Not much needed in a "Be Seen" light

On 10/16/2014 1:39 AM, jbeattie wrote:
With that said, our vehicle code is fairly standard UVC.
It includes bicycles in the definition of "vehicle" and also states
that bikes are subject to all the rules applicable to motorists
(more or less -- except where the rules cannot apply by their own
terms.) I haven't combed through the code to see if there is a
special exception for flashers on bikes -- but they are
clearly prohibited on cars.

And even if theoretically prohibited on bikes, low-power flashers would
not be practically prohibited. IOW, the only possibility of a ticket
would be if a cop wanted to stop you for some other reason.

I'm sure there have been books written about the differences between the
laws as written, the actual practices of the public, and the actions of
the police when the two are almost totally out of sync. But we know
that practically speaking, it is legal to drive at 4 mph over the speed
limit; that one actually can drink a beer in a state park; that your
bicycle doesn't really need a bell, etc.

The complications for bicycling come when the "everybody does it"
behavior significantly affects traffic interactions. The resort town we
recently stayed in had constant bicycle traffic, with none of the riders
even looking for cross traffic (let alone slowing) for 4-way stop signs.

I think if I had done a complete stop, I'd have been rammed from behind.
Heck, I might have been ticketed for obstructing traffic.

But I worried a bit: What if this next motorist just arrived for a
visit, and actually expects my bike to stop?

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 10/16/2014 7:06 AM, Duane wrote:

BTW, after last Saturday when I was on my bicycle all day managing
traffic for a large event, I can conclusively state that eating fried
rice from a plate, while riding a bicycle, is not a good idea.


I think there should be a law.

I wanted a panel truck to ride beside me, holding my food and dealing
with low branches.

On 10/16/2014 12:36 PM, sms wrote:
On 10/16/2014 7:06 AM, Duane wrote:

BTW, after last Saturday when I was on my bicycle all day managing
traffic for a large event, I can conclusively state that eating fried
rice from a plate, while riding a bicycle, is not a good idea.


I think there should be a law.

I wanted a panel truck to ride beside me, holding my food and dealing
with low branches.

This is the only place I've encountered cyclists with a phobia about low
branches!

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 10/16/2014 12:36 PM, sms wrote:
On 10/16/2014 7:06 AM, Duane wrote:

BTW, after last Saturday when I was on my bicycle all day managing
traffic for a large event, I can conclusively state that eating fried
rice from a plate, while riding a bicycle, is not a good idea.


I think there should be a law.

I wanted a panel truck to ride beside me, holding my food and dealing
with low branches.



Wouldn't be legal here. Bikes have to be to the right. So you would
have been dealing with the low branches for the panel truck and not vice
versa. Who knows, maybe it would have been worth a free plate of fried
rice.

On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 18:24:18 -0700 (PDT), in rec.bicycles.tech Sir
Ridesalot wrote:

Maybe a bicycle doesn't need those items in California but the law in Ontario, Canada says you have to have them.

What the OP is saying is that the motor vehicle code does not apply to
bicycles; I'd guess that they don't in Ontario, either, but it would
only be a guess. There are other sets of laws that *do* apply to
bicycles.

Jones

On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 11:41:36 -0700 (PDT), in rec.bicycles.tech Sir
Ridesalot wrote:

just for fun I removed the solar charger from a malfunctioning lawn light that looks like one of
those old round Union headlights. I hard wired this light to a 4.8 volts battery and looked to
see what it was like. The three LEDs at the bottom of the three inches diam reflector make
a very good be seen light but they because of the reflector design throw a very small amount
of light to the surface of the road. It'd be useless for just about any trail riding even with a full moon.
I repeated the experiment the next night but with a 7.2 volts battery. The amount of light on the
road or trail didn't seem to be much more and the light was still useless for trail riding at anything
much over walking speed. This experiment seems to prove that nearly any light can work as a
be seen light even though it'd ber useless for seeing anything.

Cheers

I have always felt about vehicles (including bicycles) with bright
lights for the operator to see in the same way I feel about people who
crank up their sound systems until the car shakes and interrupts
conversation blocks away so that the driver can hear the music.
Nights are *supposed* to be dark... light is pollution in the same way
loud music, air horns, and burning tires are. Sensible people will
reduce their speed at night... what's so bad about walking, anyway?

You can see just fine when you must with a couple of "AA" cells and an
LED. Turn *that* off and allow your eyes time to adjust and you'll be
amazed! There's a whole world out there at night... until some clown
with a lipo rig rides by, anyway.

In an urban setting, if I ride at night, I wear reflective clothing.
If I'm camping, I wouldn't ride a trail at night... where do you have
to go that can't wait until morning?

Jones

On Thursday, October 16, 2014 2:02:04 PM UTC-4, �Jones wrote:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 11:41:36 -0700 (PDT), in rec.bicycles.tech Sir

Ridesalot wrote:



just for fun I removed the solar charger from a malfunctioning lawn light that looks like one of

those old round Union headlights. I hard wired this light to a 4.8 volts battery and looked to

see what it was like. The three LEDs at the bottom of the three inches diam reflector make

a very good be seen light but they because of the reflector design throw a very small amount

of light to the surface of the road. It'd be useless for just about any trail riding even with a full moon.

I repeated the experiment the next night but with a 7.2 volts battery. The amount of light on the

road or trail didn't seem to be much more and the light was still useless for trail riding at anything

much over walking speed. This experiment seems to prove that nearly any light can work as a

be seen light even though it'd ber useless for seeing anything.



Cheers



I have always felt about vehicles (including bicycles) with bright

lights for the operator to see in the same way I feel about people who

crank up their sound systems until the car shakes and interrupts

conversation blocks away so that the driver can hear the music.

Nights are *supposed* to be dark... light is pollution in the same way

loud music, air horns, and burning tires are. Sensible people will

reduce their speed at night... what's so bad about walking, anyway?



You can see just fine when you must with a couple of "AA" cells and an

LED. Turn *that* off and allow your eyes time to adjust and you'll be

amazed! There's a whole world out there at night... until some clown

with a lipo rig rides by, anyway.



In an urban setting, if I ride at night, I wear reflective clothing.

If I'm camping, I wouldn't ride a trail at night... where do you have

to go that can't wait until morning?



Jones

My night commute is 20+ kilometers. I ride it at about 20 kph and it takes me just over an hour to do that ride. If i walk it I'd be looking at close to 5 hours for the same distance.

I've gone touring and have had times when I had to ride at night. Small flashlights just don't cut it if you need to ride any real distance at night especially on black moonless nights where there are no streetlights.

It's very nice to be able to see the obstruction, pothole or large critter before you hit them.

Cheers

On 10/16/2014 2:36 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Thursday, October 16, 2014 2:02:04 PM UTC-4, �Jones wrote:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 11:41:36 -0700 (PDT), in rec.bicycles.tech Sir

Ridesalot wrote:



just for fun I removed the solar charger from a malfunctioning lawn light that looks like one of

those old round Union headlights. I hard wired this light to a 4.8 volts battery and looked to

see what it was like. The three LEDs at the bottom of the three inches diam reflector make

a very good be seen light but they because of the reflector design throw a very small amount

of light to the surface of the road. It'd be useless for just about any trail riding even with a full moon.

I repeated the experiment the next night but with a 7.2 volts battery. The amount of light on the

road or trail didn't seem to be much more and the light was still useless for trail riding at anything

much over walking speed. This experiment seems to prove that nearly any light can work as a

be seen light even though it'd ber useless for seeing anything.



Cheers



I have always felt about vehicles (including bicycles) with bright

lights for the operator to see in the same way I feel about people who

crank up their sound systems until the car shakes and interrupts

conversation blocks away so that the driver can hear the music.

Nights are *supposed* to be dark... light is pollution in the same way

loud music, air horns, and burning tires are. Sensible people will

reduce their speed at night... what's so bad about walking, anyway?



You can see just fine when you must with a couple of "AA" cells and an

LED. Turn *that* off and allow your eyes time to adjust and you'll be

amazed! There's a whole world out there at night... until some clown

with a lipo rig rides by, anyway.



In an urban setting, if I ride at night, I wear reflective clothing.

If I'm camping, I wouldn't ride a trail at night... where do you have

to go that can't wait until morning?



Jones

My night commute is 20+ kilometers. I ride it at about 20 kph and it takes me just over an hour to do that ride. If i walk it I'd be looking at close to 5 hours for the same distance.

I've gone touring and have had times when I had to ride at night. Small flashlights just don't cut it if you need to ride any real distance at night especially on black moonless nights where there are no streetlights.

It's very nice to be able to see the obstruction, pothole or large critter before you hit them.

Agreed. As I've said, I converted permanently to dynamo lights when I
was on a solo bike tour and got delayed before reaching my destination.
But it's quite common for me to ride at night, and it's dangerous and
irresponsible to ride without lights.

Having said that, I strongly agree about light pollution, too. The book
_The End of Night_ deals with it in detail. It's sad that we have
entire generations of Americans who have never seen the Milky Way, and
who can't hope to see it without driving great distances!

But it's not necessary to ruin the night in order to have good lights on
your bike. We have the technology.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 10/16/2014 2:36 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Thursday, October 16, 2014 2:02:04 PM UTC-4, �Jones wrote:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 11:41:36 -0700 (PDT), in rec.bicycles.tech Sir

Ridesalot wrote:



just for fun I removed the solar charger from a malfunctioning lawn light that looks like one of

those old round Union headlights. I hard wired this light to a 4.8 volts battery and looked to

see what it was like. The three LEDs at the bottom of the three inches diam reflector make

a very good be seen light but they because of the reflector design throw a very small amount

of light to the surface of the road. It'd be useless for just about any trail riding even with a full moon.

I repeated the experiment the next night but with a 7.2 volts battery. The amount of light on the

road or trail didn't seem to be much more and the light was still useless for trail riding at anything

much over walking speed. This experiment seems to prove that nearly any light can work as a

be seen light even though it'd ber useless for seeing anything.



Cheers



I have always felt about vehicles (including bicycles) with bright

lights for the operator to see in the same way I feel about people who

crank up their sound systems until the car shakes and interrupts

conversation blocks away so that the driver can hear the music.

Nights are *supposed* to be dark... light is pollution in the same way

loud music, air horns, and burning tires are. Sensible people will

reduce their speed at night... what's so bad about walking, anyway?



You can see just fine when you must with a couple of "AA" cells and an

LED. Turn *that* off and allow your eyes time to adjust and you'll be

amazed! There's a whole world out there at night... until some clown

with a lipo rig rides by, anyway.



In an urban setting, if I ride at night, I wear reflective clothing.

If I'm camping, I wouldn't ride a trail at night... where do you have

to go that can't wait until morning?



Jones

My night commute is 20+ kilometers. I ride it at about 20 kph and it takes me just over an hour to do that ride. If i walk it I'd be looking at close to 5 hours for the same distance.

I've gone touring and have had times when I had to ride at night. Small flashlights just don't cut it if you need to ride any real distance at night especially on black moonless nights where there are no streetlights.

It's very nice to be able to see the obstruction, pothole or large critter before you hit them.

We spend too much time on this board with one guy telling another guy
that the first guy doesn't need what the second guy wants. lol

On 10/16/2014 12:32 PM, Duane wrote:

snip

We spend too much time on this board with one guy telling another guy
that the first guy doesn't need what the second guy wants. lol

"If I don't have a need for a particular piece of equipment then no one
else does either because the world revolves around me. If someone else
lives somewhere with different terrain, weather, demographics, driver
psyche, tree type, road quality, infrastructure, or street lighting then
they need to move to where I am and do everything just like I do. Period."