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MTB disc brake caused wild fire



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 27th 18, 04:42 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tim McNamara
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Posts: 6,809
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On Mon, 26 Mar 2018 13:57:31 -0700, sms
wrote:

Grant Petersen was right. https://www.rivbike.com/pages/disc-brakes


Well, he kinda often is...
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  #12  
Old March 27th 18, 03:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
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Posts: 3,142
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On Monday, March 26, 2018 at 8:42:44 PM UTC-7, Tim McNamara wrote:
On Mon, 26 Mar 2018 13:57:31 -0700, sms
wrote:

Grant Petersen was right. https://www.rivbike.com/pages/disc-brakes


Well, he kinda often is...


He's right for him. Personally, I think his bikes look like Victorian reproductions. https://78.media.tumblr.com/79e9dcf8...3ngpo8_540.jpg

Not that I hate steel, but if I were buying a steel all-in-one bike, I'd get one with discs because I ride in the rain a lot -- most days this time of year. You have more choices with tires and can even switch between wheels sizes if that's your thing. Cable discs are easy to install and maintain although pad life is shorter. Hydraulics are awesome but you have to do some plumbing and the concept of a hydraulic system on a bike may be too much for some.

-- Jay Beattie.
  #13  
Old March 27th 18, 03:39 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 5,194
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 2018-03-27 07:08, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 26, 2018 at 8:42:44 PM UTC-7, Tim McNamara wrote:
On Mon, 26 Mar 2018 13:57:31 -0700, sms
wrote:

Grant Petersen was right.
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/disc-brakes


Well, he kinda often is...


He's right for him. Personally, I think his bikes look like Victorian
reproductions.
https://78.media.tumblr.com/79e9dcf8...3ngpo8_540.jpg

Not that I hate steel, but if I were buying a steel all-in-one bike,
I'd get one with discs because I ride in the rain a lot -- most days
this time of year.



Hard rain or hail like here on Sunday is the worst. It seems to splatter
up whatever gunk in on the surface and then the rim brake pads try to
massage that into the aluminum. It becomes evident when stopping under a
bridge and seeing "fuzz" on the rim end of the spokes but none towards
the hub.


... You have more choices with tires and can even
switch between wheels sizes if that's your thing. Cable discs are
easy to install and maintain although pad life is shorter. Hydraulics
are awesome but you have to do some plumbing and the concept of a
hydraulic system on a bike may be too much for some.


Hydraulics also can suffer from sudden fade and that's scary. Then they
require bleeding which, depending on the kind, is a messy business. On
mine particularly so because there is no bleed kit for them. Cable disc
brakes are fine for pavement riding, just not for heavy duty MTB riding.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #14  
Old March 27th 18, 05:54 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 8,247
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 3/26/2018 3:27 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-26 15:11, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/26/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-26 13:57, sms wrote:
On 3/26/2018 12:15 PM, Joerg wrote:
Remember when some folks here scoffed at that risk? Bernd Ullrich in
the German language bike NG posted this link but it is in German:

http://www.rp-online.de/panorama/aus...-aid-1.7479241




Here are link with photos and a video of the fi

http://www.vol.at/vorarlberg-waldbra...rsberg/5722558

http://vorarlberg.orf.at/news/stories/2903197/

Long story short it says that a Swiss MTB rider parked his MTB in
grass after a downhill ride. Then ... phut ... smoke and flames. He
and two other guys were unable to put out the fast-spreading fire. Two
helicopters over 100 fire fighters were required to get this under
control.

Grant Petersen was right.
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/disc-brakes


Quote "But the idea that hub-disc brakes are an advancement or even
desirable for general purpose riding ... is nonsense"

If that's really his reasoning then he hasn't got a clue. Yesterday I
coasted back down a hill with a friend and a nasty hail storm set in.
He had disc brakes and could always stop on a dime. I was on my road
bike with rim brakes and they started to fail miserably. I had to keep
them partially engaged almost the whole time to make sure I had enough
brake actions when needed.


You had to squeeze your levers almost the whole time?

Oh, the humanity!


It's not the squeezing, it's the constant grinding noise. Grinding noise
+ several miles = rim abrasion.

Disc brakes are simply superior in that and many other domains.


I still have a Arai drum brake wheel for my Trek tandem. For long steep
descents on a tandem, you really have to watch out for rims heating to
the point where you can get a blowout.

I suspect that not many non-disc brake tandems, other than the el-cheapo
BSO tandems, are being sold anymore. Santana does have one entry-level
model where the disc brake is optional.

  #15  
Old March 27th 18, 08:25 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 5,194
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 2018-03-27 09:54, sms wrote:
On 3/26/2018 3:27 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-26 15:11, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/26/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-26 13:57, sms wrote:
On 3/26/2018 12:15 PM, Joerg wrote:
Remember when some folks here scoffed at that risk? Bernd Ullrich in
the German language bike NG posted this link but it is in German:

http://www.rp-online.de/panorama/aus...-aid-1.7479241




Here are link with photos and a video of the fi

http://www.vol.at/vorarlberg-waldbra...rsberg/5722558

http://vorarlberg.orf.at/news/stories/2903197/

Long story short it says that a Swiss MTB rider parked his MTB in
grass after a downhill ride. Then ... phut ... smoke and flames. He
and two other guys were unable to put out the fast-spreading fire.
Two
helicopters over 100 fire fighters were required to get this under
control.

Grant Petersen was right.
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/disc-brakes


Quote "But the idea that hub-disc brakes are an advancement or even
desirable for general purpose riding ... is nonsense"

If that's really his reasoning then he hasn't got a clue. Yesterday I
coasted back down a hill with a friend and a nasty hail storm set in.
He had disc brakes and could always stop on a dime. I was on my road
bike with rim brakes and they started to fail miserably. I had to keep
them partially engaged almost the whole time to make sure I had enough
brake actions when needed.

You had to squeeze your levers almost the whole time?

Oh, the humanity!


It's not the squeezing, it's the constant grinding noise. Grinding
noise + several miles = rim abrasion.

Disc brakes are simply superior in that and many other domains.


I still have a Arai drum brake wheel for my Trek tandem. For long steep
descents on a tandem, you really have to watch out for rims heating to
the point where you can get a blowout.


IIRC it's a long volcano descent in Hawaii where they only rent out drum
brake bicycles to avoid problems with overheated brakes.


I suspect that not many non-disc brake tandems, other than the el-cheapo
BSO tandems, are being sold anymore.



They shouldn't be. I remember an executive retreat where one of the
team-building exercises was tandem riding with someone you do not often
interact with at the company. So here we were, both proud members of the
0.1-ton class, lumbering down a long hill. We were the bicycle
equivalent of a full propane truck. At some point a stench came from the
front rim brake rubbers.

You should have seen some of the teams where neither rider was a
cyclist. Priceless. However, laughing at other teams was not allowed.


... Santana does have one entry-level
model where the disc brake is optional.


One guy on the German NG has disc brakes plus a rim brake on the rear
for extra braking power. That makes a lot of sense on a vacation trip
with extra cargo.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #16  
Old March 28th 18, 03:23 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 5,959
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 3/27/2018 12:54 PM, sms wrote:


I still have a Arai drum brake wheel for my Trek tandem. For long steep
descents on a tandem, you really have to watch out for rims heating to
the point where you can get a blowout.

I suspect that not many non-disc brake tandems, other than the el-cheapo
BSO tandems, are being sold anymore. Santana does have one entry-level
model where the disc brake is optional.


Popularity isn't usually driven by practicality. It's usually driven
more by fashion. Tattoos, ripped jeans, aero sunglasses, carbon fiber
everything, minipumps and disc brakes are nearly always fashion choices.
They're hardly different than new hairstyles.

Jay mentions riding in Oregon rain for decades using rim brakes. We've
ridden our tandem with only rim brakes for decades. We've had no
problems at all.

Full disclosu The tandem was a custom build, with the builder (Jim
Bradford) also supplying and installing all the components. I asked for
a double-threaded Phil rear hub so I could install a hub brake if I
decided I needed it.

Bradford said it wasn't necessary, that he and his fiance had toured the
Alps on one of his tandems with only cantilever rim brakes.

I've never toured the Alps, but our tandem has never needed more brakes.
Which is good, because one of his many mistakes on this bike was
supplying a rear hub without the brake threading.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #17  
Old March 29th 18, 04:28 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
James[_8_]
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Posts: 5,730
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 28/03/18 01:39, Joerg wrote:


Hydraulics also can suffer from sudden fade and that's scary. Then they
require bleeding which, depending on the kind, is a messy business. On
mine particularly so because there is no bleed kit for them. Cable disc
brakes are fine for pavement riding, just not for heavy duty MTB riding.


With the use of a few hose clamps, a file that is harder than tool
steel, nails and rocks, I'm sure you could build a front wheel for your
MTB using a motorcycle front hub, disc brake and lever.

--
JS
  #18  
Old March 29th 18, 03:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 5,194
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 2018-03-28 20:28, James wrote:
On 28/03/18 01:39, Joerg wrote:


Hydraulics also can suffer from sudden fade and that's scary. Then
they require bleeding which, depending on the kind, is a messy
business. On mine particularly so because there is no bleed kit for
them. Cable disc brakes are fine for pavement riding, just not for
heavy duty MTB riding.


With the use of a few hose clamps, a file that is harder than tool
steel, nails and rocks, I'm sure you could build a front wheel for your
MTB using a motorcycle front hub, disc brake and lever.


After upgrading to 8" rotors front and back I am quite pleased with the
brake performance of my MTB. The bleeding is messy but only needs to be
done about once a year and takes 1/2h.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #19  
Old March 29th 18, 05:24 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 8,247
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 3/27/2018 7:39 AM, Joerg wrote:

Hydraulics also can suffer from sudden fade and that's scary. Then they
require bleeding which, depending on the kind, is a messy business. On
mine particularly so because there is no bleed kit for them. Cable disc
brakes are fine for pavement riding, just not for heavy duty MTB riding.


Avoid hydraulic disc brakes at all costs. Stick to mechanical disc brakes.

  #20  
Old March 29th 18, 05:30 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 5,194
Default MTB disc brake caused wild fire

On 2018-03-29 09:24, sms wrote:
On 3/27/2018 7:39 AM, Joerg wrote:

Hydraulics also can suffer from sudden fade and that's scary. Then
they require bleeding which, depending on the kind, is a messy
business. On mine particularly so because there is no bleed kit for
them. Cable disc brakes are fine for pavement riding, just not for
heavy duty MTB riding.


Avoid hydraulic disc brakes at all costs. Stick to mechanical disc brakes.


They are not powerful enough for MTB with large riders and some cargo.
Also, many mechanical systems only have a piston on one side which over
time results in the rotor being bent sideways when braking.

After having ridden offroad with rim brakes, mechanical discs and
hydraulic disks I found hydraulic discs to be far superior and never
looked back.

For road bikes machanical discs should suffice. IF I ever need a new one
I will make 100% sure it does not have rim brakes.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
 




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