Experiment determines drivers do not see 22% of cyclists in clearview.

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 5:34:29 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Did it really? If so, why didn't you use the space?

I use a mirror, and I was watching his trajectory. It was clear he'd
pass close, but not hit me.


--
- Frank Krygowski

I was using a mirror the day I elected to bail when I saw that big 18-wheeler bearing down on me and with it's tires over the fog line. NO WAY WAS THAT TRUCK SLOWING let alone stopping.

You sure do live a charmed life Frank.

Cheers

On 6/1/2015 5:40 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 5:34:29 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Did it really? If so, why didn't you use the space?

I use a mirror, and I was watching his trajectory. It was clear he'd
pass close, but not hit me.


--
- Frank Krygowski

I was using a mirror the day I elected to bail when I saw that big 18-wheeler
bearing down on me and with it's tires over the fog line. NO WAY WAS
THAT TRUCK SLOWING let alone stopping.

You sure do live a charmed life Frank.

I do seem to have far, far fewer problems than a lot of people posting
here! Should we discuss why?


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 10:40:46 PM UTC+1, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

You sure do live a charmed life Frank.

So many more cyclists deserving of a charmed life -- and it is given to the troll Krygoswki!

Andre Jute
The world just isn't a fair place

On 6/1/2015 4:31 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 5/31/2015 10:27 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, May 31, 2015 at 6:12:51 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 5/31/2015 8:20 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Sunday, May 31, 2015 at 2:50:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:


Regarding demands for banishment or licences, those are probably evident
only in internet posts and the occasional letter to the editor. They're
about as logical as demands that everyone give up their car. I wouldn't
worry about them.

--
- Frank Krygowski

I just love the way you disregard everything anyone says that doesn't match
your agenda or experience. There are many areas where motorists are
trying to
get bicyclists off the roads or into bike lanes. Many of those motorists
are
very active in doing that. Not worrying about would mean that you as a
bicyclist
would do nothing to stop it!

If I knew of a place where that was really happening, I'd probably work
at stopping it.

I do worry that organizations like the useless League of American
Bicyclists has apparently stopped caring about our rights to the road,
to concentrate instead on dreams of segregated facilities. But AFAIK in
Ohio or in Pennsylvania (the two states where I do most of my riding)
there's no current effort to either forbid cycling or to require
licenses. Maybe you could link to a report about a place where that is
going on.

There are, of course, constant efforts to forbid cycling without some
type of special hat. I do work against those efforts. Unfortunately,
some here mock me for that. Go figure.

Frank, do you mean a helmet or, in fact, a special hat -- like a fedora. Are there mandatory Fedora laws? Pork Pie? Fez? Yarmulke?

Seems to me a bike helmet is a special hat. Here's a dictionary entry:
"hel·met 'helmət/ noun 1. a hard or padded protective hat ..."

Do you disagree?

Yes. Websters'Ninth New Collegiate:

1
: a covering or enclosing headpiece of ancient or medieval armor — see armor illustration
2
: any of various protective head coverings usually made of a hard material to resist impact
3
: something resembling a helmet


I don't think anyone would call this a hat -- except maybe you: https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...s.php?id=63948

Bicycle hat: http://cache.mrporter.com/prod-img/i...6_mrp_in_l.jpg

You love to use "foam hat" or "magical hat" or "magical foam hat" as a derogatory term for helmet. Just confess to it and end the misery, for all of us. Let it out . . . you hate helmets. We get that -- over and over and over again.

-- Jay Beattie.


I didn't really want to be part of this discussion but your
image link reminded me of one of Jobst's pet peeves (among
many). To quote Jobst, that's painter's cap.

Cycling caps are seamed like this:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/yjcap.html

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 6/1/2015 5:31 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Seems to me a bike helmet is a special hat. Here's a dictionary entry:
"hel·met 'helmət/ noun 1. a hard or padded protective hat ..."

Do you disagree?

Yes. Websters'Ninth New Collegiate:

1
: a covering or enclosing headpiece of ancient or medieval armor — see armor illustration
2
: any of various protective head coverings usually made of a hard material to resist impact
3
: something resembling a helmet

Yep, there are various dictionaries out there. My quote came from an
online dictionary, whatever Google uses. My query was "define: helmet"

But it's interesting that you think a helmet is not a special hat. What
category of clothing would you assign it to? A special stocking?
Special glove? Special codpiece?

Actually, the "hat" vs. "helmet" term doesn't seem to follow any logical
rules. It seems there may be a continuum of levels of protection, a
continuum of levels of oddity, as well as wide variations in actual risk
levels of activities purportedly needing protection, and any example
might be called by either term.

Pitcher Alex Torres has taken flack for wearing a "protective hat" or
sometimes "protective cap." See
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...icle-1.2190482

And there are other protective hats on the market:
http://crasche.com/protective-sports...-skateboarding
"Crasche is now a family business and the protective hats are made here
in America."

How about protecting against the hazard of being a baby? This one
http://www.thudguard.com/ is sometimes called a hat, sometimes a helmet.

Exploring one's Empire's tropical colonies? You'll need one of these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pith_helmet It's called a helmet, but it
won't protect against anything much more substantial than the sun's
rays, though.

There are soft helmets http://www.softprotectivehelmets.com/
and there are hard hats
http://www.coopersafety.com/hardhats.aspx
Some are quite stylish - at least, in certain circles.
http://tinyurl.com/qg7q289
Just the thing to wear to a fight in a country/western bar!

This one (a serious proposal, BTW) is called a helmet, but it looks more
like a headband to me:
http://www.copenhagenize.com/search/...or%20motorists

Perhaps we need a meeting of the rec.bicycles.tech Net Nanny Club to
determine which devices worn on the head can use which term?

You love to use "foam hat" or "magical hat" or "magical foam hat"
as a derogatory term for helmet.

Well, "love" is too strong a word. Odd that "foam hat" is considered
derogatory, though. AFAIK "cotton cap" or "woolen hat" is not. Is there
something about the word "foam" that sounds offensive to you?

Just confess to it and end the misery,
for all of us. Let it out . . . you hate helmets. We get that --
over and over and over again.

Oh please! I rather like my pith helmet! Even though it's made of some
sort of plastic, not genuine pith. It's handy for yardwork on hot,
sunny summer days. Not as handy in Ohio as when I bought it in Georgia,
I admit.

I do hate the fact that all bicycling is portrayed as so risky, and so
productive of serious brain injuries, that one should never dare get on
a bike without strapping ... um, some sort of protective device on one's
head. And given the lack of observed benefits in TBI or fatality rates
after decades of helmet use, I'm convinced that these fragile foam
things are a scam.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 6:07:13 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/1/2015 5:40 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 5:34:29 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Did it really? If so, why didn't you use the space?

I use a mirror, and I was watching his trajectory. It was clear he'd
pass close, but not hit me.


--
- Frank Krygowski

I was using a mirror the day I elected to bail when I saw that big 18-wheeler
bearing down on me and with it's tires over the fog line. NO WAY WAS
THAT TRUCK SLOWING let alone stopping.

You sure do live a charmed life Frank.

I do seem to have far, far fewer problems than a lot of people posting
here! Should we discuss why?


--
- Frank Krygowski

Well frank, despite your continuing mantra to the contrary there are times when one is advised to leave the lane in order not to be run down by an overtaking vehicle. Care to discuss why those who are run over whilst "taking the lane" are run over? And don't say it doesn't happen, because it does and oftentimes it happens in good weather in daylight on roads with good sightlines.

Cheers

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 7:17:18 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/1/2015 5:31 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Seems to me a bike helmet is a special hat. Here's a dictionary entry:
"hel·met 'helmət/ noun 1. a hard or padded protective hat ..."

Do you disagree?

Yes. Websters'Ninth New Collegiate:

1
: a covering or enclosing headpiece of ancient or medieval armor — see armor illustration
2
: any of various protective head coverings usually made of a hard material to resist impact
3
: something resembling a helmet

Yep, there are various dictionaries out there. My quote came from an
online dictionary, whatever Google uses. My query was "define: helmet"

But it's interesting that you think a helmet is not a special hat. What
category of clothing would you assign it to? A special stocking?
Special glove? Special codpiece?

Actually, the "hat" vs. "helmet" term doesn't seem to follow any logical
rules. It seems there may be a continuum of levels of protection, a
continuum of levels of oddity, as well as wide variations in actual risk
levels of activities purportedly needing protection, and any example
might be called by either term.

Pitcher Alex Torres has taken flack for wearing a "protective hat" or
sometimes "protective cap." See
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...icle-1.2190482

And there are other protective hats on the market:
http://crasche.com/protective-sports...-skateboarding
"Crasche is now a family business and the protective hats are made here
in America."

How about protecting against the hazard of being a baby? This one
http://www.thudguard.com/ is sometimes called a hat, sometimes a helmet.

Exploring one's Empire's tropical colonies? You'll need one of these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pith_helmet It's called a helmet, but it
won't protect against anything much more substantial than the sun's
rays, though.

There are soft helmets http://www.softprotectivehelmets.com/
and there are hard hats
http://www.coopersafety.com/hardhats.aspx
Some are quite stylish - at least, in certain circles.
http://tinyurl.com/qg7q289
Just the thing to wear to a fight in a country/western bar!

This one (a serious proposal, BTW) is called a helmet, but it looks more
like a headband to me:
http://www.copenhagenize.com/search/...or%20motorists

Perhaps we need a meeting of the rec.bicycles.tech Net Nanny Club to
determine which devices worn on the head can use which term?

You love to use "foam hat" or "magical hat" or "magical foam hat"
as a derogatory term for helmet.

Well, "love" is too strong a word. Odd that "foam hat" is considered
derogatory, though. AFAIK "cotton cap" or "woolen hat" is not. Is there
something about the word "foam" that sounds offensive to you?

Just confess to it and end the misery,
for all of us. Let it out . . . you hate helmets. We get that --
over and over and over again.

Oh please! I rather like my pith helmet! Even though it's made of some
sort of plastic, not genuine pith. It's handy for yardwork on hot,
sunny summer days. Not as handy in Ohio as when I bought it in Georgia,
I admit.

I do hate the fact that all bicycling is portrayed as so risky, and so
productive of serious brain injuries, that one should never dare get on
a bike without strapping ... um, some sort of protective device on one's
head. And given the lack of observed benefits in TBI or fatality rates
after decades of helmet use, I'm convinced that these fragile foam
things are a scam.

--
- Frank Krygowski

****! Yet another thread hijacked by you and your damn anti-helmet agenda/mantra!

Cheers

On Mon, 01 Jun 2015 11:43:40 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 5/31/2015 9:22 PM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 31 May 2015 09:41:21 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie


The internationally accepted "rules of the Road", The Merchant
Shipping (Distress Signals and Prevention of Collisions) Regulations,
that control ship traffic specify that a "sailing vessel" has the
right of way over motor vessels, with, of course, many exceptions, but
an "overtaking Vessel" always has the obligation to avoid the
overtaken vessel.

Perhaps the inclusion of some such language in the road traffic rules
would reduce bike accidents.

ISTM the road traffic analogy would be "strict liability" laws for
motorists, as in some European countries.

Folks there claim the laws do reduce car-bike accidents.

Perhaps I am some sort of revolutionary but I believe that all laws
should be "strict", else why would they be enacted? The enactment of a
"law" that is either not enforced, or enforced only in certain
instances, would seem to make a mockery of the legal system.
--
cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 1 Jun 2015 14:31:04 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 8:37:24 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 5/31/2015 10:27 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, May 31, 2015 at 6:12:51 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 5/31/2015 8:20 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Sunday, May 31, 2015 at 2:50:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:


Regarding demands for banishment or licences, those are probably evident
only in internet posts and the occasional letter to the editor. They're
about as logical as demands that everyone give up their car. I wouldn't
worry about them.

--
- Frank Krygowski

I just love the way you disregard everything anyone says that doesn't match
your agenda or experience. There are many areas where motorists are
trying to
get bicyclists off the roads or into bike lanes. Many of those motorists
are
very active in doing that. Not worrying about would mean that you as a
bicyclist
would do nothing to stop it!

If I knew of a place where that was really happening, I'd probably work
at stopping it.

I do worry that organizations like the useless League of American
Bicyclists has apparently stopped caring about our rights to the road,
to concentrate instead on dreams of segregated facilities. But AFAIK in
Ohio or in Pennsylvania (the two states where I do most of my riding)
there's no current effort to either forbid cycling or to require
licenses. Maybe you could link to a report about a place where that is
going on.

There are, of course, constant efforts to forbid cycling without some
type of special hat. I do work against those efforts. Unfortunately,
some here mock me for that. Go figure.

Frank, do you mean a helmet or, in fact, a special hat -- like a fedora. Are there mandatory Fedora laws? Pork Pie? Fez? Yarmulke?

Seems to me a bike helmet is a special hat. Here's a dictionary entry:
"hel·met 'helm?t/ noun 1. a hard or padded protective hat ..."

Do you disagree?

Yes. Websters'Ninth New Collegiate:

1
: a covering or enclosing headpiece of ancient or medieval armor — see armor illustration
2
: any of various protective head coverings usually made of a hard material to resist impact
3
: something resembling a helmet


I don't think anyone would call this a hat -- except maybe you: https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...s.php?id=63948

Bicycle hat: http://cache.mrporter.com/prod-img/i...6_mrp_in_l.jpg

You love to use "foam hat" or "magical hat" or "magical foam hat" as a derogatory term for helmet. Just confess to it and end the misery, for all of us. Let it out . . . you hate helmets. We get that -- over and over and over again.

-- Jay Beattie.

I hate to be picky but what would you call a hat made from Styrofoam?

--
cheers,

John B.

On Monday, June 1, 2015 at 5:17:48 PM UTC-7, Phil W Lee wrote:
Frank Krygowski considered Sun, 31 May 2015
14:45:37 -0400 the perfect time to write:

On 5/31/2015 12:41 PM, jbeattie wrote:


It's simple -- you're citing supposed experts on the standard of care.
I'm talking about the language of particular statutes. It's ships
passing in the night.

OK. In the post I just finished, I agree that there can be a law
against safely controlling a lane, just as there can be a law against
pumping gas into one's own car. Stupid laws do exist.

Generally speaking, you can "control" an obviously too narrow lane for
a period of time until it becomes impeding or failure to allow passing or
whatever approach is taken in the particular state.

Nice, thank you. I think I'll save that quote.

Remember that when you control the lane, you control it for everybody --
including other cyclists. This is probably not much of a concern for you
(or even part of your consciousness) because, AFAIK, you don't ride in an
area with lots of other cyclists. I get the pleasure of plodding along in
traffic (or forced filtering) every morning because some flower child is
controlling traffic at 10mph. It upsets motorists and puts me in what
amounts to a three lane cattle drive with lots of angry cows trying to
get around an obstacle. I suppose I'm upset because it's a downhill,
and you have to work to gum-up traffic at morning commute speeds -- but
people do that because they're bicycles, damn it, and they're entitled
to take the lane.

We don't have nearly the density of bicyclists that you do (in fact, no
place in the U.S. does, AFAIK). So my riding among other cyclists is
usually confined to club rides and a rare mass cycling event. (I tend
to stay away from those, except when doing volunteer support.)

I have ridden, frequently (in fact, most often) in an area with a
higher level of cycle traffic, and I can assure you that the
congestion is universally caused by MOTOR traffic, not cyclists.
And, btw, Cambridge cyclists are notorious for their slow and
leisurely progress.

I'm not getting how a lot of cyclists do not cause congestion. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sC6W...n/photostream/


-- Jay Beattie.