A Cycling & bikes forum. CycleBanter.com

Go Back   Home » CycleBanter.com forum » rec.bicycles » Techniques
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

My CF Adventure



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old March 11th 13, 08:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jay Beattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,322
Default My CF Adventure

So, my friend is trying to sell his Specialized Roubaix, and he set me
up on the bike for a ride last Saturday. Not withstanding my status as
former Cat 3 and Masters pack-filler and renowned commuter, I had
never ridden a CF bike more than a few hundred yards. This was going
to be something new and exciting for me.

After not enough fussing getting the seat height and tilt right, we
took off for a hilly ride of 50-60 miles -- wow, the frame was stiff
through the BB and, most noticeably, through the front end --
substantially stiffer than my Cannondale warranty-replacement CAAD 9.
The magical dampening of CF was also evident, sort of. It clipped the
low amplitude, high frequency vibration that I associate with a dry
chain or slightly rough pavement -- the sort of thing you might pick
up through your shoes. Significant pavement discontinuities were
probably more pronounced on the Roubaix than on my CAAD 9, and the the
sound of a popped rock hitting the DT made me think I broke the
frame. It was an acoustically new adventure. But, the minor
dampening plus the longish chain stays and stiff front end gave the
bike the bike a very smooth, step on the gas feel on good pavement.

Getting me to fit on this frame meant extending the CF seat post
probably a foot -- and it didn't want to stay there. It kept
slipping, and my friend was freaking out at the thought that I might
over-torque the binder bolt and break the post. His pocket tool,
however, was some weird piece of garbage (a tiny T-wrench) that
wouldn't let me over-torque -- or even adequately torque -- anything.
I probably stopped five or six times, and the post wouldn't stop
slipping -- probably because it did not have enough magical CF paste
on it. This sucked -- and small changes in seat post height worsened
the saddle tilt problems. The post had a one-bolt saddle carriage
mechanism -- so you loosen one bolt, and the whole tilt/fore-aft
adjustment goes flaccid. F*** that! This is why I buy Thompson Elite
posts with a two bolt system. You can Princess and the Pea them to
your heart's content.

We head to the first hill -- about a four mile climb with the first
mile maxing out at 10-12 percent, and the bike was very responsive and
fast-feeling, except the reach was too short, and climbing out of the
saddle, I was sometimes hitting the bars with my knees -- and the
position was odd to me because of the tall front end and relatively
short TT. I'm used to being more over my front wheel.

The steep parts felt fast, but when I sat down, I felt like I was
riding a BMX bike because of the slipping post. That sucked, and so
did the mis-positioned BG saddle. But I did get the sense that the
bike was light(er) and faster than my Cannondale -- and more solid,
which is a big deal since I am a large rider. It tracked
exceptionally well descending.

My friend was worried that I would over-torque the post, and I was
getting a sore back, so we only rode that climb and one other for a
total of 30-40 miles. Alas, on my way home, River City was running
its annual sale, and I tried the same bike in a 64cm, which was nice
-- post stayed up, more room in the cockpit, still too high in the
front end, but flipping the stem would fix that. I almost impulsed
purchased. I really do like the stiff feeling of the front end and
BB. I decided to wait and do some more shopping, if any.

Epilog -- I went out the next day on my CAAD 9. Ahhh, nothing like a
bike that fits. The bike is less stiff -- not like an old Alan, but it
does not have the same riding on a slightly padded rail feel as the
Roubaix. This is not a huge difference, but noticeable. I have come
to believe that all the hyperbole in the press reduces to minor
differences, at least among similarly priced and purposed bikes. I
did a lot of climbing on Sunday, and the Cannonodale's front end
definitely felt less stiff. It also has a slight caster feel to it,
which some might characterize as twitchiness -- but it tracks very
well on fast descents. I just liked sitting and climbing on the
Cannondale, which is something I didn't have a chance to do on the
Roubaix, and I didn't feel like I was getting sapped of energy while
sitting. It has a stiff BB. It's the out of the saddle efforts where
it lacks somewhat. I might invest in a nice, stiff CF frame, but its
not like I have to.

-- Jay Beattie.


Ads
  #2  
Old March 11th 13, 08:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,323
Default My CF Adventure

On 3/11/2013 1:09 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:

snip

it lacks somewhat. I might invest in a nice, stiff CF frame, but its
not like I have to.


Based on the number of people that have had warranty replacements of
broken CF frames (including just the people I know personally) I'd be
hesitant about buying a used CF bicycle since I don't think the lifetime
frame warranty is transferable.

You've already had a warranty replacement of an aluminum frame and CF is
much more fragile. Of course it's also very easy to damage a CF frame in
a way that's not covered by the warranty and that might not be
detectable on a used bike (something that's much more difficult to do an
aluminum frame or steel frame bicycle such as carrying it on the wrong
type of car rack, putting in the wrong type of repair stand, or
attaching accessories that damage the tubing).

While it's best to avoid CF frame bicycles completely, unless you're a
sponsored racer, avoiding used CF frame bicycles is really something
that you want to do.
  #3  
Old March 11th 13, 08:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
gpsman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default My CF Adventure

On Mar 11, 4:09*pm, Jay Beattie wrote:

Epilog -- I went out the next day on my CAAD 9. *Ahhh, nothing like a
bike that fits.


Is there a substitute...?
-----

- gpsman
  #4  
Old March 11th 13, 08:56 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,056
Default My CF Adventure

On Mar 11, 4:09*pm, Jay Beattie wrote:
So, my friend is trying to sell his Specialized Roubaix, and he set me
up on the bike for a ride last Saturday. ...*I have come
to believe that all the hyperbole in the press reduces to minor
differences, at least among similarly priced and purposed bikes.


That's the heart of the issue, I think. Makers of expensive bikes
certainly test each others' wares, and it's unlikely that any one
manufacturer is going to be miles ahead of the competition. In a
sense, I think it's like competition between makers of high-end
acoustic guitars. They all play very well. They may look, sound or
feel slightly different, and people will have preferences. But buying
a new guitar won't change a hacker into a master.

It must have been much more interesting around 1890. Back then,
different bikes were truly different. About the only thing really
settled was the optimum number of wheels!

- Frank Krygowski
  #5  
Old March 12th 13, 12:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
datakoll
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,793
Default My CF Adventure

Jay, what auto(s) are in th garage ?

  #6  
Old March 12th 13, 01:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jay Beattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,322
Default My CF Adventure

On Mar 11, 5:22*pm, datakoll wrote:
Jay, what auto(s) are in th garage ?


'97 Toyota 4Runner (about 60K miles). The ski car -- going to
University of Utah with my son.
2011 Subaru Outback. The wife's car and general do it all car. Why?

-- Jay Beattie.
  #7  
Old March 12th 13, 01:43 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,727
Default My CF Adventure

On Monday, March 11, 2013 4:56:59 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Mar 11, 4:09*pm, Jay Beattie wrote:

So, my friend is trying to sell his Specialized Roubaix, and he set me


up on the bike for a ride last Saturday. ...*I have come


to believe that all the hyperbole in the press reduces to minor


differences, at least among similarly priced and purposed bikes.




That's the heart of the issue, I think. Makers of expensive bikes

certainly test each others' wares, and it's unlikely that any one

manufacturer is going to be miles ahead of the competition. In a

sense, I think it's like competition between makers of high-end

acoustic guitars. They all play very well. They may look, sound or

feel slightly different, and people will have preferences. But buying

a new guitar won't change a hacker into a master.



It must have been much more interesting around 1890. Back then,

different bikes were truly different. About the only thing really

settled was the optimum number of wheels!



- Frank Krygowski


I remember reading a comparison report about identical steel frames with identical groupsets tested by professional racers. The only way to tell the Columbus SL frame from the Tange Infinity frame was to weigh them. The racers didn't notice any differences in ride quality or handling.

Cheers
  #8  
Old March 12th 13, 03:10 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Dan O
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,098
Default My CF Adventure

On Mar 11, 6:43 pm, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, March 11, 2013 4:56:59 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Mar 11, 4:09 pm, Jay Beattie wrote:


So, my friend is trying to sell his Specialized Roubaix, and he set me


up on the bike for a ride last Saturday. ... I have come


to believe that all the hyperbole in the press reduces to minor


differences, at least among similarly priced and purposed bikes.


That's the heart of the issue, I think. Makers of expensive bikes


certainly test each others' wares, and it's unlikely that any one


manufacturer is going to be miles ahead of the competition. In a


sense, I think it's like competition between makers of high-end


acoustic guitars. They all play very well. They may look, sound or


feel slightly different, and people will have preferences. But buying


a new guitar won't change a hacker into a master.


It must have been much more interesting around 1890. Back then,


different bikes were truly different. About the only thing really


settled was the optimum number of wheels!


- Frank Krygowski


I remember reading a comparison report about identical steel frames with identical groupsets tested by professional racers. The only way to tell the Columbus SL frame from the Tange Infinity frame was to weigh them. The racers didn't notice any differences in ride quality or handling.


Ride any bike for a year and you'll tell the difference from any other
bike.


  #9  
Old March 12th 13, 01:26 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
datakoll
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,793
Default My CF Adventure

UH the route went past a CF Bike sale ? and the Buddy filled motor with trans oil ? Were you taken for a ride ?

I was gaga over the now ancient fiberglass 'wheels'

Tech contact patch then wide spectrum shock absrober leading to more precise contact patch attacks/turn in. Not mushy off course.

So with the Spec bikes tuned and tuned with R&D $$$$ "no rush dude just get it right and god help you if its MUSHY "

the 'buyer' may wind up...with a frame tuned shock absorber connected to the tire patch !

I would guess overall steel or Al this is the goal but CF allows composite tuning of epoxies/vinyls/fabrics......you know 'plasticizers' various euphimisms...

There's 4WD in the garage and a Subie. The turn in quo there prob feeds into the bike experience...caws with the Sunie uranot pedaling only sitting absorbing.

I would play with the ides of owning one for a while before committting. Riding position...??? aluminum. Ride several outside yopur current perception/physial approach.

Itsa big deal, who knows what you could arrive at ?

Ruminating further, with Pros you gotta understand what they're dping isnot what you can do. With me, I nunderstand I have problems even thinking abt coordinating what pros may or may not do or articulate.

With CF's spectrum of shock absorption placed on the road engineeringwise, effective cornering with intelligent...not always forthcoming...athleticism and uroff to a new level...if the position visavee CF is correct.

I doahn mean to sound pompous or authoritative, just spinning off from your excellent articlutae road test.

I'm still trying to find the time for trek bag sewing. The sewing table is built and in place !
  #10  
Old March 12th 13, 01:57 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,900
Default My CF Adventure

On 3/11/2013 4:09 PM, Jay Beattie wrote:
So, my friend is trying to sell his Specialized Roubaix, and he set me
up on the bike for a ride last Saturday. Not withstanding my status as
former Cat 3 and Masters pack-filler and renowned commuter, I had
never ridden a CF bike more than a few hundred yards. This was going
to be something new and exciting for me.

After not enough fussing getting the seat height and tilt right, we
took off for a hilly ride of 50-60 miles -- wow, the frame was stiff
through the BB and, most noticeably, through the front end --
substantially stiffer than my Cannondale warranty-replacement CAAD 9.
The magical dampening of CF was also evident, sort of. It clipped the
low amplitude, high frequency vibration that I associate with a dry
chain or slightly rough pavement -- the sort of thing you might pick
up through your shoes. Significant pavement discontinuities were
probably more pronounced on the Roubaix than on my CAAD 9, and the the
sound of a popped rock hitting the DT made me think I broke the
frame. It was an acoustically new adventure. But, the minor
dampening plus the longish chain stays and stiff front end gave the
bike the bike a very smooth, step on the gas feel on good pavement.

Getting me to fit on this frame meant extending the CF seat post
probably a foot -- and it didn't want to stay there. It kept
slipping, and my friend was freaking out at the thought that I might
over-torque the binder bolt and break the post. His pocket tool,
however, was some weird piece of garbage (a tiny T-wrench) that
wouldn't let me over-torque -- or even adequately torque -- anything.
I probably stopped five or six times, and the post wouldn't stop
slipping -- probably because it did not have enough magical CF paste
on it. This sucked -- and small changes in seat post height worsened
the saddle tilt problems. The post had a one-bolt saddle carriage
mechanism -- so you loosen one bolt, and the whole tilt/fore-aft
adjustment goes flaccid. F*** that! This is why I buy Thompson Elite
posts with a two bolt system. You can Princess and the Pea them to
your heart's content.

We head to the first hill -- about a four mile climb with the first
mile maxing out at 10-12 percent, and the bike was very responsive and
fast-feeling, except the reach was too short, and climbing out of the
saddle, I was sometimes hitting the bars with my knees -- and the
position was odd to me because of the tall front end and relatively
short TT. I'm used to being more over my front wheel.

The steep parts felt fast, but when I sat down, I felt like I was
riding a BMX bike because of the slipping post. That sucked, and so
did the mis-positioned BG saddle. But I did get the sense that the
bike was light(er) and faster than my Cannondale -- and more solid,
which is a big deal since I am a large rider. It tracked
exceptionally well descending.

My friend was worried that I would over-torque the post, and I was
getting a sore back, so we only rode that climb and one other for a
total of 30-40 miles. Alas, on my way home, River City was running
its annual sale, and I tried the same bike in a 64cm, which was nice
-- post stayed up, more room in the cockpit, still too high in the
front end, but flipping the stem would fix that. I almost impulsed
purchased. I really do like the stiff feeling of the front end and
BB. I decided to wait and do some more shopping, if any.

Epilog -- I went out the next day on my CAAD 9. Ahhh, nothing like a
bike that fits. The bike is less stiff -- not like an old Alan, but it
does not have the same riding on a slightly padded rail feel as the
Roubaix. This is not a huge difference, but noticeable. I have come
to believe that all the hyperbole in the press reduces to minor
differences, at least among similarly priced and purposed bikes. I
did a lot of climbing on Sunday, and the Cannonodale's front end
definitely felt less stiff. It also has a slight caster feel to it,
which some might characterize as twitchiness -- but it tracks very
well on fast descents. I just liked sitting and climbing on the
Cannondale, which is something I didn't have a chance to do on the
Roubaix, and I didn't feel like I was getting sapped of energy while
sitting. It has a stiff BB. It's the out of the saddle efforts where
it lacks somewhat. I might invest in a nice, stiff CF frame, but its
not like I have to.



Which Roubaix? I tested a Roubaix comp when I bought my Tarmac. I
liked the Roubaix on climbs. The frame was more similar to my old
Bianchi Volpe sports tour but I ended up opting for the tarmac. Just
preferred the ride and handling. Sometime when climbing I kick myself
but I'm mostly good with the choice.

But as you know, you need a bike that fits or you can't really judge
whether it's worth it.

As for the other posters comments about fragility of CF, I would guess
that my bike club of 400 people is 85% on CF and the only frame damage
that I've heard of is due to a couple of crashes that would have
probably broken aluminum frames.

The points about the lifetime warranty being non-transferable are true
though and would probably prevent me from buying a used CF frame.



 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fathers Day adventure(s) Bondo Unicycling 1 June 18th 08 01:02 AM
Tasmanian Adventure [email protected] General 0 March 15th 07 01:53 PM
Tasmanian Adventure [email protected] Mountain Biking 2 March 15th 07 01:48 AM
Do you have an Adventure web site? Craig Cherlet Racing 2 April 7th 05 04:52 AM
Do you have an Adventure web site? Craig Cherlet Unicycling 0 April 7th 05 03:59 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:16 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2018 CycleBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.