Prudhomme considers Tour de France stages without race radios

As I pointed out, you're not some 30 year old who grew up out on a farm
with a religion that didn't allow you to use most modern inventions. Floyd
not only grew up out there but attended those schools that stressed
religion at the cost of everything else. Floyd is just learning behavior
you already knew before your 21st birthday. Give the guy a enough of a
break to understand that he doesn't know the expanse of his seemingly (to
him) unimportant comments/insults etc.

Tom: I'm sorry, but that just doesn't wash. The most decent people I know
grew up in what you'd dersively call a "hick" environment. People who feel
the value of a man's word is more important than the profit that could be
gained by lying.

I find it very offensive that you would trash people who value their beliefs
above material things as being lesser, and that it's something they really
ought to outgrow.

If you've painted yourself into a corner and are trying to find a way out,
jump. Jump over the rhetoric and into the light. Recognize that those with a
background like Floyd would expect to be held to a HIGHER, not lower
standard, than the rest of us. And remember this- there is at least one
member of this newsgroup who is VERY proud of his family background in
farming. People who work with their hands, in the fields, whose livelihood
depends upon getting up before the sun comes up and praying that rain comes
when it's supposed to, and that, when they DO have a good crop, there are
eager buyers.

Yes, that's right, you can talk all you want about farm subsidies and such,
but the truth is that farmers go broke all the time because, at the time
they plant their crops, they don't have a good idea what that crop will
fetch when harvested. Imagine yourself going to work and not knowing what
you'll get paid until the end of the year.

It takes a special kind of person to do that. And it takes a special kind of
"city" person to belittle them.

Basic human decency is a fundamental part of the people you choose to make
fun of. And by the way, I don't share Floyd's religious background. But I
respect it. And I know its values. I wish that I could come close to living
up to the code of values such people do.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote in message
...
"jean-yves hervé" wrote in message
...

LeMond's testimony is arguably supported by an online posting Floyd
Landis made on the Daily Peloton forum, in which he states that LeMond
disclosed personal information of a sensitive nature to Landis, and
threatened to use the information to damage LeMond if he continues to
involve himself in Landis's USADA appeal process:

Let's remember that LeMond approached Landis and told him to come clean
and confess to having doped. LeMond then was being very public about
accusing seven times Tour winner Lance Armstrong of doping and he barely
knew the guy. Landis thought he was being pretty sophisticated by being
completely non-committal and giving LeMond nothing to argue about. Yet of
course LeMond simply started telling all of the cycling reporters that he
had asked Landis to confess.

As I pointed out, you're not some 30 year old who grew up out on a farm
with a religion that didn't allow you to use most modern inventions. Floyd
not only grew up out there but attended those schools that stressed
religion at the cost of everything else. Floyd is just learning behavior
you already knew before your 21st birthday. Give the guy a enough of a
break to understand that he doesn't know the expanse of his seemingly (to
him) unimportant comments/insults etc.

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Amit Ghosh" wrote in message
floyd called lemond and according to lemond said something along the
lines of "if I confessed i would hurt a lot of my friends", the "soft
confession". that's how floyd dragged lemond into the case.

Why don't you invent even more incendiary conversations?

What about "according to Lemond" do you find so hard to understand? For
a guy who claims to have followed very carefully the Landis case, you
seem remarkably ignorant about many widely-published aspects of the
case. Amit is not making up stuff but merely paraphrasing Greg (now
whether or not we are to believe GL is an altogether different story).

jyh.

"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote in message
...

Tom: I'm sorry, but that just doesn't wash. The most decent people I know
grew up in what you'd dersively call a "hick" environment. People who feel
the value of a man's word is more important than the profit that could be
gained by lying.

I am certainly not disagreeing with you. What I'm suggesting is that Landis
was and still probably is going through a metamorphosis from his past
religion to "modern American male" before he realizes that there was more
value in what he was. I've seen people like him act the same way for the
same reasons before growing up.

I find it very offensive that you would trash people who value their
beliefs above material things as being lesser, and that it's something
they really ought to outgrow.

That "I" would trash people? LeMond stuck his nose in where it most
certainly didn't belong. I happen to like Greg but he's had a lot of
problems of his own and one of those apparently is a need to be in the
spotlight. That's what's caused most of his problems and I'm sure you
realize that.

By the way, I don't see any of these things as very important or insulting
or any of that. It's a child's argument amoung those involved that's built
up to something far larger by reporting.

If you've painted yourself into a corner and are trying to find a way out,
jump. Jump over the rhetoric and into the light. Recognize that those with
a background like Floyd would expect to be held to a HIGHER, not lower
standard, than the rest of us.

Most assuredly but if I read Floyd correctly he has been trying to live DOWN
to the rest of us. Or at least to the standard he thinks is ours.

Greg Lemond has proposed the use of one way radios. Or radios that can
be only used to transmit info to the riders.

Personally I am in favor of limiting radio communication for support
request and or water. No coaching and or advice would be permitted.
The problem is that this would be very difficult to monitor. But if
all riders and coaches used a common channel, Then this would be sort
of self-regulating.

On Mar 14, 12:53 am, wrote:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?...r08/mar13news2

"
Director of the Tour de France, Christian Prudhomme, is considering
the idea of banning race radios in the 2008 Tour de France. The
Frenchman might prohibit the use of the devices that allow for rider-
director sportif communication in the mountains stages.

He said to Belgium's Het Nieuwsblad that he is studying "the idea of
banning the race radio in some of the stages of the Tour, maybe in the
mountains [stages]."
"

Why ban them in the mountain stages when it doesn't make a difference?
Doesn't it make more sense to ban them in the flatter stages so the
break
isn't caught in the final kilometer?

(Yes, but a big bunch sprint is more entertaining so let's hope they
don't
figure this one out.)

On Mar 16, 9:35*pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky"
wrote:
As I pointed out, you're not some 30 year old who grew up out on a farm
with a religion that didn't allow you to use most modern inventions. Floyd
not only grew up out there but attended those schools that stressed
religion at the cost of everything else. Floyd is just learning behavior
you already knew before your 21st birthday. Give the guy a enough of a
break to understand that he doesn't know the expanse of his seemingly (to
him) unimportant comments/insults etc.

Tom: I'm sorry, but that just doesn't wash. The most decent people I know
grew up in what you'd dersively call a "hick" environment. People who feel
the value of a man's word is more important than the profit that could be
gained by lying.

I find it very offensive that you would trash people who value their beliefs
above material things as being lesser, and that it's something they really
ought to outgrow.

If you've painted yourself into a corner and are trying to find a way out,
jump. Jump over the rhetoric and into the light. Recognize that those with a
background like Floyd would expect to be held to a HIGHER, not lower
standard, than the rest of us. And remember this- there is at least one
member of this newsgroup who is VERY proud of his family background in
farming. People who work with their hands, in the fields, whose livelihood
depends upon getting up before the sun comes up and praying that rain comes
when it's supposed to, and that, when they DO have a good crop, there are
eager buyers.

Yes, that's right, you can talk all you want about farm subsidies and such,
but the truth is that farmers go broke all the time because, at the time
they plant their crops, they don't have a good idea what that crop will
fetch when harvested. Imagine yourself going to work and not knowing what
you'll get paid until the end of the year.

It takes a special kind of person to do that. And it takes a special kind of
"city" person to belittle them.

Basic human decency is a fundamental part of the people you choose to make
fun of. And by the way, I don't share Floyd's religious background. But I
respect it. And I know its values. I wish that I could come close to living
up to the code of values such people do.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


Hey Mike, we talking you or me? I thought I was the resident,
****kicker, populist, militant?
And yeah, the farm went broke despite milk price supports,
etc...Being resilient, the cows and all that equip got sold off, and
they are making it go in the market garden/produce biz.
90% of the day to day, local, business is done on a handshake
agreement with no hassles involved and frequently with the caveat
"we'll work it out eventually". It's usually pretty tough to figure
out who owes who what, since just about everyone claims to owe more
than they are owed. It's also why if you need just about anything you
can walk up and "borrow" it and pay it back whenever you can.
I'd much rather deal with htose kind of folks than the ones who bring
a lawyer to the coffee shop in the morning.
Bill C
Little-More Farm Hatfield Ma. You'll still find my nephew running it.

In article ,
jean-yves hervé wrote:

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Amit Ghosh" wrote in message
floyd called lemond and according to lemond said something along the
lines of "if I confessed i would hurt a lot of my friends", the "soft
confession". that's how floyd dragged lemond into the case.

Why don't you invent even more incendiary conversations?

What about "according to Lemond" do you find so hard to understand? For
a guy who claims to have followed very carefully the Landis case, you
seem remarkably ignorant about many widely-published aspects of the
case. Amit is not making up stuff but merely paraphrasing Greg (now
whether or not we are to believe GL is an altogether different story).

jyh.

It's pretty hard to disbelieve Greg, most notably since Floyd has never
denied any of this sordid affair, and he fired Geoghean (sp?)

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

In article
],
Ryan Cousineau wrote:

In article ,
jean-yves hervé wrote:

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Amit Ghosh" wrote in message
floyd called lemond and according to lemond said something along the
lines of "if I confessed i would hurt a lot of my friends", the "soft
confession". that's how floyd dragged lemond into the case.

Why don't you invent even more incendiary conversations?

What about "according to Lemond" do you find so hard to understand? For
a guy who claims to have followed very carefully the Landis case, you
seem remarkably ignorant about many widely-published aspects of the
case. Amit is not making up stuff but merely paraphrasing Greg (now
whether or not we are to believe GL is an altogether different story).

jyh.

It's pretty hard to disbelieve Greg, most notably since Floyd has never
denied any of this sordid affair, and he fired Geoghean (sp?)

This was my feeble attempt at trying to prevent Tom from sidetracking
this into a discussion about Lemond's motivations, character, etc.
There is indeed no doubt about the veracity of the "Uncle Ron" phone
call story as Greg told it. On the other hand, the "if I confessed i
would hurt a lot of my friends" story is something that we have heard
only from Greg, with no confirmation from Landis or his entourage. I
happen to believe GL because for all his whining and resentment at being
overshadowed by Armstrong I don't think that he would make up stuff like
that, but I understand that others might distrust his version of the
conversation.

jyh.

"jean-yves hervé" wrote in message
...

This was my feeble attempt at trying to prevent Tom from sidetracking
this into a discussion about Lemond's motivations, character, etc.

Followed by:

I don't think that he would make up stuff like that, but I understand
that others might distrust his version of the conversation.

Any questions?

In article
,
" wrote:

On Mar 14, 12:53 am, wrote:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?...r08/mar13news2

"
Director of the Tour de France, Christian Prudhomme, is considering
the idea of banning race radios in the 2008 Tour de France. The
Frenchman might prohibit the use of the devices that allow for rider-
director sportif communication in the mountains stages.

He said to Belgium's Het Nieuwsblad that he is studying "the idea of
banning the race radio in some of the stages of the Tour, maybe in the
mountains [stages]."
"

Why ban them in the mountain stages when it doesn't make a difference?
Doesn't it make more sense to ban them in the flatter stages so the
break
isn't caught in the final kilometer?

(Yes, but a big bunch sprint is more entertaining so let's hope they
don't
figure this one out.)
Greg Lemond has proposed the use of one way radios. Or radios that can
be only used to transmit info to the riders.

Personally I am in favor of limiting radio communication for support
request and or water. No coaching and or advice would be permitted.
The problem is that this would be very difficult to monitor. But if
all riders and coaches used a common channel, Then this would be sort
of self-regulating.

One word: code.

--
Michael Press

In article ,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"jean-yves hervé" wrote in message
...

This was my feeble attempt at trying to prevent Tom from sidetracking
this into a discussion about Lemond's motivations, character, etc.

Followed by:

I don't think that he would make up stuff like that, but I understand
that others might distrust his version of the conversation.

Any questions?

Yes: (1) What do you think you are accomplishing with this bit of
out-of-context, selective quoting? (2) Do you still believe that
Landis did not think he was doing anything wrong in his dealings with
Lemond, or that he thought he was just doing "what 'em folks who grew up
using phones and stuff usually do"?

jyh.