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Electric bikes.



 
 
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  #21  
Old January 21st 11, 08:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Wes Newell
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Posts: 74
Default Electric bikes.

On Thu, 20 Jan 2011 19:03:01 -0600, Tºm Shermªn™ °_° wrote:

On 1/20/2011 1:19 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Thu, 20 Jan 2011 09:21:47 -0500, dgk wrote:

It will show signs of wear because the components are ****. The chain
and cassette will start to go and it won't pay to bother fixing them
because it will cost more than the whole bike did. I repeat, you get
what you pay for. You paid for crap.


Funny, because the same crap components are on bikes that cost 3 times
as much. As for cost to replace the *freewheel* and chain, well less
than $20. I don't know who you are trying to convince, unless it's
yourself. It's just a bike. There's absolutely no reasonable reason to
spend more than $200 for one. Actually, the $100 bike will probably
last as long.


Unless you want something that is more comfortable, durable, reliable,
and enjoyable to ride.


Comfortability can be achieved with a $25 seat and adjustable handlebars.
After going through about 5 of the so called comfort seats I finally got
one that really was. A Worksman 6911V. I also went through 4 or 5 bikes
before I found the right one. The 2 most important things IMO are the
seat and the tires. Both of which I replaced on all the one I finally
kept.



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  #22  
Old January 21st 11, 09:11 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°[_2_]
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Posts: 1,270
Default Electric bikes.

On 1/21/2011 1:22 AM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Thu, 20 Jan 2011 19:03:01 -0600, Tºm Shermªn™ °_° wrote:

On 1/20/2011 1:19 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Thu, 20 Jan 2011 09:21:47 -0500, dgk wrote:

It will show signs of wear because the components are ****. The chain
and cassette will start to go and it won't pay to bother fixing them
because it will cost more than the whole bike did. I repeat, you get
what you pay for. You paid for crap.

Funny, because the same crap components are on bikes that cost 3 times
as much. As for cost to replace the *freewheel* and chain, well less
than $20. I don't know who you are trying to convince, unless it's
yourself. It's just a bike. There's absolutely no reasonable reason to
spend more than $200 for one. Actually, the $100 bike will probably
last as long.


Unless you want something that is more comfortable, durable, reliable,
and enjoyable to ride.


Comfortability can be achieved with a $25 seat and adjustable handlebars.
After going through about 5 of the so called comfort seats I finally got
one that really was. A Worksman 6911V. I also went through 4 or 5 bikes
before I found the right one. The 2 most important things IMO are the
seat and the tires. Both of which I replaced on all the one I finally
kept.


I found the right combination of comfort and performance:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157619269124601/.

I expect the rear hub (Phil Wood disc) on SS006 cost more that all of
Wes Newell's X-Mart bikes combined (and will outlast them all, also).

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.
  #23  
Old January 21st 11, 06:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
dgk
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Posts: 827
Default Electric bikes.

On 20 Jan 2011 18:57:44 GMT, Bill Bushnell wrote:

dgk wrote:
On Sun, 16 Jan 2011 18:10:22 -0800, SMS
wrote:
You really want to avoid an eBike where the battery pack is placed over
the rear wheel. It should be in the center of the bike. ..


Poppycock. In theory, the weight would be better placed in the middle,
but I have a Trek with the battery over the rear wheel because Ebikes
are not technically allowed where I live and that makes it much less
obvious that there is a battery on the bike. Since the battery weighs
about 5-7 lbs (my weight fluctuates that much) weight distribution is
not an issue. The Pacific Bikes actually have a stronger battery than
the Treks (10ah to 6.4ah), but the Bionx motor is far more efficient
so the battery weight is low. The Pacific Bikes are 250 watt, the
Treks are 350.


To have the smallest effect on handling, one would ideally mount the battery at
the center of mass of bike+rider. Since that is seldom practical, the next best
location is directly below the center of mass. Battery mounting location becomes
more important with a heavier battery. For small batteries of 5-7 lbs, the
effect of suboptimal placement is small.

Before I got this bike I used to think that there should be some way
to save the energy generated going down a big hill so I could use it
going up the other side. Of course, there's always a light or stop
sign at the bottom of the hill. Well, my bike does exactly what I
wanted..


Unless you descend hills slowly (no faster than, say, 15 mph) or you and your
bike have a high mass to aero drag ratio (e.g. streamliner or aerodynamic
velomobile), you aren't going to get much back from regenerative braking.

http://www.ecospeed.com/regenbraking.pdf


It's an interesting read, but my real-world experience is a bit
different. It isn't just about total energy use and generation. It's
when those things happen. I lose energy to the hub when I don't care
about it because I'm on the flats or have a tailwind. Sometimes I even
throw it into the lowest regen mode during rides like that, because I
have energy to spare at that time - it becomes something like a
spinning cycle.

Bridges are another matter. Going up, I use a fair amount of battery
because, well, that's what I bought the thing for. I don't want to
have to work that hard, I don't like it and my knees don't like it.
I'm just not 30 anymore.

Going down the bridge I often put it into a medium regen mode and
pedal on the way down. I'm not just getting the energy from gliding,
I'm adding my own effort because I don't mind at that point; it isn't
hurting my knees. And yes, I'm not going much over 15 mph. Sometimes,
if I'm running late, I will just fly down the hill like everyone else.

There is, I'm sure, a big savings on brake pads. The pads are almost
never engaged because the motor does most of the stopping. It's hard
to tell because the bike has disk brakes and it's tough to see how
much they're being used.

I did miss one other huge difference between the Pacific Bikes and the
Trek line. I'm pretty sure that PB only uses a throttle system.Trek
has no throttle, although the standard Bionx kit does.Trek only works
in pedal assist mode. If the rider doesn't pedal, the motor does
nothing. Some will likely see that as a negative for the Treks, but I
like it that way. It's still a bike, not a small motorcycle.
  #24  
Old January 29th 11, 03:32 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Daryl Hunt[_2_]
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Posts: 4
Default Electric bikes.

On 1/10/2011 4:37 PM, Fred wrote:
I think I might add an electric bike to my collection of trusty and rusty
two wheelers. . They look like a bit of fun with a practical use. Am
looking at the Trek sprint 7 or the Wisper 905. Anyone know much about these
things? Or any other brands?



One of the things you can do is take a decent Trek and add a kit
to it. You end up with a decent bike at a fraction of the cost.
You can get the kits at:

http://www.i70west.com


  #25  
Old January 29th 11, 03:33 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Daryl Hunt[_2_]
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Posts: 4
Default Electric bikes.

On 1/11/2011 3:03 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Tue, 11 Jan 2011 12:37:15 +1300, Fred wrote:

I think I might add an electric bike to my collection of trusty and
rusty two wheelers. . They look like a bit of fun with a practical use.
Am looking at the Trek sprint 7 or the Wisper 905. Anyone know much
about these things? Or any other brands?


I've been researching this for about a month now and I've found lots of
info, and lots of conversion kits on ebay, but I haven't bit the bullet
yet. I'll probably end up getting a rear wheel hub motor kit, but my real
question is which one to get. 250-1000W? How effective are the smaller
ones? Reviews are hard to find for the ones on ebay.


Careful with the conversion kits on Ebay. Many are just plain
junk but they claim to be name brand. Most of them are old kits
during a time when there was a lot of junk coming in on the boats
from China.


  #26  
Old January 29th 11, 03:35 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Daryl Hunt[_2_]
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Posts: 4
Default Electric bikes.

On 1/11/2011 11:57 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Wed, 12 Jan 2011 12:29:40 +1300, Fred wrote:

How do the kits compare with purpose made bikes? Mounting battery looks
tricky. Like you I haven't found too much info.


Consumer ebikes are expensive and appear to be very limited in both speed
and style. Building your own has lots of advantages. You can choose the
style of bike you want (or already have) and you can get any style/size
motor you want for it. And the cost is a lot less. Most kits come with a
rear rack to mount the batteries in a saddle bag. I'd probably just use a
plastic box to put them in and secure it with bungee cords.

For a hub drive, I'd like to have a dual speed motor. One low speed high
torque and one high speed low torque.

They make a chain drive geared motor that let's you use the bike gears
(rear) also, but it's a little more expensive and requires changing the
chainring to a freewheel style. It's supposed to give better performance
than hub driven of same motor size but looks more difficult to install.


And the geared drive isn't nearly as dependable. The worst of
the lot is the Currie Drive. Pot Aluminum for some of the parts
and it wears out fast.


  #27  
Old January 29th 11, 08:37 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Wes Newell
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Posts: 74
Default Electric bikes.

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 19:35:18 -0700, Daryl Hunt wrote:

On 1/11/2011 11:57 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
They make a chain drive geared motor that let's you use the bike gears
(rear) also, but it's a little more expensive and requires changing the
chainring to a freewheel style. It's supposed to give better
performance than hub driven of same motor size but looks more difficult
to install.


And the geared drive isn't nearly as dependable. The worst of the lot
is the Currie Drive. Pot Aluminum for some of the parts and it wears
out fast.


Curries are cheap and don't use the bikes gears. You can buy a complete
ebike with batteries for $398 (was on sale for $320) at Walmart. I was
thinking more along the line of the Cyclone kits.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/eZip-Trail...cycle/11988713

http://www.cyclone-usa.com/store.php?crn=199
  #28  
Old January 29th 11, 09:41 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Daryl Hunt[_2_]
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Posts: 4
Default Electric bikes.

On 1/29/2011 12:37 AM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 19:35:18 -0700, Daryl Hunt wrote:

On 1/11/2011 11:57 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
They make a chain drive geared motor that let's you use the bike gears
(rear) also, but it's a little more expensive and requires changing the
chainring to a freewheel style. It's supposed to give better
performance than hub driven of same motor size but looks more difficult
to install.


And the geared drive isn't nearly as dependable. The worst of the lot
is the Currie Drive. Pot Aluminum for some of the parts and it wears
out fast.


Curries are cheap and don't use the bikes gears. You can buy a complete
ebike with batteries for $398 (was on sale for $320) at Walmart. I was
thinking more along the line of the Cyclone kits.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/eZip-Trail...cycle/11988713

http://www.cyclone-usa.com/store.php?crn=199


Or you can do something decent to your own ride that you like this.


http://i70west.com/cart/index.php?ma...du cts_id=243

  #29  
Old January 31st 11, 03:36 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
dgk
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Posts: 827
Default Electric bikes.

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 01:41:43 -0700, Daryl Hunt
wrote:

On 1/29/2011 12:37 AM, Wes Newell wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 19:35:18 -0700, Daryl Hunt wrote:

On 1/11/2011 11:57 PM, Wes Newell wrote:
They make a chain drive geared motor that let's you use the bike gears
(rear) also, but it's a little more expensive and requires changing the
chainring to a freewheel style. It's supposed to give better
performance than hub driven of same motor size but looks more difficult
to install.

And the geared drive isn't nearly as dependable. The worst of the lot
is the Currie Drive. Pot Aluminum for some of the parts and it wears
out fast.


Curries are cheap and don't use the bikes gears. You can buy a complete
ebike with batteries for $398 (was on sale for $320) at Walmart. I was
thinking more along the line of the Cyclone kits.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/eZip-Trail...cycle/11988713

http://www.cyclone-usa.com/store.php?crn=199


Or you can do something decent to your own ride that you like this.


http://i70west.com/cart/index.php?ma...du cts_id=243


60 lbs shipping weight! Yikes. 600 watts is a lot for a bike kit and
will never be street legal - those tend to be 20 mph max. Also, it's
front wheel so don't mount anything like this on an aluminum fork.
  #30  
Old February 1st 11, 12:01 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Wes Newell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 74
Default Electric bikes.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2011 09:36:57 -0500, dgk wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 01:41:43 -0700, Daryl Hunt
wrote:

http://i70west.com/cart/index.php?

main_page=product_info&cPath=65_69&products_id=243

60 lbs shipping weight! Yikes. 600 watts is a lot for a bike kit and
will never be street legal - those tend to be 20 mph max. Also, it's
front wheel so don't mount anything like this on an aluminum fork.


Legal depends on where you live. It's 20mph here, but in FL you can do up
to 60MPH if licensed (and nuts). 20 if not. I just ordered a 48v 500w
rear wheel system to try. It's rated at 21.7mph. With my 270lbs, I just
hope it will do close to 20. I just bought it to tinker so got the
cheapest I could find ($227.90 shipped, w/o batteries) that had decent
reviews. I've got 4 older 7-9 ah ups batteries I'll start with. With some
pedaling, hope to get 5 miles out of it.
 




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