Chinese Carbon Wheelset

On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 6:58:56 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 7:36 am, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never even SEEN "carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.



Because you complained about a CF seat post slipping. You wrote:

"In one point it again made that noise and it appears that it was the
seat post moving. Think that I'll throw away that Campy Carbon seatpost
and install an aluminum one."


--
JS

Let me get this straight - you suggest putting an abrasive in the seat tube?

Joy, though it my bother you, you will always stand out from the crowd.

On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 8:48:27 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/24/2019 9:58 PM, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 7:36 am, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never even SEEN
"carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.



Because you complained about a CF seat post slipping.Â* You wrote:

"In one point it again made that noise and it appears that it was the
seat post moving. Think that I'll throw away that Campy Carbon seatpost
and install an aluminum one."

So Tom is a case in point. He's got to be more mechanically competent
than most recreational cyclists. He's got decades of experience. But
even he doesn't know that carbon paste is recommended for many part
interfaces.

I think there must be tens of thousands of newbies who will know less
than that, and will over-torque or otherwise damage lightweight CF
parts, especially as CF gets less expensive and more common.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Rather than telling us another of your stories why don't you show us a factory recommendation for putting an abrasive material in between two surfaces..

On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 2:26:55 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 11:16:36 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:39:01 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 11:36:31 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never even SEEN "carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.

Really? Google it, it has been around for ages.

Lou

Toothpaste has been around for ages as well and I sure as hell ain't putting it on my bike.

From someone who has a slipping seat post and an awful track record in breaking things I would expect a smarter reply.

Lou

So you don't own any of this stuff yourself but you know all about it?

On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 2:47:10 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 8:48:27 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/24/2019 9:58 PM, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 7:36 am, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never even SEEN
"carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.



Because you complained about a CF seat post slipping.Â* You wrote:

"In one point it again made that noise and it appears that it was the
seat post moving. Think that I'll throw away that Campy Carbon seatpost
and install an aluminum one."

So Tom is a case in point. He's got to be more mechanically competent
than most recreational cyclists. He's got decades of experience. But
even he doesn't know that carbon paste is recommended for many part
interfaces.

I think there must be tens of thousands of newbies who will know less
than that, and will over-torque or otherwise damage lightweight CF
parts, especially as CF gets less expensive and more common.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Rather than telling us another of your stories why don't you show us a factory recommendation for putting an abrasive material in between two surfaces.

https://lynskeyperformance.com/faq/

Q: What Grease is recommended to use with the frame during the build-up?

A:

Bottom Bracket Threads - Finish Line Copper Based Anti-Seize
Headset Cups - Finish Line Copper Based Anti-Seize (Tiny Bit)
Seatposts - Carbon Fiber Seatpost: Finish Line Carbon Fiber Grip Paste - Aluminum & Titanium Seatposts use no grease. Regardless of seatpost material and grease applied, we suggest pulling the seatpost out to clean it every 3 months to ensure you never have a seized seatpost issue.

I could locate more, but you're retired and can do it yourself.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 8/25/2019 5:34 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 6:58:56 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 7:36 am, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never even SEEN "carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.



Because you complained about a CF seat post slipping. You wrote:

"In one point it again made that noise and it appears that it was the
seat post moving. Think that I'll throw away that Campy Carbon seatpost
and install an aluminum one."


--
JS

Let me get this straight - you suggest putting an abrasive in the seat tube?

To Lou, Duane and Jay:

See?

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 8/25/2019 2:39 PM, wrote:


So instead of your constant bitching and whining about lightweight CF components what do you suggest?
- you can only buy CF components/bike if you can show a certificate that you are qualified to use and maintain them correctly?,
- ban all lightweight CF frames/components for all people except Pro riders?,
- weight limit of 2 kg for a frameset?,
- you can only buy lightweight CF components if you can ride an average of 40 km/hr on flat terrain for at least two hours?
- a buyer of a CF bike has to read the f*cking manual aloud in the store first?

What I'd suggest is that the industry and the cycling community stop
pretending that every gram is critical, that every rider needs what's
being raced in Le Tour, that every new gizmo or fashion is an
unqualified improvement, that every rider who doesn't ride a bike like
Lou's is a stodgy "Fred" who deserves to be mocked.

I think there are bigger problems in the world.

Of course there are bigger problems in the world! This is not a
discussion group about the world's biggest problems. This is a
discussion group about bicycling.

Like it or not, we are not required to discuss only the world's biggest
problems. We are not required to discuss only topics of which you
approve. And we are not required to adopt only viewpoints you approve.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 8/25/2019 5:45 PM, jbeattie wrote:


FWIW, my Emonda came with a torque wrench. https://www.sefiles.net/images/libra...5-195713-1.jpg And a manual.

I do think every bike with torque-critical components should come with a
torque wrench. That would be a practical and helpful sign to a new owner
that more care is needed, and would add almost nothing to the cost of
the bike.

Very, very few people even know what a torque wrench is. Even fewer own
torque wrenches.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 8/25/2019 6:08 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 8/25/2019 5:34 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 6:58:56 PM UTC-7, James
wrote:
On 25/8/19 7:36 am, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Saturday, August 24, 2019 at 2:18:05 PM UTC-7, James
wrote:
On 25/8/19 5:18 am, Tom Kunich wrote:


I have never used "carbon paste" for anything and
can't imagine why.


Imagine harder.

--
JS

Why? I have had CF frames for a long time. I've never
even SEEN "carbon paste" let alone used it for anything.



Because you complained about a CF seat post slipping.
You wrote:

"In one point it again made that noise and it appears
that it was the
seat post moving. Think that I'll throw away that Campy
Carbon seatpost
and install an aluminum one."


--
JS

Let me get this straight - you suggest putting an abrasive
in the seat tube?

To Lou, Duane and Jay:

See?


It's an actual product, from many competitive vendors, and
specified by both the frame makers and also the carbon
component makers.

I know most people would rather die than RTFM (and sometimes
do) but geez this is hardly a new concept.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Sunday, August 25, 2019 at 3:57:10 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Exactly!

Lou and Duane will give examples to pretend everyone knows all about
care of super-light equipment. But we also have Tom who says "I don't
need no steenkin' carbon paste," AK who takes his bike to the shop to
adjust the derailleur, Joerg who says a rock and trailside nail are
proper chain repair tools, and more.

O.K., let's look at what I think is one of the best bang-for-the-buck CF bikes with a CF post. A Canyon. $2,3000 -- a smoking deal. https://tinyurl.com/y2qr3twe So, who is going to buy that bike? Someone who stumbles across the website? "Hey, lookey there, a thingamajig made out of fibers. I'm gonna get me one!"

So, then, let's go to a bike shop -- we'll pick one near my work: https://www.bikegallery.com/product/...c-342164-1.htm Sweet! A Domane SL5 on sale for $2,200 which has a CF seat post because the seat post is built into the frame. That bike comes with a wrench. It also comes with the staff at the downtown Bike Gallery who set the saddle height and tell you about the wrench. My Emonda landed there, and I had to go through the process which, for me, was about as informative as learning about the seatbelts on an airliner for the billionth time.

Hey, while we're at it, what's up with "this plane is equipped with two life rafts" -- and then not telling you how to get them down or what to do with them. It's not in the seat-back card. I wonder if those life rafts are really up in the roof at all.

Anyway, back to bikes, people are not dropping $2K and then trying to adjust their carbon seatposts with a crow-bar -- except perhaps in your Ohio village and Cameron Park, Ca. (why the riders also die of thirst and starvation).



It's not just people in my locale who don't know bike mechanics. I've
been in Portland, Oregon and told someone "Your quick release isn't
fastened right. Your wheel could pop out," and showed them how to clamp
it properly.

Did he actually need your help or was he, in typical Portland fashion, just letting you natter-on while he stood there politely. We don't even honk when people sit at lights. I had some guy stop and basically take over fixing a flat. WTF? I was fixing flats before you were born. Go away!


We're Warm Showers hosts,

I wouldn't admit that in public.


and I've fixed multiple problems
for multiple guests who were riding from New York City to Chicago or
further - the latest was last Saturday. When we were riding across
Montana, I saved a guy riding the other way who was stranded on a remote
highway. His (roughly) 20 spoke rear wheel had a broken spoke, and was
so out of true it wouldn't pass through his brakes. He didn't even know
how to open his quick release, although as I recall that didn't give
sufficient clearance either. I loosened his brake cable at the clamp
screw to allow him to make the next town - although I doubt the bike
shop there (which we had visited) carried his very non-standard spokes.
Heck, we were in Amsterdam last year, and the bikes on the streets were
far from models of mechanical perfection.

You should have told the Montana guy to get discs.

I went to meet my neighbor for a ride, and he says, hey, could you try riding my bike, it just isn't shifting well. So I got on his bike (which is way too small), and it had an odd shifting issue that didn't quite feel like new chain/cassette issues. It was subtle and more like a loose freehub body.. So I tell him that, and he goes, O.K., let me check. He pops off the cassettes, checks the body, which isn't loose, but the cones on his Campy hub/wheel are a little loose, so he pulls out his cone wrenches, adjusts the hub, throws the cassettes back on and pops the wheel back in his Pinarello. Shifts like a charm. Took 8 minutes.


This will always be the case. Different people know different things,
which is OK. But I think it's a bad idea to push actually fragile
equipment to people who need rugged reliability a lot more than tiny
improvements in speed.

Grrrrrr. Rugged reliability! You know, I've never seen anyone force a super-light bike on someone, and I've been to a lot of bike shops. My son sold bikes and let people make stupid purchases, but they were usually double suspended fat bikes and other odd-ball bikes. He worked in Specialized and Trek shops, and I don't recall one instance of him forcing an S-Works Tarmac on some unsuspecting old lady or a Madone.

-- Jay Beattie.