclists_
should (or must) wear helmets, as if bicycling has tremendous brain
injury risk? Do those people not understand the numbers? Or, like the
laws, do those people just not bother to examine them?

--
- Frank Krygowski

I'm over 18 thus there is NO mandatory helmet law for me.


I'm aware of that. But your statement was "There's no mandatory helmet law
where I live." That was clearly false. You should admit it.

There is a MHL in Ontario, but due largely to the efforts of a guy I happen to
correspond with, the law was amended so it doesn't apply to adults.

I'm quite sure that if the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL
would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski


BULL****! Frank. You do NOT know what I think!


The issue isn't so much what you think, Sir. It's what you did - or more
precisely, what you didn't do.

The person I'm alluding to was part of a lobbying group that worked hard against
an adult MHL for Ontario. The bill as originally written mandated helmets for
ALL bicyclists at ALL times, just as do the MHLs in British Columbia, New
Brunswick, Nova Scotia, PEI etc. The lobbying group in Ontario (largely led
by my friend) managed to convince legislators that adults should be allowed
to gasp! decide for themselves.

Now, Sir, were you part of that group? Did you contact your legislators? What
_did_ you do to allow freedom of choice?

I suspect you did nothing. I suspect that at the time, you were still arguing
ferociously in favor of helmets, using nonsense like "the melon test." IOW, if
the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski

  #49  
Old August 5th 19, 12:38 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joy Beeson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,366
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sun, 4 Aug 2019 15:15:11 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

Wear what you like. But the ride I described was on our drop bar tandem. I find
it perfectly easy to adjust the tilt of the cycling cap to put the visor in
precisely the right position. I did that several times during that ride.

You can't do that with a helmet that's cinched down as tight as specified.
I can do that easily with a cap.



I should have emphasized that I was speaking of rigid helmet visors.
Those are a disaster waiting to happen.

If I didn't need my Chuck Harris mirror, I'd wear a gilligan hat.
Visor all around, and one can turn bits up or down as required. When
I wore one, I sewed a chin strap onto it.

I started out securing my hat with a hatpin, but after rolling down
one of those steep slopes that border roads in the upper Hudson
Valley, I arose -- well, not pale and shaken, but strongly disposed to
go home and sew some twill tape to my hat.

I still have the hatpin. It's older than I am.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

  #50  
Old August 5th 19, 12:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,488
Default Trek/Bontrager Wavecell Technology Helmets

On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:25:38 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:12:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 6:06:16 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Sunday, August 4, 2019 at 2:24:17 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 7:47:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 1:09 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 12:13:14 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/3/2019 11:54 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

VBEG We all know you're extremely anti-helmet. LOL

I'm actually for honesty, for truthful presentation of data, and for
individual choice.

If I were anti-helmet, I'd be working to outlaw them. It would be
parallel to the helmeteers efforts to outlaw riding bikes without helmets.

Is there a mandatory helmet law where you live? (I believe so.) Which
side is imposing its will on the other side?

Wrong again Frank. There's no mandatory helmet law where I live..

Really? I thought you lived in Ontario.

From Wikipedia:
"The use of bicycle helmets is compulsory in the provinces of British
Columbia, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, and
Prince Edward Island.[12] In the provinces of Alberta, Manitoba, and
Ontario, the use of helmets is mandatory for cyclists under the age of
18 years of age.[13][14][15][16]"

Perhaps you're unaware of the law? If so, perhaps you should read up
before arguing.


Last time I looked this is rec.BICYCLES.tech not rec.pedestrians.tech or
rec.car.tech. Therefore most of us who talk about helmets here are
talking about helmets as they pertain to BICYCLING.

If that's how you feel, you should have taken your "smash a melon"
helmet promoting argument to rec.melons.tech, or some other such newsgroup.

Why are so many people so dedicated to claiming that only _bicyclists_
should (or must) wear helmets, as if bicycling has tremendous brain
injury risk? Do those people not understand the numbers? Or, like the
laws, do those people just not bother to examine them?

--
- Frank Krygowski

I'm over 18 thus there is NO mandatory helmet law for me.

I'm aware of that. But your statement was "There's no mandatory helmet law
where I live." That was clearly false. You should admit it.

There is a MHL in Ontario, but due largely to the efforts of a guy I happen to
correspond with, the law was amended so it doesn't apply to adults.

I'm quite sure that if the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL
would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski


BULL****! Frank. You do NOT know what I think!


The issue isn't so much what you think, Sir. It's what you did - or more
precisely, what you didn't do.

The person I'm alluding to was part of a lobbying group that worked hard against
an adult MHL for Ontario. The bill as originally written mandated helmets for
ALL bicyclists at ALL times, just as do the MHLs in British Columbia, New
Brunswick, Nova Scotia, PEI etc. The lobbying group in Ontario (largely led
by my friend) managed to convince legislators that adults should be allowed
to gasp! decide for themselves.

Now, Sir, were you part of that group? Did you contact your legislators? What
_did_ you do to allow freedom of choice?

I suspect you did nothing. I suspect that at the time, you were still arguing
ferociously in favor of helmets, using nonsense like "the melon test." IOW, if
the issue had been left up to you, the Ontario MHL would indeed apply to adults.

- Frank Krygowski


Frank, do you think that you are God that you know what others thousands of miles from you do/did/didn't do/know/think? I've seen so many posts by you where you take exception to events that happened very far from you. Exceptions wherein you stated that the person on the scene was wrong. It must be nice to be omniscient.

Cheers
 




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