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Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)



 
 
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  #101  
Old September 11th 19, 11:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,490
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:22:18 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 09:42:30 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 11/09/2019 12:46 a.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

Cheers


My riding buddy, the paramedic installed a go pro on his bike for his
commute. He was getting tailgated, close passes etc. He planned to use
it to report idiots to his buddies at the police station. But found
that driver stopped most of the bull**** behavior. He thinks it's the
camera. So maybe just a fake camera would help? g


There was a "study" done in England (I think) that found the absolute
best defense against aggressive autos was a jacket with "POLICE"
printed on the back :-)

Frank lives in Ohio which is devoid of much of a cycling presence. When
cyclists are unique occurrences that astound and confound the unwashed
masses perhaps they are too shocked to pass and this gives him the
impression that he is in fact controlling the road. Seems to also work
on cops, preventing them from ticketing him for impeding.

Here in Montreal, it's a bit different. C
https://globalnews.ca/news/5760125/m...-tickets-2018/


--
cheers,

John B.


That'd get you charged with impersonating a police officer. LOL

Cheers
Ads
  #102  
Old September 11th 19, 11:40 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jOHN b.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 824
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 15:32:49 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:22:18 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 09:42:30 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 11/09/2019 12:46 a.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

Cheers


My riding buddy, the paramedic installed a go pro on his bike for his
commute. He was getting tailgated, close passes etc. He planned to use
it to report idiots to his buddies at the police station. But found
that driver stopped most of the bull**** behavior. He thinks it's the
camera. So maybe just a fake camera would help? g


There was a "study" done in England (I think) that found the absolute
best defense against aggressive autos was a jacket with "POLICE"
printed on the back :-)

Frank lives in Ohio which is devoid of much of a cycling presence. When
cyclists are unique occurrences that astound and confound the unwashed
masses perhaps they are too shocked to pass and this gives him the
impression that he is in fact controlling the road. Seems to also work
on cops, preventing them from ticketing him for impeding.

Here in Montreal, it's a bit different. C
https://globalnews.ca/news/5760125/m...-tickets-2018/


--
cheers,

John B.


That'd get you charged with impersonating a police officer. LOL

Cheers


Although that isn't the point the test actually misspelled "police" on
the jackets for that reason.

The point of the study was, of course, to determine whether most
autos are aware of what is going on the highway act in response to
actual conditions.

Which the study deemed was the fact.

For example the study found that cars gave a bicycle much more room
when passing when the rider was wearing his jacket than when the same
rider was not wearing his jacket.
--
cheers,

John B.

  #103  
Old September 11th 19, 11:41 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,598
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On 9/11/2019 6:28 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 12:43:27 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 12:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I


I think the guy was riding in the worst possible position. It looks like
there are four feet of paved shoulder outside the rumble strips. Absent
piles of shoulder debris, why not ride there?

If that shoulder were not present, yes, I would have been toward lane
center. Given the speed limit on the road, I'd probably have paid
attention to my mirror. But in my considerable experience, motorists
would have seen me and slowed down or changed lanes. I've never had to
leave the road to avoid a crash from behind.

Incidentally, that lane does look wide. If a motorist didn't change
lanes (perhaps because the inside lane was occupied), when he slowed I'd
probably move toward the fog line. If he's proven he sees me and is
adjusting to my presence, I show that cooperation when feasible. (If the
lane were too narrow to share I'd stay centered.)

All of this works. It's what I do, and I seem to be the guy here who
complains the least about close passes, crashes, etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski


Frank, did you watch the video? The driver never even slowed down thus showing that they most likely could not see the bicyclist. I've read that the driver had a hand up as if trying to shield from sun glare. thus the driver would not have seen the bicyclists even had the bicyclist been in the center of the lane. Notice that the other lanes were devoid of traffic when she hit the bicyclist? If the driver could not see ahead of them then the driver should have slowed down a lot.


I watched the video. My answer was based on that. I said he was riding
in the worst possible position. The shoulder looks clear, and I would
have been there.

About the sun: In the video, the telltale sign of a low sun hazard was
not apparent. That sign is your shadow stretching out _long_ toward the
driver. It indicates that the sun is low in the sky and aligned with
your position. I've advised my club mates that if that's the case, stay
off that road until it's safe. If I saw that danger when riding there, I
would have adjusted, perhaps by waiting 20 minutes before proceeding.

Sometimes I don't understand your logic, Sir. I'm saying he was riding
in the worst possible position. Are you claiming he was doing everything
right? Really? Despite your evidence?


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #104  
Old September 12th 19, 12:05 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,490
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:41:11 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 6:28 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 12:43:27 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 12:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

I think the guy was riding in the worst possible position. It looks like
there are four feet of paved shoulder outside the rumble strips. Absent
piles of shoulder debris, why not ride there?

If that shoulder were not present, yes, I would have been toward lane
center. Given the speed limit on the road, I'd probably have paid
attention to my mirror. But in my considerable experience, motorists
would have seen me and slowed down or changed lanes. I've never had to
leave the road to avoid a crash from behind.

Incidentally, that lane does look wide. If a motorist didn't change
lanes (perhaps because the inside lane was occupied), when he slowed I'd
probably move toward the fog line. If he's proven he sees me and is
adjusting to my presence, I show that cooperation when feasible. (If the
lane were too narrow to share I'd stay centered.)

All of this works. It's what I do, and I seem to be the guy here who
complains the least about close passes, crashes, etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski


Frank, did you watch the video? The driver never even slowed down thus showing that they most likely could not see the bicyclist. I've read that the driver had a hand up as if trying to shield from sun glare. thus the driver would not have seen the bicyclists even had the bicyclist been in the center of the lane. Notice that the other lanes were devoid of traffic when she hit the bicyclist? If the driver could not see ahead of them then the driver should have slowed down a lot.


I watched the video. My answer was based on that. I said he was riding
in the worst possible position. The shoulder looks clear, and I would
have been there.

About the sun: In the video, the telltale sign of a low sun hazard was
not apparent. That sign is your shadow stretching out _long_ toward the
driver. It indicates that the sun is low in the sky and aligned with
your position. I've advised my club mates that if that's the case, stay
off that road until it's safe. If I saw that danger when riding there, I
would have adjusted, perhaps by waiting 20 minutes before proceeding.

Sometimes I don't understand your logic, Sir. I'm saying he was riding
in the worst possible position. Are you claiming he was doing everything
right? Really? Despite your evidence?


--
- Frank Krygowski


No. What I'm saying is that is was a clear day, and there were empty lanes to the left of the bicyclist and that the driver who struck him was NOT paying attention to the road or was distracted by something inside the vehicle - perhaps a cell phone. I'm also saying that because of that it's most likely that being in the center of that left hand lane would have done that bicyclist no good whatsoever. It reminds me a lot of my adventure approaching a very narrow bridge when three semi-trucks were coming up from behind me, one of which had t he trailer wheels over the fog line. I elected to bail off the road rather than take the chance of being run down on that bridge where there was no place to move to. Frank, sometimes being in the center of a lane just isn't enough when a vehicle coming up behind you is being driven by a sleepy or distracted driver.. and no I'm not moving from here. LOL

Cheers
  #105  
Old September 12th 19, 12:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,490
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:41:11 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 6:28 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 12:43:27 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 12:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

I think the guy was riding in the worst possible position. It looks like
there are four feet of paved shoulder outside the rumble strips. Absent
piles of shoulder debris, why not ride there?

If that shoulder were not present, yes, I would have been toward lane
center. Given the speed limit on the road, I'd probably have paid
attention to my mirror. But in my considerable experience, motorists
would have seen me and slowed down or changed lanes. I've never had to
leave the road to avoid a crash from behind.

Incidentally, that lane does look wide. If a motorist didn't change
lanes (perhaps because the inside lane was occupied), when he slowed I'd
probably move toward the fog line. If he's proven he sees me and is
adjusting to my presence, I show that cooperation when feasible. (If the
lane were too narrow to share I'd stay centered.)

All of this works. It's what I do, and I seem to be the guy here who
complains the least about close passes, crashes, etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski


Frank, did you watch the video? The driver never even slowed down thus showing that they most likely could not see the bicyclist. I've read that the driver had a hand up as if trying to shield from sun glare. thus the driver would not have seen the bicyclists even had the bicyclist been in the center of the lane. Notice that the other lanes were devoid of traffic when she hit the bicyclist? If the driver could not see ahead of them then the driver should have slowed down a lot.


I watched the video. My answer was based on that. I said he was riding
in the worst possible position. The shoulder looks clear, and I would
have been there.

About the sun: In the video, the telltale sign of a low sun hazard was
not apparent. That sign is your shadow stretching out _long_ toward the
driver. It indicates that the sun is low in the sky and aligned with
your position. I've advised my club mates that if that's the case, stay
off that road until it's safe. If I saw that danger when riding there, I
would have adjusted, perhaps by waiting 20 minutes before proceeding.

Sometimes I don't understand your logic, Sir. I'm saying he was riding
in the worst possible position. Are you claiming he was doing everything
right? Really? Despite your evidence?


--
- Frank Krygowski


Oh, I also find it interesting and amusing that you so dislike bicyclists who say to ride to the right of a lane yet you say this person should not have been on the road at all but should have been riding on the shoulder.

Cheers
  #106  
Old September 12th 19, 12:25 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jOHN b.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 824
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 16:07:23 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:41:11 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 6:28 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 12:43:27 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 12:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

I think the guy was riding in the worst possible position. It looks like
there are four feet of paved shoulder outside the rumble strips. Absent
piles of shoulder debris, why not ride there?

If that shoulder were not present, yes, I would have been toward lane
center. Given the speed limit on the road, I'd probably have paid
attention to my mirror. But in my considerable experience, motorists
would have seen me and slowed down or changed lanes. I've never had to
leave the road to avoid a crash from behind.

Incidentally, that lane does look wide. If a motorist didn't change
lanes (perhaps because the inside lane was occupied), when he slowed I'd
probably move toward the fog line. If he's proven he sees me and is
adjusting to my presence, I show that cooperation when feasible. (If the
lane were too narrow to share I'd stay centered.)

All of this works. It's what I do, and I seem to be the guy here who
complains the least about close passes, crashes, etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski

Frank, did you watch the video? The driver never even slowed down thus showing that they most likely could not see the bicyclist. I've read that the driver had a hand up as if trying to shield from sun glare. thus the driver would not have seen the bicyclists even had the bicyclist been in the center of the lane. Notice that the other lanes were devoid of traffic when she hit the bicyclist? If the driver could not see ahead of them then the driver should have slowed down a lot.


I watched the video. My answer was based on that. I said he was riding
in the worst possible position. The shoulder looks clear, and I would
have been there.

About the sun: In the video, the telltale sign of a low sun hazard was
not apparent. That sign is your shadow stretching out _long_ toward the
driver. It indicates that the sun is low in the sky and aligned with
your position. I've advised my club mates that if that's the case, stay
off that road until it's safe. If I saw that danger when riding there, I
would have adjusted, perhaps by waiting 20 minutes before proceeding.

Sometimes I don't understand your logic, Sir. I'm saying he was riding
in the worst possible position. Are you claiming he was doing everything
right? Really? Despite your evidence?


--
- Frank Krygowski


Oh, I also find it interesting and amusing that you so dislike bicyclists who say to ride to the right of a lane yet you say this person should not have been on the road at all but should have been riding on the shoulder.

Cheers


I think it is a matter of relative speed. If the bicycle is moving at
approximately the speed of the other traffic than perhaps "taking the
lane" is a logical act.

But the roads I ride on are major links between cities and as a result
you may have 3 lanes of traffic going your way, A lane of heavy
trucks, generally going 100km on the level in the outside lane and two
lanes of autos doing in excess of 100 km., sometimes far in excess of
100 kpm.

Taking the lane in those circumstances would mean a 40 foot truck
hauling a 40 ft trailer and loaded with 60 tons (container weight) of
cargo having to brake some 2/3rds of its speed to avoid hitting the
bicycle thundering along at 30 kph.
--
cheers,

John B.

  #107  
Old September 12th 19, 01:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,598
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On 9/11/2019 6:40 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 15:32:49 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:22:18 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 09:42:30 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 11/09/2019 12:46 a.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

Cheers


My riding buddy, the paramedic installed a go pro on his bike for his
commute. He was getting tailgated, close passes etc. He planned to use
it to report idiots to his buddies at the police station. But found
that driver stopped most of the bull**** behavior. He thinks it's the
camera. So maybe just a fake camera would help? g


There was a "study" done in England (I think) that found the absolute
best defense against aggressive autos was a jacket with "POLICE"
printed on the back :-)

Frank lives in Ohio which is devoid of much of a cycling presence. When
cyclists are unique occurrences that astound and confound the unwashed
masses perhaps they are too shocked to pass and this gives him the
impression that he is in fact controlling the road. Seems to also work
on cops, preventing them from ticketing him for impeding.

Here in Montreal, it's a bit different. C
https://globalnews.ca/news/5760125/m...-tickets-2018/


--
cheers,

John B.


That'd get you charged with impersonating a police officer. LOL

Cheers


Although that isn't the point the test actually misspelled "police" on
the jackets for that reason.

The point of the study was, of course, to determine whether most
autos are aware of what is going on the highway act in response to
actual conditions.

Which the study deemed was the fact.

For example the study found that cars gave a bicycle much more room
when passing when the rider was wearing his jacket than when the same
rider was not wearing his jacket.


On another forum, a person posted that he seemed to get much more abuse
from motorists when he was decked out in sport cycling garb compared to
when he rode in normal clothing.

I can't say I've noticed that, personally, but I can imagine some
drivers might be triggered by certain stereotypes.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #108  
Old September 12th 19, 01:58 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,598
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On 9/11/2019 7:05 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:41:11 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 6:28 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 12:43:27 UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/11/2019 12:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

I think the guy was riding in the worst possible position. It looks like
there are four feet of paved shoulder outside the rumble strips. Absent
piles of shoulder debris, why not ride there?

If that shoulder were not present, yes, I would have been toward lane
center. Given the speed limit on the road, I'd probably have paid
attention to my mirror. But in my considerable experience, motorists
would have seen me and slowed down or changed lanes. I've never had to
leave the road to avoid a crash from behind.

Incidentally, that lane does look wide. If a motorist didn't change
lanes (perhaps because the inside lane was occupied), when he slowed I'd
probably move toward the fog line. If he's proven he sees me and is
adjusting to my presence, I show that cooperation when feasible. (If the
lane were too narrow to share I'd stay centered.)

All of this works. It's what I do, and I seem to be the guy here who
complains the least about close passes, crashes, etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski

Frank, did you watch the video? The driver never even slowed down thus showing that they most likely could not see the bicyclist. I've read that the driver had a hand up as if trying to shield from sun glare. thus the driver would not have seen the bicyclists even had the bicyclist been in the center of the lane. Notice that the other lanes were devoid of traffic when she hit the bicyclist? If the driver could not see ahead of them then the driver should have slowed down a lot.


I watched the video. My answer was based on that. I said he was riding
in the worst possible position. The shoulder looks clear, and I would
have been there.

About the sun: In the video, the telltale sign of a low sun hazard was
not apparent. That sign is your shadow stretching out _long_ toward the
driver. It indicates that the sun is low in the sky and aligned with
your position. I've advised my club mates that if that's the case, stay
off that road until it's safe. If I saw that danger when riding there, I
would have adjusted, perhaps by waiting 20 minutes before proceeding.

Sometimes I don't understand your logic, Sir. I'm saying he was riding
in the worst possible position. Are you claiming he was doing everything
right? Really? Despite your evidence?


--
- Frank Krygowski


No. What I'm saying is that is was a clear day, and there were empty lanes to the left of the bicyclist and that the driver who struck him was NOT paying attention to the road or was distracted by something inside the vehicle - perhaps a cell phone. I'm also saying that because of that it's most likely that being in the center of that left hand lane would have done that bicyclist no good whatsoever.


This isn't the only discussion forum I visit. On another, there are
cyclists who are much more militant than I am about taking the lane.
There are also many whose views pretty much match my own. (I'll restate
some of my views below your next post, where you give evidence of
misunderstanding.)

But many of those people have pointed out that even distracted drivers
are more likely to be safer around lane-center bicyclists. Why? Because
a bicyclist in the center of the lane is _relevant_. A driver who's not
driving an autopilot car (Tesla, etc.) _must_ glance at the road at
least occasionally. The theory is that drivers watching TV on their
phones, or whatever, still take notice of a lane-centered cyclist
because it's immediately obvious they must react somehow. But that those
drivers ignore an edge cyclist because they consciously or
unconsciously judge "He's out of the way. He doesn't matter."

Whatever the psychological details, it works for me. I tend to ride near
lane center even on wide roads. If the lane is safe to share, I move
right only when the motor vehicle approaches. As a bonus, I think it
signals to the motorist that I've "done something for them." My riding
experience is much better since I began doing that.


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #109  
Old September 12th 19, 02:06 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,598
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On 9/11/2019 7:07 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

Oh, I also find it interesting and amusing that you so dislike bicyclists who say to ride to the right of a lane yet you say this person should not have been on the road at all but should have been riding on the shoulder.


To correct your beliefs about my views:

1) You seem to forget the dozens of times I've pointed out that I share
lanes that are wide enough to share.

2) I don't "dislike cyclists who say to ride to the right of a lane."
Some lanes are fine for sharing. But riding too far right can be
hazardous, and I don't think a person should endanger themselves by
tempting motorists to squeeze by.

3) I have done hundreds of miles on wide shoulders, especially when
riding freeways in the western U.S. There are sometimes legal
complications - one cycling lawyer of my acquaintance believes that a
shoulder cyclist may be forfeiting his rights if (say) a motorist pulls
out across his path, right hooks or left crosses him. The logic is that
in most jurisdictions, those would be offenses if the rider were in the
roadway; but the shoulder is not part of the official roadway.

I don't know much about that legal argument. But in certain cases, I
think the shoulder is the best place to be. The video shows one example.

In summary, I'm not saying anything here that I haven't said a dozen
times before. You're imagining an argument that doesn't exist.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #110  
Old September 12th 19, 02:09 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jOHN b.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 824
Default Yet another cyclist killed. pH (Several, actually)

On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 20:48:37 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 9/11/2019 6:40 PM, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 15:32:49 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 18:22:18 UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Sep 2019 09:42:30 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 11/09/2019 12:46 a.m., Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, 11 September 2019 00:01:43 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 10 Sep 2019 09:05:29 -0700 (PDT), pH wrote:

I wonder if there's a market for a "Google Glass" type of thing
w/ a back-facing camera displayed on a forward screen full time.
Hmm.

pH in Aptos

Rear view bicycle cameras already exist:
https://www.google.com/search?q=bicycle+rear+view+camera&tbm=isch
You might also consider an automotive dashboard camera, which usually
has a rear view camera included.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

A good rear-view camera can really help if this happens. Frank will say the bicyclist should have been lane center but I don't think that would have helped in this case.

youtube.com/watch?v=QYMKp71vW-I

Cheers


My riding buddy, the paramedic installed a go pro on his bike for his
commute. He was getting tailgated, close passes etc. He planned to use
it to report idiots to his buddies at the police station. But found
that driver stopped most of the bull**** behavior. He thinks it's the
camera. So maybe just a fake camera would help? g


There was a "study" done in England (I think) that found the absolute
best defense against aggressive autos was a jacket with "POLICE"
printed on the back :-)

Frank lives in Ohio which is devoid of much of a cycling presence. When
cyclists are unique occurrences that astound and confound the unwashed
masses perhaps they are too shocked to pass and this gives him the
impression that he is in fact controlling the road. Seems to also work
on cops, preventing them from ticketing him for impeding.

Here in Montreal, it's a bit different. C
https://globalnews.ca/news/5760125/m...-tickets-2018/


--
cheers,

John B.

That'd get you charged with impersonating a police officer. LOL

Cheers


Although that isn't the point the test actually misspelled "police" on
the jackets for that reason.

The point of the study was, of course, to determine whether most
autos are aware of what is going on the highway act in response to
actual conditions.

Which the study deemed was the fact.

For example the study found that cars gave a bicycle much more room
when passing when the rider was wearing his jacket than when the same
rider was not wearing his jacket.


On another forum, a person posted that he seemed to get much more abuse
from motorists when he was decked out in sport cycling garb compared to
when he rode in normal clothing.

I can't say I've noticed that, personally, but I can imagine some
drivers might be triggered by certain stereotypes.


I suspect that a lot of it is perception. I read here a lot about
being passed too closely but, honestly, I've never been passed closely
enough that I remembered it by the end of the ride.

Not to say it never happens but it has never happened to me. And I do
ride on major highways. Right next to the big 20 wheel trucks. You
know, the guys that get blamed for not seeing the bicycle way back
there next to the trailer.

Can it be that people here are just more friendly? I doubt it. Road
rage is very common here, just the other day the news had an account
of some one getting "cut off" so he pulled a gun and shot the
offending driver.

I suspect that it is an effect of the "Danger! Danger!" factor.
Bicycles are dangerous to ride and thus danger has to be seen to
happen.

Here, if you went down to the open market where the housewives on
their bicycles are buying the day's groceries and asked the first five
people you met if bicycles are dangerous, you'd get two "no's" and
three head shakes, as to say, "who is this loony".
--
cheers,

John B.

 




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