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#1
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
Here is a copy of the email I just sent to Trek in regards to a warranty claim on my wheels. "I would like to express my disappointment with a warranty claim I have in relation to the wheels on my Trek 1500 (2005). I have just had the rims replace due to them coming cracking and coming apart in a major way. The fact that you replaced the rims quickly and without fuss doe go in your favour but the fact that I have had to pay $110 to have the wheels rebuilt and a additional $44 in new spokes due to being stressed by the damaged rims has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I have been told by the Rideshop here in Canberra that had I been able to take the bike back to the shop I purchased it from (I recently moved to the ACT from SA so sending the wheels back to Bernie Jones was not a option) they probably would have not charged me for labour. The fact that you expect the user or the shop to pay for items as part of a warranty repair is unbelievable; especially when you consider that the wheels are only 8 months old. Could you please explain why this is the case?" Since this happened I have had quite a few people tell me to ditch the wheels and replace them as the problem will only occur again. Anyone else out there have any problems with these wheels or with Trek warranty? -- jcjordan |
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#2
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
jcjordan wrote: Here is a copy of the email I just sent to Trek in regards to a warranty claim on my wheels. "I would like to express my disappointment with a warranty claim I have in relation to the wheels on my Trek 1500 (2005). I have just had the rims replace due to them coming cracking and coming apart in a major way. The fact that you replaced the rims quickly and without fuss doe go in your favour but the fact that I have had to pay $110 to have the wheels rebuilt and a additional $44 in new spokes due to being stressed by the damaged rims has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I have been told by the Rideshop here in Canberra that had I been able to take the bike back to the shop I purchased it from (I recently moved to the ACT from SA so sending the wheels back to Bernie Jones was not a option) they probably would have not charged me for labour. The fact that you expect the user or the shop to pay for items as part of a warranty repair is unbelievable; especially when you consider that the wheels are only 8 months old. Could you please explain why this is the case?" Since this happened I have had quite a few people tell me to ditch the wheels and replace them as the problem will only occur again. Anyone else out there have any problems with these wheels or with Trek warranty? I've not seen a Bonty "Select" wheel come back to the shop I do a bit of work for - but we don't sell a lot of them. We've done Trek warranty work though - had to replace a faulty frame (to be fair, it was 12 years old and the BB thread housing had seperated from the frame, a known problem on early OCLVs). Trek replaced the frame, but we did the changeover of the other bits and didn't do it for free. I wouldn't really expect Trek to pay for that time though. The punter effectively got a new Madone 5.2 frame for the cost of a changeover of running gear. Quite a nice upgrade ... not a bad deal, I reckon. In some ways the selling bike shop has to accept some of the risk with a warranty claim, I think that's not entirely unreasonable - and if you take the bike back to a different retailer then it's only fair that they charge for their time. They didn't make anything on the sale. Maybe a fairer solution would be for Trek to replace the whole wheel, saving the LBS the time having to rebuild wheels (which is time consuming). I suspect if it was our LBS that we'd fix it for free if we'd sold it as part of good service to our customers. We've done this with other bikes that have bounced back on warranty. Even if Trek replaced the whole wheel the LBS still has to spend time chasing up the claim for you, and as it's not the shop that you bought the bike from it seems only fair that they charge for some of that time. The question is, who pays?! There's the question of just how did the wheels end up broken too - wheels cop a lot of abuse - what made them fail? Overtightening? Design fault? Bashing into a kerb? 8 months is a meaningless figure anyway, how much have you used them in that 8 months? 5,000km? 20,000km? Crashed them at all? Not an easy question, alas. Hope you sort it out. |
#3
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
Bleve Wrote: In some ways the selling bike shop has to accept some of the risk with a warranty claim, I think that's not entirely unreasonable - and if you take the bike back to a different retailer then it's only fair that they charge for their time. They didn't make anything on the sale. I dont see why, they are not responsible for a faulty product; at least not in this case. Bleve Wrote: Maybe a fairer solution would be for Trek to replace the whole wheel, saving the LBS the time having to rebuild wheels (which is time consuming). I suspect if it was our LBS that we'd fix it for free if we'd sold it as part of good service to our customers. We've done this with other bikes that have bounced back on warranty. Even if Trek replaced the whole wheel the LBS still has to spend time chasing up the claim for you, and as it's not the shop that you bought the bike from it seems only fair that they charge for some of that time. I hope you did not think I was blaming the guys in the rideshop, they have been nothing but the greatest help in relation to this. Heck they were even grumbling that they thought Trek would just send complete wheels Bleve Wrote: The question is, who pays?! There's the question of just how did the wheels end up broken too - wheels cop a lot of abuse - what made them fail? Overtightening? Design fault? Bashing into a kerb? 8 months is a meaningless figure anyway, how much have you used them in that 8 months? 5,000km? 20,000km? Crashed them at all? Not an easy question, alas. I agree wheels do cop some heavy use, but in this case never crashed, cleaned regularly and I dont consider 200-300km a week heavy use. Still we will see what happens, the important part is that I have them back and I can ride again. the missus reckons this week has been hell and is glad to have a non grumpy husband, even if i do leave my gear all over the lounge -- jcjordan |
#4
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
jcjordan wrote: Bleve Wrote: In some ways the selling bike shop has to accept some of the risk with a warranty claim, I think that's not entirely unreasonable - and if you take the bike back to a different retailer then it's only fair that they charge for their time. They didn't make anything on the sale. I dont see why, they are not responsible for a faulty product; at least not in this case. To a certain extent I agree, but the retailer is part of the chain, they have to accept some of the financial risk. It may be reasonably low risk - eg if a part breaks they may only need to spend a bit of time contacting the wholesaler/distributor, but it's still a risk. The retailer also has to accept that they "push" (for lack of a better term) a product, and if it has problems they are partially responsible - they did recommend it. If they'd said to you "these wheels are junk, buy something else", then the case is different, but I doubt they did that! I'm not saying Bonty select wheels are junk (I don't know enough about them to have an opinion). But, when a shop sells something they have to accept some responsibility for the suitability of what they're selling (or you'd just buy off ebay, right?!). You pay a premium at an LBS because you value advice and service. As such, if that advice is poor, then the LBS should take some responsibility for it. Maybe a fairer solution would be for Trek to replace the whole wheel, saving the LBS the time having to rebuild wheels (which is time consuming). I suspect if it was our LBS that we'd fix it for free if we'd sold it as part of good service to our customers. We've done this with other bikes that have bounced back on warranty. Even if Trek replaced the whole wheel the LBS still has to spend time chasing up the claim for you, and as it's not the shop that you bought the bike from it seems only fair that they charge for some of that time. I hope you did not think I was blaming the guys in the rideshop, they have been nothing but the greatest help in relation to this. Heck they were even grumbling that they thought Trek would just send complete wheels No, and I apologise if it seemed that way. The question is, who pays?! There's the question of just how did the wheels end up broken too - wheels cop a lot of abuse - what made them fail? Overtightening? Design fault? Bashing into a kerb? 8 months is a meaningless figure anyway, how much have you used them in that 8 months? 5,000km? 20,000km? Crashed them at all? Not an easy question, alas. I agree wheels do cop some heavy use, but in this case never crashed, cleaned regularly and I dont consider 200-300km a week heavy use. I wouldn't consider that hard use either, but now we know it! Prior to now, only you knew it A lot can go wrong with wheels - they can have manufacturing defects, they can be under-engineered (hello, shimano, this means your R540& R550 wheels ...), they can be over or under or unevenly tightened, and they can be bashed into things! In this case, you suggest that the rims have split - this would imply either a manufacturing defect or underengineering (quite possible) or overtightening of the spokes, or a bash. Without actually seeing the rims it's difficult to say what caused the problem. even with seeing them, it may be difficult to determine what caused the problem. As such, the Trek distributor may be doing you a favour (may .. not is definatly!) by replacing the rims without question, as it *may* (I'm stressing the word for a reason!) not be a fault with the manufacture of the wheels. Then again, maybe the wheels you got were faulty? They are pretty cheap wheels - Trek cut a few corners to get the 1500 as cheap as it is. At least they didn't skimp on the frame! The low-end Trek roadbikes have very good frames. Still we will see what happens, the important part is that I have them back and I can ride again. the missus reckons this week has been hell and is glad to have a non grumpy husband, even if i do leave my gear all over the lounge heh! |
#5
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
I think that there are actually very few 'stock' parts that are going
to go the distance. The majority of stock/factory/OEM wheels are machine made and require some additional tensioning before prolonger use. In the beginner/enthusiast range, the hidden parts are as cheap as poss. Many BB's esp in mtb's are just junk. ISIS BB's are notorious for failing and the manuafacteurs of these parts are jumping ship to another design, BUT still making the unreliable ISIS BB's. WTF! Six weeks to three months for a TI Axled BB and then they charge like wounded bulls to replace the bearings? Only shimano seem to have the Splined axel down pat, in fact some mechanics I know are prefering the old square taper system to any of the newer bb/crank interfaces. Wheels.... well an entire kettle of fish on its own.... the facts are, I believe, the more you ride the bike - the quicker you can expect to fix or replace something. Whether you have dinted or worn out a rim, its just a factor of how long it takes. A fact accelerated by a factor of how much you use your bike. Fancy wheels or prebuilt wheel sets are best left for competition where risks are acceptable, If you want a lighter set of wheels to train on then you accpet the risk that something will break or wear out faster. Thems the breaks! 105 wheels are a trickle down of Durace technology, but again a risk involved in using them. Lower spoke counts require higher spoke tension to keep straight, stonger/heavier rims the sustain the lower spoke count. If your are going to commute or train on these rims, you can expect that the greater loads these wheels have to endure are going to take their toll on the wheels. A cut down version of a racing wheel is just not going to last. If you want a set of wheels that can last thru several seasons and put up with commuting, then choose 36h eyeletted rims and good qualtiy hubs. Bear in mind that riding throught potholes and such can damage any wheel setup. Personally, weighing over a hundred, and commuting with panniers, I would choose at least 105 hubs, DT spokes, brass nipples and choose a rim like MAVIC CXP-33 or OPEN PRO. Not the cheapest - but very durable. Heck I've even riden off road on what I would class as steep, but smooth downhill tracks. ( 30c cyclocross tyres) |
#6
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
Well not even two months on the replacement wheels are starting to bend. Even gave Trek Australia a call and they said they would call back, which they did not do. Spoke to Simon at the Rideshop in Canberra, $600 and i can get a set of DT Swiss R1.1 rims, 26 spoke, ultegra hubs; they will be alot stronger and 100g lighter. Mate i ride with has a set and they are fantastic. -- jcjordan |
#7
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
jcjordan wrote: Well not even two months on the replacement wheels are starting to bend. Even gave Trek Australia a call and they said they would call back, which they did not do. Spoke to Simon at the Rideshop in Canberra, $600 and i can get a set of DT Swiss R1.1 rims, 26 spoke, ultegra hubs; they will be alot stronger and 100g lighter. Mate i ride with has a set and they are fantastic. Interesting that the selects are bending. What do you weigh? What sort of riding are you doing? Potholes? Kerbs? Velodromes? Bonty selects are the bottom end bonty wheels, they'll be heavy, but I wouldn't have thought they'd be fragile. And even more interesting that you can get 26 spoke R1.1s They must be *very* special! |
#8
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
Bleve Wrote: jcjordan wrote: Well not even two months on the replacement wheels are starting to bend. Even gave Trek Australia a call and they said they would call back, which they did not do. Spoke to Simon at the Rideshop in Canberra, $600 and i can get a set of DT Swiss R1.1 rims, 26 spoke, ultegra hubs; they will be alot stronger and 100g lighter. Mate i ride with has a set and they are fantastic. Interesting that the selects are bending. What do you weigh? What sort of riding are you doing? Potholes? Kerbs? Velodromes? Bonty selects are the bottom end bonty wheels, they'll be heavy, but I wouldn't have thought they'd be fragile. And even more interesting that you can get 26 spoke R1.1s They must be *very* special! I weight about 95kg and doing alot of commuting style riding, so some of the roads are a bit rough but i have managed to avoid all the potholes or major thumps on the wheels. 26 may be the wrong number, memory can be a bit fickle some times. I do know from the wheel builder that they will be lighter then the selects, but alot stronger, and a lot more spokes. -- jcjordan |
#9
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Bontrager Select Wheel Problems and poor service from Trek
jcjordan wrote: I weight about 95kg and doing alot of commuting style riding, so some of the roads are a bit rough but i have managed to avoid all the potholes or major thumps on the wheels. Interesting. The LBS I work at sells a few Treks and I've not heard of any wheels going out quicky. Will see what I can find out about them.... 26 may be the wrong number, memory can be a bit fickle some times. I do know from the wheel builder that they will be lighter then the selects, but alot stronger, and a lot more spokes. Conventional wheel spoke counts are almost always divisable by 4.You'd be looking at a 28 spoke wheel. Can I suggest, for a 95kg lad, a 32 or 36 spoke wheel? It'll be a bit stronger and more reliable as a commuter. Save the 28 spoke jobs for race day or a day in the hills. I have a RR1.1 rim on a Hugi hub (28 spoke radial) front wheel on my wet weather bike and it's been pretty bombproof, and I'm about your weight, give or take 5kg |
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