Southern Railway "bike ban" survey

Hi

Those of us who use Southern Railway trains probably know that they are going
to implement their ban on bicycles at peak travel times between London and
Brighton on 16th January.

Southern Railway has launched an online survey on this topic which you can
fill in he

http://www.southernrailway.com/survey.php

The ban will operate from 7am to 10pm and 4pm to 7pm.

Folding bicycles will still be okay.

On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 20:36:19 +0000, Brightonian
wrote:
The ban will operate from 7am to 10pm and 4pm to 7pm.

7am to 10am isn't it?

Jim

Brightonian wrote:


Southern Railway has launched an online survey on this topic which you can
fill in he

http://www.southernrailway.com/survey.php

Yes I did; the only comment I could think of adding was that by taking
my bike on the train and and riding back or vice versa I was freeing up
a seat.
I suppose one could suggest that they stop calling at Gatwick if they
really want to increase the available space for commuters (as the SRA's
desire to scrap the dedicated service seems to have gone a bit quiet)

MartinM wrote:
Brightonian wrote:


Southern Railway has launched an online survey on this topic which you can
fill in he

http://www.southernrailway.com/survey.php

Yes I did; the only comment I could think of adding was that by taking
my bike on the train and and riding back or vice versa I was freeing up
a seat.

I just asked what the point was in introducing a ban that the European
Parliament is in the process of making illegal. Better to use the time
coming up to the introduction of the new law to make provisions for
cyclists work.


--
Tony

"The best way I know of to win an argument is to start by being in the
right."
- Lord Hailsham

Tony Raven wrote:

I just asked what the point was in introducing a ban that the European
Parliament is in the process of making illegal. Better to use the time
coming up to the introduction of the new law to make provisions for
cyclists work.

what will the new law stipulate? the current provision is 2 bikes per 4
car unit; on my line this is usually filled by the 4th station on the
line. The only way to increase capacity on the current trains (less
than 2 years old) would be to take out more of the seating bays at the
end of each coach (4 of the 8 bays are currently used by 2 toilet and 2
first class areas)

MartinM wrote:
Tony Raven wrote:

I just asked what the point was in introducing a ban that the European
Parliament is in the process of making illegal. Better to use the time
coming up to the introduction of the new law to make provisions for
cyclists work.

what will the new law stipulate? the current provision is 2 bikes per 4
car unit; on my line this is usually filled by the 4th station on the
line. The only way to increase capacity on the current trains (less
than 2 years old) would be to take out more of the seating bays at the
end of each coach (4 of the 8 bays are currently used by 2 toilet and 2
first class areas)


The new EU law doesn't stipulate how many, it just says they must
transport passengers' bikes. The text is at http://snipurl.com/l6ja.
The most relevant is amendment 32 which says:

"1. By the transport contract the railway undertaking or railway
undertakings shall undertake to transport the passenger as well as hand
luggage and luggage to the place of destination. They shall transport
the bicycle of the passenger in all trains, including transborder and
high speed trains, possibly on payment of a charge. The contract must be
confirmed by one or more tickets issued to the passenger. The tickets
shall be considered prima facie evidence of the conclusion of the
contract. The provisions of Articles 6 and 7 of the CIV shall apply to
transport contracts"

Expected date of introduction is 2010 as I understand it.

--
Tony

"The best way I know of to win an argument is to start by being in the
right."
- Lord Hailsham

MartinM wrote on Saturday 31 December 2005 10:47:

what will the new law stipulate? the current provision is 2 bikes per
4 car unit; on my line this is usually filled by the 4th station on
the line. The only way to increase capacity on the current trains
(less than 2 years old) would be to take out more of the seating bays
at the end of each coach (4 of the 8 bays are currently used by 2
toilet and 2 first class areas)

Of course, if we were really serious about "joined-up transport" we
would be reinstating the railway parcels service and running trains
with goods vans. There would then be plenty of room on trains for
bikes.

I remember during the discussion of the Railway's policy on the weekend
of the London to Brighton ride some mention that trains have been built
without goods capacity and with couplings that are incapable of joining
with goods or parcels vans. Perhaps the designers/specifiers of such an
abortion should face criminal charges? Vandalism on the railway,
perhaps?

--
Regards
Alex
The From address above is a spam-trap.
The Reply-To address is valid

Tony Raven wrote:

They shall transport
the bicycle of the passenger in all trains, including transborder and
high speed trains, possibly on payment of a charge. The contract must be
confirmed by one or more tickets issued to the passenger. The tickets
shall be considered prima facie evidence of the conclusion of the
contract. The provisions of Articles 6 and 7 of the CIV shall apply to
transport contracts"

I think the "charge" bit is likely to scupper that plan; AIUI they
currently cannot charge, although may impose a reservation fee.

Alex Potter wrote:
MartinM wrote on Saturday 31 December 2005 10:47:

what will the new law stipulate? the current provision is 2 bikes per
4 car unit; on my line this is usually filled by the 4th station on
the line. The only way to increase capacity on the current trains
(less than 2 years old) would be to take out more of the seating bays
at the end of each coach (4 of the 8 bays are currently used by 2
toilet and 2 first class areas)

Of course, if we were really serious about "joined-up transport" we
would be reinstating the railway parcels service and running trains
with goods vans. There would then be plenty of room on trains for
bikes.

I remember during the discussion of the Railway's policy on the weekend
of the London to Brighton ride some mention that trains have been built
without goods capacity and with couplings that are incapable of joining
with goods or parcels vans. Perhaps the designers/specifiers of such an
abortion should face criminal charges? Vandalism on the railway,
perhaps?

If this is to do with not being able to couple the class 325 ex Royal
Mail units to the Southern emu's; the main problem for the L2B seemed
to be that the former did not have a safety case to go along that
particular bit of track (hardly a less stupid reason, granted)

Alex Potter wrote:
MartinM wrote on Saturday 31 December 2005 10:47:

what will the new law stipulate? the current provision is 2 bikes per
4 car unit; on my line this is usually filled by the 4th station on
the line. The only way to increase capacity on the current trains
(less than 2 years old) would be to take out more of the seating bays
at the end of each coach (4 of the 8 bays are currently used by 2
toilet and 2 first class areas)

Of course, if we were really serious about "joined-up transport" we
would be reinstating the railway parcels service and running trains
with goods vans. There would then be plenty of room on trains for
bikes.

I remember during the discussion of the Railway's policy on the
weekend of the London to Brighton ride some mention that trains have
been built without goods capacity and with couplings that are
incapable of joining with goods or parcels vans. Perhaps the
designers/specifiers of such an abortion should face criminal
charges? Vandalism on the railway, perhaps?

I think probably that you're being a little naive on the issue of how trains
couple together and what the design criteria are.

That said, it's a shame that a special couldn't have been run to fit the
bikes on, but the fleet of trucks that was used was probably more efficient,
financially and environmentally, even if less aesthetically pleasing.
--
Ambrose