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Another Fogel Lie from the Archives



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 5th 08, 01:16 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
Ozark Bicycle
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Posts: 3,591
Default Another Fogel Lie from the Archives

On Feb 4, 10:16*pm, Tom Sherman
wrote:
Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Tom, have you really been holding onto a grudge against Carl for this
pretty minor affront since 2004?!?!


I had hardly thought of it until the recent flare up. However, I
apparently have exceptional memory retention for events.


I almost admire your single-mindedness, though I gravely doubt your
sense of proportion.


Have you noticed that Mr. Fogel has pretended I do not exist since that
episode? What is your comment on that?


Killfiles work.


The longer version is that there's no such thing as a right to be paid
attention to. If anyone cares to ignore my posts, I don't hold it
against them. Ignoring people on Usenet does not reflect badly on the
ignorer, who may have any number of reasons.


Thinking that being ignored is a big deal reflects badly only on the
person doing it....


So why do I get held to a different standard than Mr. Fogel? Why is my
remembering that he falsely accused me of lying different than Mr. Fogel
still having me in a kill-file over three (3) years later?



IMO, you might be "held to a different standard" because people
already *know* what a sleazy, weasel-like wacko Carl Fogel is.

Some tolerate Fogel because they "enjoy" his Google scrounging
"finds", the same way a family tolerates a vicious dog because it
"protects" the homestead.
Ads
  #2  
Old February 6th 08, 03:41 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
Bob Dole
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Posts: 47
Default Another Fogel Lie from the Archives

On Feb 5, 6:16*am, Ozark Bicycle
wrote:
On Feb 4, 10:16*pm, Tom Sherman
wrote:





Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Tom, have you really been holding onto a grudge against Carl for this
pretty minor affront since 2004?!?!


I had hardly thought of it until the recent flare up. However, I
apparently have exceptional memory retention for events.


I almost admire your single-mindedness, though I gravely doubt your
sense of proportion.


Have you noticed that Mr. Fogel has pretended I do not exist since that
episode? What is your comment on that?


Killfiles work.


The longer version is that there's no such thing as a right to be paid
attention to. If anyone cares to ignore my posts, I don't hold it
against them. Ignoring people on Usenet does not reflect badly on the
ignorer, who may have any number of reasons.


Thinking that being ignored is a big deal reflects badly only on the
person doing it....


So why do I get held to a different standard than Mr. Fogel? Why is my
remembering that he falsely accused me of lying different than Mr. Fogel
still having me in a kill-file over three (3) years later?


IMO, you might be "held to a different standard" because people
already *know* what a sleazy, weasel-like wacko Carl Fogel is.

Some tolerate Fogel because they "enjoy" his Google scrounging
"finds", the same way a family tolerates a vicious dog because it
"protects" the homestead.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


In the Sheldon Brown thread, Peter Cole wrote something that may be
apropos he

"A few years ago, I was
involved in a rather sharp exchange on a local (Boston) bike list. I
don't remember who brought it up when I next visited Sheldon's shop,
but
I started to go on about how rigid, etc. I thought the other guy was.
Sheldon only looked pained. "You both are good guys," he said "you
should be friends." He was right, as usual. He couldn't see the sense
of
two people with so much in common getting petty over some trivial
issue.
It genuinely bothered him that two people he liked could fail to like
each other.

We are in this group because of our connection to cycling, and on
this
thread because of our connection to Sheldon. The things that bring us
together are deep, those that divide us, shallow. I feel a little
awkward, he'd never sermonize like this, but I know that's the way he
felt. "



  #3  
Old February 6th 08, 04:13 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
Ozark Bicycle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,591
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from thearchives)

On Feb 6, 8:41*am, Bob Dole wrote:
On Feb 5, 6:16*am, Ozark Bicycle



wrote:
On Feb 4, 10:16*pm, Tom Sherman
wrote:


Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Ryan Cousineau wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Sherman wrote:


Tom, have you really been holding onto a grudge against Carl for this
pretty minor affront since 2004?!?!


I had hardly thought of it until the recent flare up. However, I
apparently have exceptional memory retention for events.


I almost admire your single-mindedness, though I gravely doubt your
sense of proportion.


Have you noticed that Mr. Fogel has pretended I do not exist since that
episode? What is your comment on that?


Killfiles work.


The longer version is that there's no such thing as a right to be paid
attention to. If anyone cares to ignore my posts, I don't hold it
against them. Ignoring people on Usenet does not reflect badly on the
ignorer, who may have any number of reasons.


Thinking that being ignored is a big deal reflects badly only on the
person doing it....


So why do I get held to a different standard than Mr. Fogel? Why is my
remembering that he falsely accused me of lying different than Mr. Fogel
still having me in a kill-file over three (3) years later?


IMO, you might be "held to a different standard" because people
already *know* what a sleazy, weasel-like wacko Carl Fogel is.


Some tolerate Fogel because they "enjoy" his Google scrounging
"finds", the same way a family tolerates a vicious dog because it
"protects" the homestead.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


In the Sheldon Brown thread, Peter Cole wrote something that may be
apropos he

"A few years ago, I was
involved in a rather sharp exchange on a local (Boston) bike list. I
don't remember who brought it up when I next visited Sheldon's shop,
but
I started to go on about how rigid, etc. I thought the other guy was.
Sheldon only looked pained. "You both are good guys," he said "you
should be friends." He was right, as usual. He couldn't see the sense
of
two people with so much in common getting petty over some trivial
issue.
It genuinely bothered him that two people he liked could fail to like
each other.

We are in this group because of our connection to cycling, and on
this
thread because of our connection to Sheldon. The things that bring us
together are deep, those that divide us, shallow. I feel a little
awkward, he'd never sermonize like this, but I know that's the way he
felt. "


Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).
  #4  
Old February 6th 08, 05:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,673
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from thearchives)

On Feb 6, 10:13 am, Ozark Bicycle
wrote:


Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


I'll wager the other guy also did not put the name of his opponent in
the heading of a thread, using it specifically to defame him. Only a
few here have ever stooped to that level.

- Frank Krygowski

  #5  
Old February 6th 08, 08:23 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
Andre Jute
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 433
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from thearchives)

Ozark Bicycle wrote:

that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


No doubt Fogel justified these foul deeds with lipsmacking moralizing
about how the people whose families he assaulted were "liars". Only in
Fogel-land is the unproven (in Fogel *telepathy* future) sins of the
fathers visited on the wives and children by some self-appointed
internet hero called Carl Fogel.

It is despicable for trash like Carl Fogel to react to his petty fear
of brighter people on the newsgroup by including their friends and
families in his sneaky attacks. It is no doubt starting to dawn on
some why from the beginning I called Fogel "scum".

It is not difficult to spot scumbags of Fogel's type. For a start they
always have a loyal gang to blow smoke over their crimes, in this case
Michael Press and Ryan Cousineau and Frank Krygowski and some
campfollowers whose names I can't be bothered to remember. For
another, they cannot help conforming to their own pattern of
psychopathology: Fogel, for instance, doesn't appear to understand
that it is immoral and wrong for him to substitute his personal likes
and dislikes and fears for the due democratic process in which someone
is innocent until proven guilty; his repeated false accusations, his
repeated cries of "liar", his stoking up of his gang into a lynch mob,
demonstrate his disease to use all too visibly.

Andre Jute
A little, a very little thought will suffice. -- J M Keynes
  #6  
Old February 7th 08, 01:25 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.misc
John Forrest Tomlinson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,564
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from the archives)

On Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:13:02 -0800 (PST), Ozark Bicycle
wrote:

Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


Dude, you're such a stud to pile on an older man.

Hey, are you coming to NYC?
  #8  
Old February 7th 08, 03:16 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.misc
Tom Nakashima
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 497
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from the archives)


On Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:13:02 -0800 (PST), Ozark Bicycle
wrote:

Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


This is interesting, what do you mean by 1st hand experience?
-tom


  #9  
Old February 7th 08, 03:24 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech, rec.bicycles.misc
Ozark Bicycle
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,591
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from thearchives)

On Feb 7, 8:16*am, "Tom Nakashima" wrote:
On Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:13:02 -0800 (PST), Ozark Bicycle
wrote:


Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


This is interesting, what do you mean by 1st hand experience?
-tom


IOW, it happened to me, and Carl Fogel was the perp.
  #10  
Old February 7th 08, 03:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.misc
Tom Nakashima
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 497
Default The foul deeds of Carl Fogel (was: Another Fogel Lie from the archives)


"Ozark Bicycle" wrote in message
...
On Feb 7, 8:16 am, "Tom Nakashima" wrote:
On Wed, 6 Feb 2008 07:13:02 -0800 (PST), Ozark Bicycle
wrote:


Peter Cole may have thought the other guy "rigid", but I'll wager that
that guy did not forward private emails, unsolicited, to a third party
nor send out nasty snail mails to other posters family members. Fogel
has committed both those foul deeds (I know this from first hand
experience).


This is interesting, what do you mean by 1st hand experience?
-tom


IOW, it happened to me, and Carl Fogel was the perp.


So was it a personal attack against you or your family, or an attack
on your business?
It sounds quite serious, but this is the first time I heard of a newsgroup
member going outside of the RBT boundaries for personal attacks.
-tom


 




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