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Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands



 
 
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  #11  
Old August 23rd 14, 07:23 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_4_]
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Posts: 1,546
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
Per Lou Holtman:
I was in the Alpes
and Dolomites a month ago and the amount of eletric assisted ATB had
grown a lot since last year. I was passed on the Passo Pordoi on a 8%
stretch by such a bike at double the speed I rode.


I'm surprised to hear that. Maybe Ebikes have come along since I
started dabbling in them a few years back. My sense has been that the
power-to-weight ratio is still poor - even compared to mopeds.


Not so sure about that. A riding buddy was telling me last week about a
disabled friend of his with an electric assist bike that we kicking his
butt up on the Laurentians. Some nice hills there. He thought pretty
much what you do. Not sure which model it was though.

--
duane
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  #12  
Old August 23rd 14, 08:05 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
(PeteCresswell)
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Posts: 2,790
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

Per Lou Holtman:
- they look good now,


Lou's link
http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ut...o/IMAGE_87.jpg
sure looks good to me. Low CG, no extra weight in the wheel(s)....

Makes my own ebike look pretty primitive.

Looking at the battery, I'd say 8 AH max... but that's enough for quite
a bit of burst-mode-only riding. I can get 20 miles out of 4AH on my
"winter" bike - just using the battery when I start to need to
mouth-breathe.
--
Pete Cresswell
  #13  
Old August 23rd 14, 08:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
(PeteCresswell)
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Posts: 2,790
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

Per Duane:
Not so sure about that. A riding buddy was telling me last week about a
disabled friend of his with an electric assist bike that we kicking his
butt up on the Laurentians. Some nice hills there. He thought pretty
much what you do. Not sure which model it was though.


That takes me back to thinking that the power/weight ratio of batteries
has improved. Either that or the disabled friend weighs a lot less
than my 100 kg.
--
Pete Cresswell
  #14  
Old August 23rd 14, 08:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Clive George
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Posts: 5,394
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

On 23/08/2014 17:22, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Lou Holtman:
I was in the Alpes
and Dolomites a month ago and the amount of eletric assisted ATB had
grown a lot since last year. I was passed on the Passo Pordoi on a 8%
stretch by such a bike at double the speed I rode.


I'm surprised to hear that. Maybe Ebikes have come along since I
started dabbling in them a few years back. My sense has been that the
power-to-weight ratio is still poor - even compared to mopeds.


Electrics and electronics are improving. There's a lot of pressure to
improve battery capacity for small electronic devices (ie computers of
sizes from phone to laptop), and the resulting tech will feed into other
areas. People are also getting better at motors. This is all happening
quite quickly, ie what you saw a few years back is probably out of date now.

In Switzerland they have charging stations on popular routes and signs
warning people that electric bikes are faster than they think they are.
I saw a few for hire - looked quite respectable beasts, not shameful to
ride.


  #15  
Old August 23rd 14, 08:29 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_4_]
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Posts: 1,546
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
Per Duane:
Not so sure about that. A riding buddy was telling me last week about a
disabled friend of his with an electric assist bike that we kicking his
butt up on the Laurentians. Some nice hills there. He thought pretty
much what you do. Not sure which model it was though.


That takes me back to thinking that the power/weight ratio of batteries
has improved. Either that or the disabled friend weighs a lot less
than my 100 kg.


Don't know exactly but my friend said the guy with the ebike was larger
than him and he's around 190 LBS.
--
duane
  #16  
Old August 23rd 14, 08:59 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Posts: 10,422
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

On Saturday, August 23, 2014 8:05:19 PM UTC+1, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Lou Holtman:

- they look good now,




Lou's link

http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ut...o/IMAGE_87.jpg

sure looks good to me. Low CG, no extra weight in the wheel(s)....



Makes my own ebike look pretty primitive.



Looking at the battery, I'd say 8 AH max... but that's enough for quite

a bit of burst-mode-only riding. I can get 20 miles out of 4AH on my

"winter" bike - just using the battery when I start to need to

mouth-breathe.

--

Pete Cresswell


I have an 8.8Ah bottle battery that fits on the down tube and ride in a *very* hilly landscape but even on a 22km ride on which as a test I deliberately kept the throttle wide open on every hill, I still didn't manage to use up the battery. Normally I do what you, though a bit more scientifically. I wear a heart rate monitor belt that transmits to my iPhone on the handlebars by Bluetooth so that I have my heart rate before me all the time, and when it hits the permitted max, I either gear down or run the motor. That is, I use my bike as a pedal bike, with the motor filling in occasionally for advancing age and failing health. Works a treat. Money well spent on the conversion kit -- I did the job myself. I'd do it again in a flash.

It must be said though that almost every pedelec owner I meet is disgruntled with battery life. Not all batteries are born equal; I made sure to get the best Panasonic cells. Also, I am obsessive about charging the battery after every ride, no matter how short. I suspect those guys used their electric bikes with the throttle wide open all the time, with huge discharge rates up the hills, and recharged them only when empty. That's a most effective recipe for killing a battery.

Andre Jute
  #17  
Old August 23rd 14, 09:03 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Lou Holtman[_7_]
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Posts: 628
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
Per Lou Holtman:
- they look good now,


Lou's link
http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ut...o/IMAGE_87.jpg
sure looks good to me. Low CG, no extra weight in the wheel(s)....

Makes my own ebike look pretty primitive.

Looking at the battery, I'd say 8 AH max... but that's enough for quite
a bit of burst-mode-only riding. I can get 20 miles out of 4AH on my
"winter" bike - just using the battery when I start to need to
mouth-breathe.


Some other examples of utility/touring E bikes
http://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-i6...o/IMAGE_88.jpg

http://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Tb...o/IMAGE_89.jpg

Price range around 3500 euro



--
Lou
  #18  
Old August 23rd 14, 09:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
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Posts: 10,422
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

On Saturday, August 23, 2014 8:07:43 PM UTC+1, Clive George wrote:

In Switzerland they have charging stations on popular routes and signs

warning people that electric bikes are faster than they think they are.

I saw a few for hire - looked quite respectable beasts, not shameful to

ride.


You can anyway buy a proper bike and do a conversion.

For now, though, I'm staying away from the central motors. I looked into the popular one, the Bafang, because I like Bafang motors a lot. The problem is the way the software handles the gearchange. The Japanese have real torque-reading software already. The Chinese still use a torque simulation i.e. a best guess rather than a reading off the motor or the pedals. I'm not letting a best guess wreck my Rohloff gearbox, or even just wear out the sprocket faster than normal -- it isn't so expensive but it's a pain to change. The next or the next-but-one generation of the Chinese software should have a real torque reader and accompanying software, and then I might look into a mid-motor again. However, that will be just for the technical interest, not because there is anything wrong with my 8FUN/Bafang QSWXK installation, which works well with the bike and with me.

Andre Jute
  #19  
Old August 24th 14, 12:27 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 6,374
Default Cycling becomes electric assisted in the Netherlands

batteries....are before the flood in same category as loose chain protectors or rusty rocker panels....add the press on regardless attitudes and batteries get a baaaad press.

The lithium ions...as per Lieb...are typed as best drained then recharged. I assume that's E Bike batts or is there a mix of LiIon/acid ? The acids rule is down to 12V or suffer.

here's the well thought of Koga line's E



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHPVhiticC4

-Deluxe best test in E-bike test Consumers






During the annual independent electric bike test of the Consumers, the KOGA E-Deluxe as best test! Besides the quality of the support is tested on ride comfort, loading, ease of use, energy consumption and range. The KOGA E-Deluxe was declared the overall winner of the test. Koga also allowed for this model than the predicate "Best tested 'conduct.



The judgment of the Consumers on the E-Deluxe was as follows:

"This E-bike Koga supports long and well, and the brakes work remarkably well. Because of the nice equipment and other features, the E-Deluxe suitable for heavy sections in hilly terrain. "



View the E-Deluxe YouTube video





 




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