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Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 14th 05, 09:47 AM
Chalo
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks

HP wrote:
Hi, I'm a noob trying to service a BB on a Klein Quantum and I need some
help. First, here's a picture of the Klein:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...e623/Klein.jpg

Here's its BB on the non-drive side:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...3/Klein_BB.jpg

The black ring is a thin rubber ring, with markings that read: 6003 RS
(and on opposite side) H.F.


6003 is a standard ball bearing of 17mm bore, 35mm outside diameter,
and 10mm width. "RS" means rubber seal, as opposed to "Z" which
indicates a metal shield. Your bearings have two rubber seals apiece,
which would make them 6003-2RS bearings.

My problems:

1) I need to remove the BB and don't know how. Can anyone id it and tell
me the tools I need?


A hammer or a mallet. A brass drift. A section of tube about the same
diameter as the bearing's outer race. That's probably it.

2) I have a Campagnolo "Racing T" triple crankset (52/42/30) with square
tapers that I like to use. I looked on the net and found that it needs
111mm symmetric spindle length. Can anyone confirm this? Is it OK to use
a BB w/ 110mm spindle instead?


110, or 113, or even something else in the same range is probably fine.
Note that Campagnolo cranks have a subtly different taper than Shimano
and most other square taper cranks, which makes them
non-interchangeable.

3) Can anyone point me to an online source for a replacement BB with that
width and that spindle length? The BB, aside from having too short a
spindle (I think it's for a double), feels tight and grindy and I have no
idea how or if it can be serviced.


http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/17mm/kit712

Note the price. Compare to the price of 5 Shimano or Campagnolo bottom
brackets. I'm just sayin'.

For a different spindle length or taper, or for a replacement spindle,
you'll have to consult Klein directly. Likely you won't have much (or
any) variety to choose from. You should probably acquire a couple of
spare spindles regardless.

If you must use a Campagnolo crank (and if Klein's spindle isn't
available in a Campy taper), you can have the BB shell tapped for the
problematic but still marginally supported Italian 36mm x 24 tpi
threading. (If you do this, don't expect any future help from Klein,
though.)

You might be better off taking your bike to a highly qualified repair
shop than working on it yourself. However, you are probably better off
doing the work yourself than taking it to an unqualified repair shop.
If you can overhaul the other parts of your bike, than I say take a
crack at it. But if you usually take the bike in to have the chain
replaced, wheels trued, brakes adjusted, etc., then definitely hand it
over to the experts for a new BB.

Chalo Colina

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  #2  
Old September 14th 05, 02:01 PM
Lou Holtman
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks

HP wrote:


Hi, thanks for the detailed info. I've some follow-up questions:

. I've never seen threadless/pressed BBs before. How much force is needed
to tap out the BB?


You just have to tab out the bearing at one side by tapping on the
spindle with a mallet on the other side (gently). Please don't damage
the spindle while doing it. Mayby screw in a bolt first. The bearing
will be shot I think. Just get a new one. The are cheap. How much force?
Well I don't know. It came in so it has to come out.

Once it's out and serviced, can I tap it back in, or do
I need to rig up some sort of a press?


Get new bearings (standard cheap stuff) and tap them in with a piece of
pipe with the same inner/outer diameter as the outer race of the bearing.


. Is the above bearing race available at hardware stores like McLendon or
Lowe's, or is mail-order the only route?


I don't know the situation in the States (?), but a good hardware store
should have them.


. I measured spindle length to be 113mm (so I guess it's long enough after
all). How can I tell if it's tapered for Campy or non-Campy?


Measure?

Since the
Klein BB is most likely original equipment, I'm thinking it probably caters
to Shimano cranks, but not sure. I've included some more shots of it here,

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...e_spindle1.jpg
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...e_spindle2.jpg

A more serious problem which I haven't mentioned is that a crank bolt
broke, and a piece of it is inside the hollow spindle on the non-drive side
(can be seen in one of the pics above). I opted for BB replacement as I
thought it would be a drop-in affair, but if I have to drag it into the LBS
to tap the shell, I might as well figure out how to tap & extract the
broken bolt.


Normally with a left thread tap if it is right thread or vice versa.
A lathe would be handy since you have to drill a straight hole in the
broken bolt. If this don't work drill out the whole bolt. Once again a
lathe comes in handy.

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu
  #3  
Old September 14th 05, 10:50 PM
Chalo
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks

HP wrote:

. I've never seen threadless/pressed BBs before. How much force is needed
to tap out the BB?


It depends on factors outside your control. It might be loctited, in
which case some heat (like 250F) could be necessary. Since there's no
retaining clip I can see, I assume it's in there pretty darn tight.

Once it's out and serviced, can I tap it back in, or do
I need to rig up some sort of a press?


Probably you should drive it in. Since the bearings must be installed
with the spindle in place, it's not obvious how you'd go about pressing
them in with ordinary tools. Maybe with a big vise, a couple of short
sections of tube, and a helper.

. Is the above bearing race available at hardware stores like McLendon or
Lowe's, or is mail-order the only route?


Local bearing supplies or even bolt & fastener places will have them.
You are likely to pay a bundle for them that way, though.

. I measured spindle length to be 113mm (so I guess it's long enough after
all). How can I tell if it's tapered for Campy or non-Campy?


Campy spindles have a slightly smaller tip than Shimano and others. If
you have access to a dial caliper or micrometer, you could measure a
Brand C and a Brand S and see which one corresponds to what you've got.


A more serious problem which I haven't mentioned is that a crank bolt
broke, and a piece of it is inside the hollow spindle on the non-drive side


Usually, when a bolt head breaks off, the tension is released on the
fastener. That means you may be able to tease the thing out with a
sharp punch by striking off-center at such an angle as to unscrew it.
If that doesn't work, punch the broken screw's center as well as you
can, and drill into it (preferably with a left-hand drill bit). If the
LH bit doesn't grab it and back it out, use an easy-out (extractor) on
the hole you just drilled.

http://www.allprotools.com/store/page145.html

Stay aware of the possibility that it could be cheaper to get a new
spindle. To that end, it might be a good idea to find out first
whether you can buy a replacement spindle easily, and how much it will
cost you.

Good luck.

Chalo Colina

  #4  
Old September 15th 05, 02:52 AM
Jasper Janssen
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks

On 14 Sep 2005 14:50:12 -0700, "Chalo" wrote:

Stay aware of the possibility that it could be cheaper to get a new
spindle. To that end, it might be a good idea to find out first
whether you can buy a replacement spindle easily, and how much it will
cost you.


http://www.reset-racing.de/reset/reset3.htm These guys make cartridge BBs
for klein/storck of that kind. From 99 euros apiece, available in various
Shimano lengths and octalink (as well as hollowtech-II non-spindle
thingy), but no campy. Klein spindles for shimano are available here and
there as closeout NOS deals. If this is as simple as it looks (a spindle
with flanges and industrial bearings pressed in so that the spindle is
caught between the two bearings), it may also be possible to modify other
spindles to fit. Of course, the words "machine a BB spindle" ought to
strike fear into the hearts of all, so may be a bad idea.

Bottom line: Find a different crankset.


Jasper
  #5  
Old September 15th 05, 06:18 PM
maxo
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks


Local bearing supplies or even bolt & fastener places will have them.
You are likely to pay a bundle for them that way, though.


My local industrial bearing house had them for $5 (usd) per side, fwiw.
$4-6 seems to be the universal price on the internet as well.

  #6  
Old September 15th 05, 07:42 PM
Chalo
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Default Help Needed: Bottom Bracket & Cranks

maxo wrote:

Chalo wrote:

Local bearing supplies or even bolt & fastener places will have them.
You are likely to pay a bundle for them that way, though.


My local industrial bearing house had them for $5 (usd) per side, fwiw.
$4-6 seems to be the universal price on the internet as well.


I posted a link upthread to a vendor who sells sets of ten 6003-2RS
bearings for $15.

I have had mixed results from my local bearing supply-- sometimes they
have a bearing I want for a reasonable price (usually $3 to $10
depending on the specific item) and sometimes they want 3 or 4 times
the price I can get from a bike shop.

When the bike shop's price is within range of the commodity price, I
buy bearings from the bike shop. The usual "Enduro" or "Enduro Max"
bearings (which are distributed by QBP) are specific to cycling
applications, with a larger than normal amount of grease. Some sizes
are available in full-complement versions, which have increased radial
load capacity, a little more bearing drag, and slightly higher cost.

Chalo Colina

 




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