Chain lube for wet _and_ dry?

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/

The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a 50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/

The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a 50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use, or
alternately use a commercial chain lube as used in industry. See
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...in-lubrication

I used to use "wax", and may go back to that system, and currently use
a commercial chain oil and both last far longer than what you mention
in tropical monsoon weather.
--
cheers,

John B.

On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/

The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a 50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in
there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst
friend does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.


... or
alternately use a commercial chain lube as used in industry. See
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...in-lubrication


Same thing there, they distinguish between dry or wet situations. Most
times outside of summer we have dry plus wet, not either/or.


I used to use "wax", and may go back to that system, and currently use
a commercial chain oil and both last far longer than what you mention
in tropical monsoon weather.


Can you share the type and brand name of that miracle chain oil? Though
I believe you ride on roads almost exclusively. I am on dirt most of the
time. This means lots of brown dust when it's dry, water when it rains
and mud splatters after it stopped raining. Often all during one ride.

Dirt bike chain lube works very well but it is nasty and sticky. It
clings to skin like glue and is almost impossible to wash out of
clothing. After clearing up a bad chain suck the hands are intensely
soiled and you essentially can't go into a restaurant or pub anymore.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 9/23/2016 1:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/


The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a 50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in
there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst
friend does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.


In my case, it doesn't mean that. It means waxing the chain while it's
on the bike, using a low-flame propane torch to heat about 10 links at a
time. It takes less than five minutes per bike.

I'd give details yet again, but it probably wouldn't work for you.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 2016-09-23 11:54, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2016 1:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it
was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises
once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/



The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a
50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in
there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst
friend does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.


In my case, it doesn't mean that. It means waxing the chain while it's
on the bike, using a low-flame propane torch to heat about 10 links at a
time. It takes less than five minutes per bike.

I'd give details yet again, but it probably wouldn't work for you.


I have a propane torch and also a 240V industrial (electrical) hot air
gun used for shrink tubing. Why wouldn't it work for me? Because of the
grit and dust from trails?

Chain cleaning takes at least 20mins each bike. The MTB chain has caked
brown dirt which comes off easy. The road chain bike is fairly clean
after lots of bike path riding but grimy soot-black after riding lots of
road. Gives me goose bumps thinking that I also breath whatever causes
this. I found the disposable interdental brushes to work great for
cleaning. First used for my teeth, rinsed, dried, they go into a coin
envelope and that is used up in the garage. So they all work two jobs.

Lubing takes 10mins because I carefully dab it onto each link via Q-tip.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Friday, September 23, 2016 at 12:07:20 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-23 11:54, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2016 1:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises..
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it
was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises
once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/



The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a
50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in
there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst
friend does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.


In my case, it doesn't mean that. It means waxing the chain while it's
on the bike, using a low-flame propane torch to heat about 10 links at a
time. It takes less than five minutes per bike.

I'd give details yet again, but it probably wouldn't work for you.


I have a propane torch and also a 240V industrial (electrical) hot air
gun used for shrink tubing. Why wouldn't it work for me? Because of the
grit and dust from trails?

Chain cleaning takes at least 20mins each bike. The MTB chain has caked
brown dirt which comes off easy. The road chain bike is fairly clean
after lots of bike path riding but grimy soot-black after riding lots of
road. Gives me goose bumps thinking that I also breath whatever causes
this. I found the disposable interdental brushes to work great for
cleaning. First used for my teeth, rinsed, dried, they go into a coin
envelope and that is used up in the garage. So they all work two jobs.

Lubing takes 10mins because I carefully dab it onto each link via Q-tip.

You go to all that work, yet you use a hose-clamp on your headset. Incroyable.

I clean my chain in an ultrasonic cleaner followed by an autoclave and then polish each link with a Dremel buffer followed by final polish with a Q-tip and Semichrome. Then I apply a five-part "wax" lubricant containing molybdenum, graphite, Teflon and parafin and nitro-glycerin. Mixing safely is critical.

I allow that to dry thoroughly for a week followed by a 73.25 hour curing period in a heat/humidity controlled chamber that I built in my garage. One the chain is ready to ride, it produce a characteristic smell that can be detected by my specially trained Chihuahua lube-dog.

In the alternative, I skip all cleaning, squirt on some motorcycle chain lube -- or whatever lubricant is sitting next to the garage door -- and then go for a ride.

-- Jay Beattie.

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/

The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a 50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in there
and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst friend
does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.

In the days when I still trusted those tubs of chain lube wax that you put
on the stove - I started wondering if there's a risk of ruining the temper
of the steel.

Parafin is good for cleaning chains, but you can get cellulose thinners
cheap as "gun wash". It usually has a bit of sediment, but it doesn't leave
as much film as the fuel-oil.

My preferred method of lubrication is to pre treat with molybdenum and then
use PTFE.

The cheapest moly is car wheel bearing grease, but its tedious to apply
evenly and makes a mess. Molyslip engine additive is more expensive, but can
be applied with an oil can.

There's various options for the ongoing PTFE - Finish-line PTFE bicycle
grease, Slick 50 engine additive or the more expensive dry powder PTFE -
once you get it on there; it doesn't fling off.

On 2016-09-23 13:03, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 23, 2016 at 12:07:20 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-23 11:54, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2016 1:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road
bike I am happy since a thorough cleaning and application
of White Lightning Epic Ride easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I
can get 50 miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain
making nasty noises. But when the ride is dry and then wet
all bets are off. Yesterday it was the usual dusty ride at
first but a slight yet persistent drizzle started about 10
miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles after
a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking
noises once the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had
been flushed out. I had no choice but to continue another
10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill and the sound was
awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but
that just does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/





The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a
50mi dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing
chains in there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a
high-mileage ciclyst friend does, I don't really want to go to
that much effort.


In my case, it doesn't mean that. It means waxing the chain
while it's on the bike, using a low-flame propane torch to heat
about 10 links at a time. It takes less than five minutes per
bike.

I'd give details yet again, but it probably wouldn't work for
you.


I have a propane torch and also a 240V industrial (electrical) hot
air gun used for shrink tubing. Why wouldn't it work for me?
Because of the grit and dust from trails?

Chain cleaning takes at least 20mins each bike. The MTB chain has
caked brown dirt which comes off easy. The road chain bike is
fairly clean after lots of bike path riding but grimy soot-black
after riding lots of road. Gives me goose bumps thinking that I
also breath whatever causes this. I found the disposable
interdental brushes to work great for cleaning. First used for my
teeth, rinsed, dried, they go into a coin envelope and that is used
up in the garage. So they all work two jobs.

Lubing takes 10mins because I carefully dab it onto each link via
Q-tip.

You go to all that work, yet you use a hose-clamp on your headset.
Incroyable.


As I said the hose clamp works great :-)

The chain lube, not so much. Before I cleaned the MTB chain this
thoroughly the lube lasted even less. Now that I upped my ride mileage I
need it to last at least one ride. Not 3/4 of a ride.


I clean my chain in an ultrasonic cleaner followed by an autoclave
and then polish each link with a Dremel buffer followed by final
polish with a Q-tip and Semichrome. Then I apply a five-part "wax"
lubricant containing molybdenum, graphite, Teflon and parafin and
nitro-glycerin. Mixing safely is critical.

I allow that to dry thoroughly for a week followed by a 73.25 hour
curing period in a heat/humidity controlled chamber that I built in
my garage. One the chain is ready to ride, it produce a
characteristic smell that can be detected by my specially trained
Chihuahua lube-dog.


Can't do that, I'd have all the mountian lions trailing me because of
the scent. Especially those with a molybdenum fetish.


In the alternative, I skip all cleaning, squirt on some motorcycle
chain lube -- or whatever lubricant is sitting next to the garage
door -- and then go for a ride.


But probably not on a MTB. I once helped a buddy bend and fix his broken
chain (luckily I carried a spare link). He "lubes" with dirt bike chain
spray. The visit to the pub afterwards was embarrassing, holding my
stained hands behind me while ordering. Oh, and the handles on my MTB
looked the part as well after that ride.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2016-09-23 13:08, Benderthe.evilrobot wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2016-09-22 18:35, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:59:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

Chain lube is probably a contentious topic. On the road bike I am happy
since a thorough cleaning and application of White Lightning Epic Ride
easily lasts 200 miles.

Mountain bike, very different story. On dry dusty rides I can get 50
miles out of an Epic Ride lube without the chain making nasty noises.
But when the ride is dry and then wet all bets are off. Yesterday it
was
the usual dusty ride at first but a slight yet persistent drizzle
started about 10 miles into the ride. Long story short a mere 35 miles
after a fresh lube the chain started making horrid squeaking noises
once
the rain had stopped. Seemingly the lube had been flushed out. I had no
choice but to continue another 10mi in order to get home. Mostly uphill
and the sound was awful.

Most advice sites split between wet and dry situations but that just
does not cut it outside summer season:

http://oldglorymtb.com/best-mountain...ry-conditions/


The chain is a KMC X93 10-speed. I need a lube that lasts through a
50mi
dirt trail ride regardless of weather conditions.

Any words of wisdom from other all-weather MTB riders?

Try the paraffin lube system that both James and Frank use,


If that means boiling the chain in a paraffin pot, storing chains in
there and mount them in a rotating pattern as a high-mileage ciclyst
friend does, I don't really want to go to that much effort.

In the days when I still trusted those tubs of chain lube wax that you
put on the stove - I started wondering if there's a risk of ruining the
temper of the steel.

Parafin is good for cleaning chains, but you can get cellulose thinners
cheap as "gun wash". It usually has a bit of sediment, but it doesn't
leave as much film as the fuel-oil.


My wife would object to cooking bicycle chains in the kitchen. Well, at
least she allows me to boil the wort for beer brewing in there but
afterwards I have to take it outside.


My preferred method of lubrication is to pre treat with molybdenum and
then use PTFE.

The cheapest moly is car wheel bearing grease, but its tedious to apply
evenly and makes a mess. Molyslip engine additive is more expensive, but
can be applied with an oil can.


I only found Molyslip in the UK but could ask at the car place here in
town. I live in the Western US. Maybe they can order it somehow.

http://www.molyslip.com/

Do you use that on dirt trails?


There's various options for the ongoing PTFE - Finish-line PTFE bicycle
grease, Slick 50 engine additive or the more expensive dry powder PTFE -
once you get it on there; it doesn't fling off.


The White Lightning I use right now is essentially a PTFE lube. It works
great on the road bike, gives me over 200mi per lube which is beyond
expectations. Problem is that it's sometimes less than 40mi on the MTB
and my trail rides are longer than that.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

goo.gl/LQjtMV ….. drier/cleaner

goo.gl/yIdt3F….. wetter/gritty

https://www.google.com/search?site=i...yA0a6RGMjlM%3A

refresh wax with CRC