Why is Shimano so hated by some?

On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 12:35:22 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:
(Richard Chan) writes:
Tim McNamara wrote in message
... $400 bikes nowadays work better than $750 bikes of 20 years ago,
in terms of shifting and such...

Make it ANY price and it would be correct.

20 years ago, $750 was pretty close to the top of the line.

Hrmph. I guess that's what technology has done for us; it allows us
to spend as much money as we possibly can.
--
Rick "I love my STI and will never go back" Onanian

On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 18:57:56 +0000, Zog The Undeniable
wrote:
Jokke wrote:
Where is Linux? I would like to see some free bike products ;-)

The bike would be free, but you'd have to assemble it yourself, some
parts would only be available mail-order and you'd never be able to work
out how to change gear, let alone which way the pedals went round ;-)

I'd probably enjoy that even more than I enjoy riding.
--
Rick "Overactive brain, or underactive body?" Onanian

In article , Tim McNamara
wrote:

David writes:

Yes, STIs are not serviceable, but then many old digital cameras and
old computers out there are not economically serviceable either.

Any computer out of warranty is not economically serviceable, unless
you have the skills to fix it yourself. The cheapest way to replace
a hard drive is to buy it inside a new computer.

Sad but true.. My old laptop's hard drive is starting to die.. I see
that I can get a used laptop (faster than what I have) with a larger
hard drive than I have now for the price of a new HD+repair charges.


eBay here I come!!

(mikemcdermid) writes:

WELL IVE NEVER READ SUCH A LOAD OF **** IN ALL MY LIFE

You mean the functionally illiterate one you just dropped into this
thread?

1) Shimano abuse their position as market leader to displace other
options from the marketplace, particularly the market for new complete
bikes.

IN Buisness this is what happens its not a share and share alike
world otherwise ther would be no variety shimano has made themselves
a market leader through good buisness ideology if you dont like it
get out of the rat race you cannot dispute what they have done

There's a difference between successful competition for market share,
and monopolistic practices. Both are common, but that latter must be
stopped because monopolistic practices are bad for the consumer and
for the economy.

2) Shimano make lots of weak, breakage-prone, quick-wearing, and
non-serviceable parts for the lowest possible cost, then proceed to
charge just as much as the market will bear.

3) Shimano make equipment to serve the most easily accomodated 80%
of users, while ignoring the rest.

again read point one the 20% that are left no one cares about anyway
it aint going to contribute largely to that companies sucess they
focus on the thing which is important money

Oh, dear. Not only are you apparently unable to operate the language
or the keyboard properly, you are a bigot, an elitist and an
imbecile. 20% of a large market is well worth being concerned about,
from a business perspective.

Frankly, now, Shimano does a better job of addressing specific market
niches than any of their competitors. I would disagree with the
poster you quoted (without attribution) that Shimano ignores 20% of
the market. If there was a 20% slice of the market left, Shimano
would address those peoples' needs aggressively as a matter of good
business practice.

now lets think what shimano has brought us hollow cranks the last time
i saw a set of alluminium hollow cranks they were nearly $ 700 dollars
a pair and not half as tough as the shimano current models in facyt
the $700 dollar cranks i think they recalled half of em

shimano is on the cutting edge of manufacturing bike parts could
almost be considered a sideline if you saw what they do as far as
robotics is concerned

What are you talking about? Or do you even know what you're talking
about? Between the word salad, non sequitors, lack of capitalization
and lack of punctuation, you make no sense even if you might have a
point you're trying to make.

you think the japs are **** well so do i but i know one thing when
it comes to manufacturing engineering they have a pretty good handle
on it

And the japanese are "****" in what way, ****wit?

shimano have made component that last their service life if thats
racing that can be one race if its touring then that can mean three
months everything has its limits id hate to see a formula one race
team that complained about this kind of thing they would save on cost
buy the cheapest and come last

ROTFL! "Components that last their service life!"

In article ,
says...
On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 12:55:17 -0500, David Kerber
wrote:
says...
What they do do when they finally get it into gear (pun intended) is take
other people's ideas and refine them to a very high degree.

You've just described Microsoft, too!

No, MS doesn't copy ideas, they just buy the company. They also
don't refine the product so much as they bloat it.

Where do you think they got the idea for Windows, with mice as input
devices? As far as I know, they never bought Xerox!

--
Rick Onanian


--
Dave Kerber
Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.

Rick Onanian writes:

On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 10:13:26 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:
Any computer out of warranty is not economically serviceable, unless
you have the skills to fix it yourself. The cheapest way to replace
a hard drive is to buy it inside a new computer.

Or take it to an LCS, or call a geek. With the prices of hard
drives, and the loss-leaders available, and the fact that so many
people buy computers that come with a "Recovery CD", it's really
quite economical to call a geek to replace your hard drive.

Pick up a hard drive on sale with a rebate -- spend $60 at most. I
just checked yesterday's newspaper; $60 buys you 120gb of
loss-leader from OfficeMax. Call me, spend another $50, I come and
install it and stick the "Recovery CD" in the drive, read a book
while it runs, and then install your printer and programs. I'm out
of there in an hour. Your cost: $110. More economical (and
cheaper) than replacing the whole computer.

Barely, when the new computer will come with a faster CPU, faster
bus, newer software, bigger hard drive, improved peripheral
interfaces, etc. You might be able to replace the hard drive for a
marginally smaller dollar figure, but you might very well get much
better value out of just buying a new computer (note that this is in
the Wintel world, Apples are usually more worthy of repair because
of the premium cost of the things in the first place- and IMHO worth
it as I've happily used 3 Apple computers in 17 years and have no
plans to replace the current one, a Rev B iMac).

Rick Onanian writes:

On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 12:35:22 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:
(Richard Chan) writes:
Tim McNamara wrote in message

... $400 bikes nowadays work better than $750 bikes of 20 years
ago, in terms of shifting and such...

Make it ANY price and it would be correct.

20 years ago, $750 was pretty close to the top of the line.

Hrmph. I guess that's what technology has done for us; it allows us
to spend as much money as we possibly can.

ROTFL! You have nailed that exactly!

Where do you think they got the idea for Windows, with mice as input
devices? As far as I know, they never bought Xerox!

i thought ms only got their windows s/w to work after help from the
"athena project" [x windows] folks at m.i.t?

(Evan Evans) wrote:

(Chalo) wrote:

2) Shimano make lots of weak, breakage-prone, quick-wearing, and
non-serviceable parts for the lowest possible cost, then proceed to
charge just as much as the market will bear.

Is Dura-Ace weak & brakeage prone?

Oh yes. Google this group for [dura ace bb] or [dura ace sti
brifters] if you doubt it.

Having lost my favorite teeth to a Deore XT bottom bracket back when
that was "the best/strongest available", I have forsaken all Shimano
parts when there is any alternative available at all.

I'll ride a wheelchair before I'll ride a Shimano crank or bottom
bracket.

Chalo Colina

In article ,
says...
Where do you think they got the idea for Windows, with mice as input
devices? As far as I know, they never bought Xerox!

i thought ms only got their windows s/w to work after help from the
"athena project" [x windows] folks at m.i.t?

I don't know about getting it to actually work, but from what I read
somewhere, they got the original idea from a demo at Xerox PARC.


--
Dave Kerber
Fight spam: remove the ns_ from the return address before replying!

REAL programmers write self-modifying code.