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#161
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 4:48:54 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 01:13:05 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 1:46:39 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 21:58:39 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 11:28:55 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote: Snipped One thing I've always thought missing from the legal system was some sort of protection of the maker from those too stupid to use the device properly. For example: If YOU aren't bright enough to properly secure the wheel then the results of YOUR failure to properly secure the wheel is YOUR fault. Or perhaps: "Purchase of this devise is limited to those who know how to use it". -- Cheers, John B. You'd be amazed at how many people who have a bicycle with a quick release wheel do NOT know how to use the quick release properly. Most use it like a long lever to crank the release until it's tight. I've stopped bicyclists who had their quick release pointed straight out from and inline with the axle. When I worked as a sales person in bicycle shops I ALWAYS asked a customer buying a bicycle with a quick release if they'd used one before and then I'd get them to demonstrate that they knew how to use the quick release properly. So many times a custome who did it wrong would say after being shown the right way to use it, "Gee. No one ever showed my that before." I shudder to think about how many bicycles out there are being riddn with improperly secured front wheel quick releases. Those are the people for whom lawyer Lips might be a good thing. If you know how to do it seems so simple that "everyone must know how to do it". I worked on a job training heavy equipment mechanics and one of the students was trying to tension the tracks on a crawler crane - probably a 2" or 3" nut - turning it backward. I said something like "Heh! Don't you know how to tighten a bolt?" The student said that "No, he didn't know." I asked him hadn't he even tightened the wheel on his bicycle and he replied, "No, we weren't rich. We didn't have a bicycle." I must add that after that experience we added a class on nuts, bolts and threads, to our curriculum :-) On another note. I saw a rather stupid bicyclist as I was riding home from a nearby city late last night. This dud was wearing black or dark clothing, was riding a dark colour bicycle and had neither lights nor reflectors. the stupid part? He was doing it on a narrow unlit country road which meant the he was just about invisible most ofthe time. I only saw him as I came up abreast of him as he was riding towards me. He blended nearly perfectly into the background. Some people truly do not have any common sense. Cheers -- Cheers, John B. What's really scary is that many of those who assemble bicycles for various department stores don't know how to use a quick release properly either.. I can't tell you how many I've seen on the floor ready to for the customer to take home but have the quick rlease wrong. Sometimes it's used like a one sided wing nut, other times it'spointing frontwards on the front wheel and other times it's pointed downward on the curb side of the front wheel where a hit on the curb can open the quick release fully. I guess if the assemlers of a salespeople of department store bicycles don't know how to use a quick release then oe ca't really blame the customer for not knowing either. Lawyer Lips then are second line of defense against incompetence. Cheers When we are in Phuket I'm the neighborhood bicycle guy and the kids bring their broken bikes to me to fix. It is quite obvious that the people that assemble these things in the shops store are not quite up to scratch. Now, we don't live in the "high rent" district and I'm fairly sure that the base line, for many of the people in the neighborhood, criteria for selecting a kid's bicycle is "cheap", but still... "The brakes don't work", "No, the clamp bolt that holds the cable isn't tight". -- Cheers, John B. Or the brake blocks are so far from the rim that the brake lever hits the handlebar before the brake can engage strongly. I wonder how many bicycling accidents are caused by improperly assembled department store bicycles? Cheers |
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#162
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 02:31:21 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote: On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 4:48:54 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 01:13:05 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 1:46:39 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 21:58:39 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 11:28:55 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote: Snipped One thing I've always thought missing from the legal system was some sort of protection of the maker from those too stupid to use the device properly. For example: If YOU aren't bright enough to properly secure the wheel then the results of YOUR failure to properly secure the wheel is YOUR fault. Or perhaps: "Purchase of this devise is limited to those who know how to use it". -- Cheers, John B. You'd be amazed at how many people who have a bicycle with a quick release wheel do NOT know how to use the quick release properly. Most use it like a long lever to crank the release until it's tight. I've stopped bicyclists who had their quick release pointed straight out from and inline with the axle. When I worked as a sales person in bicycle shops I ALWAYS asked a customer buying a bicycle with a quick release if they'd used one before and then I'd get them to demonstrate that they knew how to use the quick release properly. So many times a custome who did it wrong would say after being shown the right way to use it, "Gee. No one ever showed my that before." I shudder to think about how many bicycles out there are being riddn with improperly secured front wheel quick releases. Those are the people for whom lawyer Lips might be a good thing. If you know how to do it seems so simple that "everyone must know how to do it". I worked on a job training heavy equipment mechanics and one of the students was trying to tension the tracks on a crawler crane - probably a 2" or 3" nut - turning it backward. I said something like "Heh! Don't you know how to tighten a bolt?" The student said that "No, he didn't know." I asked him hadn't he even tightened the wheel on his bicycle and he replied, "No, we weren't rich. We didn't have a bicycle." I must add that after that experience we added a class on nuts, bolts and threads, to our curriculum :-) On another note. I saw a rather stupid bicyclist as I was riding home from a nearby city late last night. This dud was wearing black or dark clothing, was riding a dark colour bicycle and had neither lights nor reflectors. the stupid part? He was doing it on a narrow unlit country road which meant the he was just about invisible most ofthe time. I only saw him as I came up abreast of him as he was riding towards me. He blended nearly perfectly into the background. Some people truly do not have any common sense. Cheers -- Cheers, John B. What's really scary is that many of those who assemble bicycles for various department stores don't know how to use a quick release properly either. I can't tell you how many I've seen on the floor ready to for the customer to take home but have the quick rlease wrong. Sometimes it's used like a one sided wing nut, other times it'spointing frontwards on the front wheel and other times it's pointed downward on the curb side of the front wheel where a hit on the curb can open the quick release fully. I guess if the assemlers of a salespeople of department store bicycles don't know how to use a quick release then oe ca't really blame the customer for not knowing either. Lawyer Lips then are second line of defense against incompetence. Cheers When we are in Phuket I'm the neighborhood bicycle guy and the kids bring their broken bikes to me to fix. It is quite obvious that the people that assemble these things in the shops store are not quite up to scratch. Now, we don't live in the "high rent" district and I'm fairly sure that the base line, for many of the people in the neighborhood, criteria for selecting a kid's bicycle is "cheap", but still... "The brakes don't work", "No, the clamp bolt that holds the cable isn't tight". -- Cheers, John B. Or the brake blocks are so far from the rim that the brake lever hits the handlebar before the brake can engage strongly. I wonder how many bicycling accidents are caused by improperly assembled department store bicycles? Cheers One thing the kids in my neighborhood are adapt at is dragging their feet. It doesn't work well while barefooted but as long as you are wearing sandals it is quite efficient. :-) -- Cheers, John B. |
#163
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 4:28:51 AM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 02:31:21 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 4:48:54 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Tue, 22 Aug 2017 01:13:05 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 1:46:39 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote: On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 21:58:39 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, August 21, 2017 at 11:28:55 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote: Snipped One thing I've always thought missing from the legal system was some sort of protection of the maker from those too stupid to use the device properly. For example: If YOU aren't bright enough to properly secure the wheel then the results of YOUR failure to properly secure the wheel is YOUR fault. Or perhaps: "Purchase of this devise is limited to those who know how to use it". -- Cheers, John B. You'd be amazed at how many people who have a bicycle with a quick release wheel do NOT know how to use the quick release properly. Most use it like a long lever to crank the release until it's tight. I've stopped bicyclists who had their quick release pointed straight out from and inline with the axle. When I worked as a sales person in bicycle shops I ALWAYS asked a customer buying a bicycle with a quick release if they'd used one before and then I'd get them to demonstrate that they knew how to use the quick release properly. So many times a custome who did it wrong would say after being shown the right way to use it, "Gee. No one ever showed my that before." I shudder to think about how many bicycles out there are being riddn with improperly secured front wheel quick releases. Those are the people for whom lawyer Lips might be a good thing. If you know how to do it seems so simple that "everyone must know how to do it". I worked on a job training heavy equipment mechanics and one of the students was trying to tension the tracks on a crawler crane - probably a 2" or 3" nut - turning it backward. I said something like "Heh! Don't you know how to tighten a bolt?" The student said that "No, he didn't know." I asked him hadn't he even tightened the wheel on his bicycle and he replied, "No, we weren't rich. We didn't have a bicycle." I must add that after that experience we added a class on nuts, bolts and threads, to our curriculum :-) On another note. I saw a rather stupid bicyclist as I was riding home from a nearby city late last night. This dud was wearing black or dark clothing, was riding a dark colour bicycle and had neither lights nor reflectors. the stupid part? He was doing it on a narrow unlit country road which meant the he was just about invisible most ofthe time. I only saw him as I came up abreast of him as he was riding towards me. He blended nearly perfectly into the background. Some people truly do not have any common sense. Cheers -- Cheers, John B. What's really scary is that many of those who assemble bicycles for various department stores don't know how to use a quick release properly either. I can't tell you how many I've seen on the floor ready to for the customer to take home but have the quick rlease wrong. Sometimes it's used like a one sided wing nut, other times it'spointing frontwards on the front wheel and other times it's pointed downward on the curb side of the front wheel where a hit on the curb can open the quick release fully. I guess if the assemlers of a salespeople of department store bicycles don't know how to use a quick release then oe ca't really blame the customer for not knowing either. Lawyer Lips then are second line of defense against incompetence. Cheers When we are in Phuket I'm the neighborhood bicycle guy and the kids bring their broken bikes to me to fix. It is quite obvious that the people that assemble these things in the shops store are not quite up to scratch. Now, we don't live in the "high rent" district and I'm fairly sure that the base line, for many of the people in the neighborhood, criteria for selecting a kid's bicycle is "cheap", but still... "The brakes don't work", "No, the clamp bolt that holds the cable isn't tight". -- Cheers, John B. Or the brake blocks are so far from the rim that the brake lever hits the handlebar before the brake can engage strongly. I wonder how many bicycling accidents are caused by improperly assembled department store bicycles? Cheers One thing the kids in my neighborhood are adapt at is dragging their feet. It doesn't work well while barefooted but as long as you are wearing sandals it is quite efficient. :-) -- Cheers, John B. I wonder when it will occur to anyone that this conversation has more than run its course? |
#164
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
On 2017-08-21 17:53, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 21 Aug 2017 07:18:53 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-20 18:02, John B. wrote: On Sun, 20 Aug 2017 07:21:42 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-20 00:19, wrote: On Sat, 19 Aug 2017 07:07:19 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-18 22:19, wrote: On Fri, 18 Aug 2017 12:01:08 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-17 19:10, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 8/17/2017 7:13 PM, Joerg wrote: On 2017-08-17 07:17, jbeattie wrote: I should be like Joerg and complain about spending money on replacements. My crappy ISIS BB didn't last a lifetime! ISIS was the only thing worse than Octalink. And here you guys razz me for being too critical of the quality of bicycle parts. In the automotive world a manufacturer with such failure rates would be our business prontissimo. Imagine you were a car commuter and the equivalent happened with your car. The drive shafts conks out in due course, you go through universal joints like Kleenex, the steering wheel breaks, then the transmission wears out, in less than two years the wheel bearings start singing the blues. Oh, and then the car's chassis develops a big fat crack at a structurally critical location. A car owner would be up in arms about that. Yet with bicycles we are expected to find this perfectly normal? There are choices, Joerg. You (like most of us here) choose to buy sport bikes - that is, bikes that compete in the market by trying to be fairly lightweight, bikes that use "innovative" designs for components, bikes designed for higher performance or off-road banging about. Since when is a XC MTB a sport bike? Also, I have an SUV, a _sport_ utility vehicle. In over 20 years not even a bulb in a dome light has ever dared to burn out. Being a enthusiast I'm sure that you know that the so called "SUV" was developed in order to evade the CAFE standards, and clean air regulations, by building a vehicle based on a pickup truck chasses and classified as a truck so as not having to comply with the fuel consumption and emissions laws regarding passenger cars.. Where did you pick up that urban legend? My SUV (built on a truck chassis) must pass the very same emissions standards as the Mitsubishi Eclipse which has the same engine. Gets tested every two years just like passenger cars. Same for all the other SUVs around here. What part of "was developed" is it that you do not understand? It's still wrong. One of the first SUVs ever developed was the Unimog and it had to pass inspections just like other cars. That was "a tad" before 1994. Err, the first Unimog was built in 1946, not 1994, and Daimler-Benz took over manufacture of the Unimog in 1951, not 1994. I know. However, in 1994 Mercedes Benz built twelve examples of the "Funmog" with luxury extras such as leather seats and carpets. It was the most expensive Unimog, with prices starting at DM150,000. Perhaps you are confused. No, it was just to illustrate that it's got nothing to do with your tiers. I am not talking about leather-seated butt-heating luxury vehicles but the utility version. They usually had the same engine as one of the Mercedes passenger cars, same emissions. It is the same way with my Mitsubishi SUV which has the same engine and emissions as a Mitsubishi Eclipse passenger car. I was trying to be polite. You said " One of the first SUVs ever developed was the Unimog and it had to pass inspections just like other cars". And I said "Err, the first Unimog was built in 1946". Would you care to tell us what the emissions, or fuel consumption standards were, in the U.S., in 1946? Obviously there weren't any standards enforced around WW-II. The same applied to my first car (Citroen 2CV) which was conceived in 1939 and then built for another half century. Fact is, when passenger cars came under smog requirements so did SUVs. Regardlesss of when they were designed. And this was well before the 90's as you had mentioned. I happen to know for sure because I lived there and my cars had to pass "Abgassonderuntersuchung" (the German version of smog test). Just like they all had to learn to live with unleaded gas, regardless of whether it was a car or an SUV. Initially, way back when the SUV was invented the emissions standards we Tier 1: Were phased in from 1994 to 1997, and were phased out in favor of the national Tier 2 standard, from 2004 to 2009. Tier I standards cover vehicles with a gross vehicular weight rating (GVWR) below 8,500 pounds (3,856 kg) and are divided into five categories: one for passenger cars, and four for light-duty trucks (which include SUVs and minivans) divided up based on the vehicle weight and cargo capacity. "SUV" redirects here. For other uses, see SUV (disambiguation). A sport utility vehicle or suburban utility vehicle (SUV) is a vehicle classified as a light truck, but operated as a family vehicle All from the Wiki Yeah, and Wiki knows it all. Well, given that anyone that knows something about the subject is free to edit the Wiki entries I find that generally it is more accurate then what a single author expounds about a subject that he/she/it so obviously knows nothing about. Now you seem to be confused. Probably. Although not as badly as someone who argues about emissions standards in 1946. About emissions standards that cars designed back then had to fulfill later. There is no difference between cars and SUV as you claimed, they must pass the same tests. Maybe not in some far-off countries but in the US, Germany and so on they do. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#165
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Octalink ES25 replacement?
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