So Long Tubulars?

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 3:59:53 PM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 07:32:07 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 1:33:44 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 17:57:16 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 5:41:44 PM UTC-7, Radey Shouman wrote:
Tom Kunich writes:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 7:39:44 AM UTC-7, Radey Shouman wrote:
Tom Kunich writes:

On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 11:13:31 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 18:17:44 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 3:42:06 PM UTC-4, Ralph Barone wrote:
Chalo wrote:
What good is riding the tire without getting flats, if you
have to spend
more time fooling around with it than if you were getting
lots of flats
in a conventional system? You're trading the chance of a small
inconvenience for the certainty of a larger one.

If your riding time is scarce and precious, but basement
lurking time is
plentiful, I guess I can see the appeal. You probably won't
have to mess
with it while you're on the trail. But you will have to mess with it,
both when installing the stuff and again every so often when
you take out
the curds and whey-- and that's true even if you didn't get any
punctures at all.


Some people like to fiddle with the hardware, and some like to
just use it
and not think about it. With guitars, I’m a hardware fiddler,
so I ditched
music and went into engineering. A friend of mine posted a picture of
himself adjusting the valve lash on his BMW motorcycle and I
had to think
back to the last time I ever had to do that (1988?). I also
think we all
have different levels of how much we are willing to pay for an
incremental
performance improvement.

... Or for an irrelevant or negligible performance improvement. And
we definitely
have different judgments on the benefits vs. detriments of performance
improvements.

Why would I go to tubeless tires? I'd have to invest a bundle
and learn a new
maintenance drill, but for what? To reduce my few flats per year to
"few minus
one"? To reduce my rolling resistance, when I'm usually the
first or second
rider to finish a ride? (Tip: Ride with old folks! It's easier!)
Why would I
switch to a much lighter bike? I'm usually first or second to the
top of a hill,
even on the tandem. (See the tip above.) Why would I switch to disc
brakes? I
don't do that much riding in the rain, and anyway I've never
once gotten in
trouble by my rim brakes being inadequate.

I understand that there are people who want whatever the advertisers are
promoting most this year. Some do it because of the "art" value of the
(supposedly) top technology. ("I've got the finest bike!!!").. Some
may do it to
beat their buddies to the next telephone pole. Have at it, if
you like. But
that's not what most of my riding is about.

What I don't understand is people who don't understand that some
of us don't
give a damn about three fewer pounds, or one thousandth less
rolling resistance,
or magical handling that only cognoscenti can detect.

Why not just ride the bike?

- Frank Krygowski

But what do you know? After all you don't have a $4,000 bike like The
Expert does so obviously you don't know nothing :-(
--
cheers,

John B.

And you don't have anything so why are you on this group?

He's got a computer and at least one opinion. What more does one need?

Radey - if you have an opinion and nothing more there is the .soc
group. Here you are expected to actually have some technical
knowledge. The major problem with the Internet these days is that
people mistake opinions for knowledge. Even the media now has eschewed
knowledge for opinion.

It's Usenet -- no one vets your palmares, no one vouches for your bona
fides. But every reader can decide for him- or herself whether a post
is sufficiently useful/interesting/entertaining to read. Hostility can
be both unrelenting *and* entertaining, but it's tough to keep that up
for 20 or 30 posts a day. Look at Andre, a man hardened by years of
payment by the word, see how he paces himself.

I'm not all sure that years of reading Usenet have been time well spent,
but I have learned a thing or two. One is that, although I devoutly hope
one day to retire while still able to ride a bike, a person *can* have
too much free time. The other is that if doing or reading something
makes me crazy, it's better to give it a rest.

--

I don't follow you. What does "palmares" have to do with anything? tech is not who you rode with, what you rode and why you rode it. If you cannot see what works and what doesn't than why in hell would you be on .tech to begin with?

Surely you might not understand a point or a necessary repair, but if it is explained to you and you cannot verify that it is correct simply by trying it, then again you haven't any place on .tech.

I have never seen any addition to the group from John or Frank and Ridesalot. To them this is nothing more than a social group.

By golly, you are right! "Tech is not who you rode with, what you rode
and why you rode it, If you cannot see what works and what doesn't
than why in hell would you be on .tech to begin with?"

But of course you just posted:

"I arrived home after 39 miles, 3,500 ft. of climbing and logged it.
Just over 2,000 miles and just over 80,000 Ft of climbing. I guess
that keeping track of that sort of thing insults Frank whose idea of a
ride is down to the village and back."

So perhaps you could give us some more details about the "see what
works and what doesn't" that you just furnished in that thrilling
tale.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Tell us how much you've ridden John. What have you actually done on your bike? Why are you on .tech? You've never been to the market with your wife so you have absolutely no idea of how to compare the price of food with what it is here now. You've never ridden a bike that could get out of its own way but you can criticize people who have.


Why? Is there some entrance examination, does one have to display
credentials, or demonstrate a previous level of proficiency in cycling
or even prove that one can travel at some specific speed on a bike in
order to join a discussion here? Does one have to first complain
about the posts here and than brag about having ridden 2,000 miles?

By the way, there is a group "recd.bicycles.racing" for the speedy
riders.

And for having never gone to the market with my wife? How would you
know? Is your previously mentioned retired spy here in Thailand
peeking and peering to see whether I'm my wife when we go to buy
groceries?

Oh yes Tom, you were bemoaning the loss of technical discussion since
the "old days" of Brandt and Sheldon so here is a quote that Brandt
made back in the glory days:

. Oh, you mean this guy:

Thomas H Munich, Born: Oct 1944
3539 Monterey Blvd
San Alejandro CA94578
510) 351-3807

http://tinyurl.com/8rwo2

I thought we had gotten over him, now that we have other
contributors who are equally rude and obnoxious, always carping
while offering no useful information. A few names come to mind.

Jobs Brandt

, DEC 26, 2005

--

Cheers,

John B.

Like you, Jobst didn't like to be criticized. I rode with Jobst and hence earned the right to criticize him. I also read YOUR posting that said that you never went to the market with your wife and so had no comparison on the cost of food. Did it slip your mind that you posted it or are you growing more senile than you seem?

On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 10:00:40 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 12:09:53 PM UTC-4, duane wrote:
On 10/07/2019 10:45 a.m., sms wrote:
On 7/6/2019 11:22 PM, Chalo wrote:
I was just observing to one of my coworkers that tubeless is the new
sewups-- inconvenient, messy, time-consuming, and totally useless for
99% of the people who think they're essential.

Anyone not going tubeless is standing in the way of human progress.

Seriously, for racers the weight savings make some sense since their
support vehicle will just hand them a replacement wheel and tire if they
get a flat, but for normal riders they're just an expensive hassle.

If you come across someone on the side of the road, asking to borrow
your pump, standing there in Lycra with empty CO2 cartridges on the
ground, you can be pretty certain that they're using tubeless. Any
minuscule time savings due to the slight weight savings is lost in the
noise when compared to the additional time to fix a flat.


Not sure what Lycra has to do with it or CO2 for that matter but
tubeless tires here are pretty much a rarity so I would be that they
aren't using tubeless.

And anyway, I'd likely lend them one of my CO2 instead of my pump since
I wouldn't want to wait for them to pump up their tires.

I know one guy using tubeless in my club and the last time he rode with
us he had a slow leak and had to stop every 20 km to pump the tires.
That's out of ~400 members.

Maybe I'm missing your point amid the lycra/co2 smoke...

I've helped strangers and friends by letting them use my pump. I didn't begrudge
the time at all. Generally it allows for some friendly conversation. And on one
ride that I've described from a couple years ago, three failures of various CO2
cartridges were a blessing. They allowed me some badly needed rest until the
guy with the flat finally borrowed my pump.

And since this is a discussion group, we could (ahem!) discuss the relative
advantages and disadvantages of both CO2 and lycra.

Unless, that is, tech skepticism is not allowed. If that's a rule now, I guess
only gushingly positive comments are appropriate.

- Frank Krygowski

Back in my Air Force days I Was stationed at Yokota AFB, Japan, about
20 km N.W, of Tokyo and at the time we had three F-86 fighters on
standby at near the end of the runway to protect us from the Russian
Migs. We were told that they used Helium to inflate their tires as
temperature didn't effect it as much as normal air.

The reason this became "common knowledge" was because someone mixed
the gas bottles up and they inflated a tire with oxygen and it
exploded so all the various maintenance groups had to sit through a
lecture about the proper way to inflate tires :-(
--

Cheers,

John B.

On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 09:37:03 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:45:34 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 7/6/2019 11:22 PM, Chalo wrote:
I was just observing to one of my coworkers that tubeless is the new sewups-- inconvenient, messy, time-consuming, and totally useless for 99% of the people who think they're essential.

Anyone not going tubeless is standing in the way of human progress.

Seriously, for racers the weight savings make some sense since their
support vehicle will just hand them a replacement wheel and tire if they
get a flat, but for normal riders they're just an expensive hassle.

If you come across someone on the side of the road, asking to borrow
your pump, standing there in Lycra with empty CO2 cartridges on the
ground, you can be pretty certain that they're using tubeless. Any
minuscule time savings due to the slight weight savings is lost in the
noise when compared to the additional time to fix a flat.

Airless is really the future of bicycle tires
https://mashable.com/2018/05/15/new-way-of-cycling-with-airless-tires-that-never-go-flat/.

Really - what in the hell are you talking about? I've had more flats on Gatorskins than on tubeless.


One might equally ask "what in the hell are you talking about" as SMS
was talking about AIRLESS tires. they even has a movie that you could
have watched.

Instead you run off at the mouth and now everyone know that you are a
fool.

As a number of wise people have said throughout history:
It is better to keep one's mouth closed and be thought a fool than to
open your mouth and remove all doubts.

You, unfortunately, keep opening your mouth.
--

Cheers,

John B.

On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 16:04:03 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 6:59:53 PM UTC-4, John B. Slocomb wrote:
Snipped

By the way, there is a group "recd.bicycles.racing" for the speedy
riders.
Snipped
--

Cheers,

John B.

AND there is a group called rec.bicycles.misc for threads and/or post that aren't bicycling tech. VBEG LOL

Cheers
Yup, It must have been a keyboard problem. It couldn't possibly been
me :-)
--

Cheers,

John B.

On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 16:13:06 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 3:59:53 PM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 07:32:07 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 1:33:44 AM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 17:57:16 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
wrote:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 5:41:44 PM UTC-7, Radey Shouman wrote:
Tom Kunich writes:

On Monday, July 8, 2019 at 7:39:44 AM UTC-7, Radey Shouman wrote:
Tom Kunich writes:

On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 11:13:31 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 18:17:44 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Sunday, July 7, 2019 at 3:42:06 PM UTC-4, Ralph Barone wrote:
Chalo wrote:
What good is riding the tire without getting flats, if you
have to spend
more time fooling around with it than if you were getting
lots of flats
in a conventional system? You're trading the chance of a small
inconvenience for the certainty of a larger one.

If your riding time is scarce and precious, but basement
lurking time is
plentiful, I guess I can see the appeal. You probably won't
have to mess
with it while you're on the trail. But you will have to mess with it,
both when installing the stuff and again every so often when
you take out
the curds and whey-- and that's true even if you didn't get any
punctures at all.


Some people like to fiddle with the hardware, and some like to
just use it
and not think about it. With guitars, I’m a hardware fiddler,
so I ditched
music and went into engineering. A friend of mine posted a picture of
himself adjusting the valve lash on his BMW motorcycle and I
had to think
back to the last time I ever had to do that (1988?). I also
think we all
have different levels of how much we are willing to pay for an
incremental
performance improvement.

... Or for an irrelevant or negligible performance improvement. And
we definitely
have different judgments on the benefits vs. detriments of performance
improvements.

Why would I go to tubeless tires? I'd have to invest a bundle
and learn a new
maintenance drill, but for what? To reduce my few flats per year to
"few minus
one"? To reduce my rolling resistance, when I'm usually the
first or second
rider to finish a ride? (Tip: Ride with old folks! It's easier!)
Why would I
switch to a much lighter bike? I'm usually first or second to the
top of a hill,
even on the tandem. (See the tip above.) Why would I switch to disc
brakes? I
don't do that much riding in the rain, and anyway I've never
once gotten in
trouble by my rim brakes being inadequate.

I understand that there are people who want whatever the advertisers are
promoting most this year. Some do it because of the "art" value of the
(supposedly) top technology. ("I've got the finest bike!!!"). Some
may do it to
beat their buddies to the next telephone pole. Have at it, if
you like. But
that's not what most of my riding is about.

What I don't understand is people who don't understand that some
of us don't
give a damn about three fewer pounds, or one thousandth less
rolling resistance,
or magical handling that only cognoscenti can detect.

Why not just ride the bike?

- Frank Krygowski

But what do you know? After all you don't have a $4,000 bike like The
Expert does so obviously you don't know nothing :-(
--
cheers,

John B.

And you don't have anything so why are you on this group?

He's got a computer and at least one opinion. What more does one need?

Radey - if you have an opinion and nothing more there is the .soc
group. Here you are expected to actually have some technical
knowledge. The major problem with the Internet these days is that
people mistake opinions for knowledge. Even the media now has eschewed
knowledge for opinion.

It's Usenet -- no one vets your palmares, no one vouches for your bona
fides. But every reader can decide for him- or herself whether a post
is sufficiently useful/interesting/entertaining to read. Hostility can
be both unrelenting *and* entertaining, but it's tough to keep that up
for 20 or 30 posts a day. Look at Andre, a man hardened by years of
payment by the word, see how he paces himself.

I'm not all sure that years of reading Usenet have been time well spent,
but I have learned a thing or two. One is that, although I devoutly hope
one day to retire while still able to ride a bike, a person *can* have
too much free time. The other is that if doing or reading something
makes me crazy, it's better to give it a rest.

--

I don't follow you. What does "palmares" have to do with anything? tech is not who you rode with, what you rode and why you rode it. If you cannot see what works and what doesn't than why in hell would you be on .tech to begin with?

Surely you might not understand a point or a necessary repair, but if it is explained to you and you cannot verify that it is correct simply by trying it, then again you haven't any place on .tech.

I have never seen any addition to the group from John or Frank and Ridesalot. To them this is nothing more than a social group.

By golly, you are right! "Tech is not who you rode with, what you rode
and why you rode it, If you cannot see what works and what doesn't
than why in hell would you be on .tech to begin with?"

But of course you just posted:

"I arrived home after 39 miles, 3,500 ft. of climbing and logged it.
Just over 2,000 miles and just over 80,000 Ft of climbing. I guess
that keeping track of that sort of thing insults Frank whose idea of a
ride is down to the village and back."

So perhaps you could give us some more details about the "see what
works and what doesn't" that you just furnished in that thrilling
tale.

--

Cheers,

John B.

Tell us how much you've ridden John. What have you actually done on your bike? Why are you on .tech? You've never been to the market with your wife so you have absolutely no idea of how to compare the price of food with what it is here now. You've never ridden a bike that could get out of its own way but you can criticize people who have.


Why? Is there some entrance examination, does one have to display
credentials, or demonstrate a previous level of proficiency in cycling
or even prove that one can travel at some specific speed on a bike in
order to join a discussion here? Does one have to first complain
about the posts here and than brag about having ridden 2,000 miles?

By the way, there is a group "recd.bicycles.racing" for the speedy
riders.

And for having never gone to the market with my wife? How would you
know? Is your previously mentioned retired spy here in Thailand
peeking and peering to see whether I'm my wife when we go to buy
groceries?

Oh yes Tom, you were bemoaning the loss of technical discussion since
the "old days" of Brandt and Sheldon so here is a quote that Brandt
made back in the glory days:

. Oh, you mean this guy:

Thomas H Munich, Born: Oct 1944
3539 Monterey Blvd
San Alejandro CA94578
510) 351-3807

http://tinyurl.com/8rwo2

I thought we had gotten over him, now that we have other
contributors who are equally rude and obnoxious, always carping
while offering no useful information. A few names come to mind.

Jobs Brandt

, DEC 26, 2005

--

Cheers,

John B.

Like you, Jobst didn't like to be criticized. I rode with Jobst and hence earned the right to criticize him.I also read YOUR posting that said that you never went to the market with your wife and so had no comparison on the cost of food. Did it slip your mind that you posted it or are you growing more senile than you seem?


Well, I do remember saying that I didn't go to the market with my wife
as she has her own "househiold budget" but if it was the same post I
remember I also said something to the effect that the last time we
bought groceries it cost in the neighborhood of 1,500 baht.

But I will also qualify that with the comment that probably, even if I
don't remember it, I likely did go to the market with my wife, at
least once or twice in the nearly 50 years that we've been married :-)

But I didn't think I was criticize Brandt by quoting him.
--

Cheers,

John B.

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 7:01:38 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 6:14:31 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 3:35:54 PM UTC-4, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 10:00:42 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 12:09:53 PM UTC-4, duane wrote:
On 10/07/2019 10:45 a.m., sms wrote:
On 7/6/2019 11:22 PM, Chalo wrote:
I was just observing to one of my coworkers that tubeless is the new
sewups-- inconvenient, messy, time-consuming, and totally useless for
99% of the people who think they're essential.

Anyone not going tubeless is standing in the way of human progress.

Seriously, for racers the weight savings make some sense since their
support vehicle will just hand them a replacement wheel and tire if they
get a flat, but for normal riders they're just an expensive hassle.

If you come across someone on the side of the road, asking to borrow
your pump, standing there in Lycra with empty CO2 cartridges on the
ground, you can be pretty certain that they're using tubeless. Any
minuscule time savings due to the slight weight savings is lost in the
noise when compared to the additional time to fix a flat.


Not sure what Lycra has to do with it or CO2 for that matter but
tubeless tires here are pretty much a rarity so I would be that they
aren't using tubeless.

And anyway, I'd likely lend them one of my CO2 instead of my pump since
I wouldn't want to wait for them to pump up their tires.

I know one guy using tubeless in my club and the last time he rode with
us he had a slow leak and had to stop every 20 km to pump the tires.
That's out of ~400 members.

Maybe I'm missing your point amid the lycra/co2 smoke...

I've helped strangers and friends by letting them use my pump. I didn't begrudge
the time at all. Generally it allows for some friendly conversation.. And on one
ride that I've described from a couple years ago, three failures of various CO2
cartridges were a blessing. They allowed me some badly needed rest until the
guy with the flat finally borrowed my pump.

And since this is a discussion group, we could (ahem!) discuss the relative
advantages and disadvantages of both CO2 and lycra.

Unless, that is, tech skepticism is not allowed. If that's a rule now, I guess
only gushingly positive comments are appropriate.

I rode for three hours in the (unexpected) rain last Saturday in lycra shorts with a synthetic chamois, merino-poly bicycle specific sleeveless base layer (Showers Pass promo), lycra arm warmers and poly-wool blend cycling socks. I remained comfortable, although a little cold on some of the descents.

I could not imagine having been in cotton shorts or even nylon running shorts with cotton underwear, a Joerg approved cotton-tee and cotton socks. It would be like wearing a swamp with my ass sloshing around on the saddle. I would have frozen on the descents and remained wet for the whole ride.. In fact, I would have turned around on the outskirts of Portland.

When the sun came out, I dried out in probably ten minutes -- or felt dry in ten minutes. I was bone dry by the time I got to Hood River except my socks were still damp, which I noticed when I took off my shoes. They still felt comfortable. Cotton socks would still be damp today.

And if you flat when its cold and miserable and raining, a CO2 inflator is a godsend and beats the hell out of flogging a clown pump -- same goes for when you're tired. CO2 has its environmental issues, and I still bring a clown pump as a back up, but there is no question that an inflator is a super-fast and convenient way of filling a tire. If you're an idiot and can't use one properly, that is a whole other issue -- and if you're that much of an idiot, you'll probably break off a valve with a clown-pump anyway. You should learn how to use the equipment or call an Uber.

No argument about the wet clothing. As I've said, I try to avoid riding in the
rain. When I do, it's usually because I'm on a long recreational ride and got
caught; and on long recreational rides I do wear bike clothes.

Having said that, I'd like to find clothing that was comfortable for, say, 50
miles on the bike but didn't make me look like a race costume. Come to think of it,
I wish that clothing would appear on quite a few other cyclists. Aesthetically
speaking, many lycra fans could use fashion help.

About the CO2: In the incident I described above, it wasn't one person who didn't
know how to use it properly. There were at least three people involved in fixing
the flat (while I lay on the berm of the road exhausted). I'm not sure, but I
think one failure was because the replacement tube had a hole in it, so the CO2
was wasted. But I think the second failure was somehow not getting the CO2 to
work right. I can't be sure; I was half dead and hoping they'd botch it yet
again, so I could rest.

- Frank Krygowski

Based on many of your anecdotes, I must say that you excel at meeting incompetent bicyclists. LOL VBEG

I've met bicyclists at the side of a road who were either trying to patch a tube, replace a tube or pump up the tire/tube combination and were having difficulties not because they were incompetent but because they'd never done it before with the equipment they had that day. On an organized tour a couple of years ago the rider got his tube replaced but was unfamiliar with his brand new mini-pump. Another time I gave a CO2 cartridge o a rider because he had the wrong type of cartridge for his inflator.

I have helped many, many bicyclists over the years. I remember when one of our
club's past presidents wrote an article describing the traits of the club's
officers and committee chairs. For me, she described me as the guy who's always
fixing other riders' bikes.

But I think we may forget that we're denizens of a "tech" group. We are almost
certainly WAY more mechanically competent than the average cyclist. Bike shops
get business from people who bring in flat tires to change, or derailleurs that
need adjusting screws twisted half a turn! And for every such bike, there are
probably a dozen that just die in the garage for the same reasons.

Still, I wouldn't say a person is competent if they got a flat and had the wrong
type CO2 cartridge, or didn't know how to use his new mini-pump. Wouldn't a
competent person check that stuff the moment he bought the tool?

- Frank Krygowski

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 10:00:40 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 12:09:53 PM UTC-4, duane wrote:
On 10/07/2019 10:45 a.m., sms wrote:
On 7/6/2019 11:22 PM, Chalo wrote:
I was just observing to one of my coworkers that tubeless is the new
sewups-- inconvenient, messy, time-consuming, and totally useless for
99% of the people who think they're essential.

Anyone not going tubeless is standing in the way of human progress.

Seriously, for racers the weight savings make some sense since their
support vehicle will just hand them a replacement wheel and tire if they
get a flat, but for normal riders they're just an expensive hassle.

If you come across someone on the side of the road, asking to borrow
your pump, standing there in Lycra with empty CO2 cartridges on the
ground, you can be pretty certain that they're using tubeless. Any
minuscule time savings due to the slight weight savings is lost in the
noise when compared to the additional time to fix a flat.


Not sure what Lycra has to do with it or CO2 for that matter but
tubeless tires here are pretty much a rarity so I would be that they
aren't using tubeless.

And anyway, I'd likely lend them one of my CO2 instead of my pump since
I wouldn't want to wait for them to pump up their tires.

I know one guy using tubeless in my club and the last time he rode with
us he had a slow leak and had to stop every 20 km to pump the tires.
That's out of ~400 members.

Maybe I'm missing your point amid the lycra/co2 smoke...

I've helped strangers and friends by letting them use my pump. I didn't begrudge
the time at all. Generally it allows for some friendly conversation. And on one
ride that I've described from a couple years ago, three failures of various CO2
cartridges were a blessing. They allowed me some badly needed rest until the
guy with the flat finally borrowed my pump.

And since this is a discussion group, we could (ahem!) discuss the relative
advantages and disadvantages of both CO2 and lycra.

Unless, that is, tech skepticism is not allowed. If that's a rule now, I guess
only gushingly positive comments are appropriate.

- Frank Krygowski

Back in my Air Force days I Was stationed at Yokota AFB, Japan, about
20 km N.W, of Tokyo and at the time we had three F-86 fighters on
standby at near the end of the runway to protect us from the Russian
Migs. We were told that they used Helium to inflate their tires as
temperature didn't effect it as much as normal air.

The reason this became "common knowledge" was because someone mixed
the gas bottles up and they inflated a tire with oxygen and it
exploded so all the various maintenance groups had to sit through a
lecture about the proper way to inflate tires :-(
--

Cheers,

John B.


The table on the last page of this old document should be of technical
interest to this group.

https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/Sc...16p327_A2b.pdf

CO2 appears to be like beer. You don’t buy it - you only rent it.

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 5:59:53 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:

so here is a quote that Brandt
made back in the glory days:

. Oh, you mean this guy:

Thomas H Munich, Born: Oct 1944
3539 Monterey Blvd
San Alejandro CA94578
510) 351-3807

http://tinyurl.com/8rwo2

I thought we had gotten over him, now that we have other
contributors who are equally rude and obnoxious, always carping
while offering no useful information. A few names come to mind.

Jobs Brandt

, DEC 26, 2005


Kind of unrelated to the content of this thread. But looking at this Jobst quote, the guy he is complaining about is only 61 when written. I am pretty sure ALL of the dirty old *******s I ride with are at least that old. I'm the youngster, and I'm not that young anymore. Sadly. Its very depressing that everyone is so F---ing old now.

On Thu, 11 Jul 2019 00:01:27 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 5:59:53 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:

so here is a quote that Brandt
made back in the glory days:

. Oh, you mean this guy:

Thomas H Munich, Born: Oct 1944
3539 Monterey Blvd
San Alejandro CA94578
510) 351-3807

http://tinyurl.com/8rwo2

I thought we had gotten over him, now that we have other
contributors who are equally rude and obnoxious, always carping
while offering no useful information. A few names come to mind.

Jobs Brandt

, DEC 26, 2005


Kind of unrelated to the content of this thread. But looking at this Jobst quote, the guy he is complaining about is only 61 when written. I am pretty sure ALL of the dirty old *******s I ride with are at least that old. I'm the youngster, and I'm not that young anymore. Sadly. Its very depressing that everyone is so F---ing old now.

Yes, he was born in 1944 and is this year 75 years old and as a
general statement males seem to become more garrulous with age, and
Brandt describes the chap as being rude, obnoxious and always
carping, which appear to be an apt description today. :-)
--

Cheers,

John B.

On 7/11/2019 5:44 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 11 Jul 2019 00:01:27 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 10, 2019 at 5:59:53 PM UTC-5, John B. Slocomb wrote:

so here is a quote that Brandt
made back in the glory days:

. Oh, you mean this guy:

Thomas H Munich, Born: Oct 1944
3539 Monterey Blvd
San Alejandro CA94578
510) 351-3807

http://tinyurl.com/8rwo2

I thought we had gotten over him, now that we have other
contributors who are equally rude and obnoxious, always carping
while offering no useful information. A few names come to mind.

Jobs Brandt

, DEC 26, 2005


Kind of unrelated to the content of this thread. But looking at this Jobst quote, the guy he is complaining about is only 61 when written. I am pretty sure ALL of the dirty old *******s I ride with are at least that old. I'm the youngster, and I'm not that young anymore. Sadly. Its very depressing that everyone is so F---ing old now.

Yes, he was born in 1944 and is this year 75 years old and as a
general statement males seem to become more garrulous with age, and
Brandt describes the chap as being rude, obnoxious and always
carping, which appear to be an apt description today. :-)
--

Cheers,

John B.


"equally rude and obnoxious, always carping"

Huh I was thinking Joe Biden who will turn 77 this year.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971