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#101
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
Jasper Janssen wrote: That's nice. Now that you've admitted that your primary motivation for posting is annoying us, I think i wont' be reading any more of your posts. Circulus in probando. Capish? You are the weakest link, goodbye. Jasper Good riddance, I say! |
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#102
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
Gooserider wrote: You want to be comfortable? Here you go: http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/surly....html#complete Interesting -- a $900 bike that seems like the Mongoose cromos in the LBS for $300?? Looks like it uses old cantilever brakes, too! Steel frame, fat tires, relaxed geometry. Fender-able, rack-able. Heavier than your 19 pound Chinese wonder machine, but comfortable enough for you to actually ride the thing. You ride the Surly enough and you'll easily drop the 6 pounds of weight difference. LOL -- but I don't see how you imagine this one more comfortable than the Airborne models. Fat tires make for a naturally comfy ride, do they? And how is the frame geometry more relaxed? Plus, the Surly is a better fit for NYC, unless you think the gossamer wheels on the Airborne are going to handle potholes and curbs well. "Bontrager Select 700c Wheelset, 20/24, 835g/1020g" flimsy?? |
#103
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
Gooserider wrote: Since I would automatically add clipless pedals(maybe a combo clip/platform), a rack, and fenders, it would reach $1200 in no time. However, a fifty dollar upgrade here and there amortized over time would be no big deal. I think I would upgrade the derailleurs and crank(go to Deore or even 105, maybe a Sugino crankset). Other than that, it would be OK for years. That's the thing...what do all these parts mean? If a ti frame isn't inherently/obviously/absolutely better than a cromo/steel/alum one, how are some cranks and pedals and whatnot better than others? There's a reason Surlys are big with messengers. I think the Cross-Check complete bike package is just about the best deal going. But what makes it such a good deal, and vis-a-vis the Airborne offerings?? Plus---it doesn't have a flashy paint job, nor does it scream "TITANIUM PLEASE STEAL ME". Wait, any bike screams that in NYC.... LOL -- I've even had quick-release "wings" stolen from my bike! |
#104
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
araby wrote:
Please don't let on this group if you do otherwise it will generate a thread longer than this one LOL -- no wonder they call y'all the up-wrong crowd! If you do, you can forget the 19lb bike weight. Add another 10 and you are getting close -if you don't mind spending more than your $1200. For the $1250 quoted elsewhere on this thread typically you can get an Easy Racer EZ sport. Fine as far as it goes, but forget high performance and weight (well over 30lb).The same manufacturer makes the Ti Gold Rush. Seems right up your street. Probably the best or as good as any touring recumbent out there. Price a mere $5200. Weight 27lb Check out: http://www.easyracers.com/index.htm and another reputable manufacturer, http://www.ransbikes.com/ -for all their products. Lightning's got this $6K 'bent that's 22 lbs. Not bad! =) For what it's worth, I have been into and out of the recumbent phase. Four years was more than enough My last recumbent was a Rans Vrex. -$1700 and 30lb. Cheers, Roy Out of the 'bent "phase"?? What happened? Sure looks comfy...that's my next bike, a 'bent! |
#105
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
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#106
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
Gooserider wrote: Comfort has about nothing to do with bike weight, NYC. If you want to climb hills, then the bike's gearing needs to be appropriate. A triple crankset with wide enough range in the rear cassette will make climbing easy. That too. But it helps to not be pedaling 30 lbs. and only 19! And of course, the speed -- which, to my way of thinking, also means "comfort," though in a rather more indirect sense, insofar as lighter is faster which means that I go further for the same amount of work.... It's all very abstract, I know, and real-world experiences would mean a mere 2 or 3 percent difference, probably...but I'm figuring that they all add up. ANYWAY NO OFFENSE BUT YOU KNOW THIS THREAD'S BEEN "HIJACKED" BY Y'ALL GOING ON ABOUT ALL KINDS OF ISSUES I DIDN'T BRING UP...don't get me wrong -- the discussion's been very interesting and informative, but ultimately my original question hasn't been answered in a direct way: what do you think of the specs on those two Airborne models? I've heard (and experienced) of more people having hand pain/numbness than any other bike complaint. Why? Because people ride ill-fitting bikes. Hand pains over ass pains? Wow, that's news to me. |
#107
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
Actually, no quite. If I haven't spent any money yet, I haven't paid them -- and a less time-consuming customer would be given priority over a "tire-kicker" like me. Besides, they have a vested interest in moving product. Here, commercial pressures are most likely not a factor. RonSonic wrote: They get paid for it. Ron |
#108
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
"NYC XYZ" wrote in
oups.com: Interesting -- a $900 bike that seems like the Mongoose cromos in the LBS for $300?? Looks like it uses old cantilever brakes, too! I think it was Richard Schwinn who said "If bikes had always been made from Aluminum, Carbon Fiber or Titanium, and they introduced chromoly steel, it would be hailed as a miracle." The cheapo steel bikes that are labelled as "chromoly" are usually a mix of chromoly and high-tensile steel. Back in the day, you may have had chromoly main tubes and High-ten stays, but I've heard of bikes in the last 15 years having only a chromoly head tube, which is the shortest one on the bike. This bike is 100% chromoly, and has an intelligent design for a bombproof, comfortable road bike. Shallow angles and long chainstays give a comfortable ride that can better handle uneven pavement. It has clearance for fenders and wide tires. And cantilever brakes stop great. They're better-suited to a road bike than v-brakes because road levers (except a pricey set of Dia-Compe 287s) don't pull enough cable. Cantilevers are also better suited to this bike than sidepulls because they have great clearance for wide tires and fenders. LOL -- but I don't see how you imagine this one more comfortable than the Airborne models. Fat tires make for a naturally comfy ride, do they? And how is the frame geometry more relaxed? Yes, fat tires do make for a more comfortable ride. As does relaxed frame geometry. 72 degrees vs. 73 degrees on the size 58, which would be about right for a guy who's 5'11". Wheelbase is longer on the Surly, too. It's one thing to not know how such things affect handling and comfort, and to ask to have them explained, but here you're just mocking what anybody who knows this stuff takes for granted. Plus, the Surly is a better fit for NYC, unless you think the gossamer wheels on the Airborne are going to handle potholes and curbs well. "Bontrager Select 700c Wheelset, 20/24, 835g/1020g" flimsy?? 20 and 24 spokes for a rider weighing 230lbs? Yes, flimsy. Mega-flimsy. Those wheels are designed for racing, where whether they last longer than that race day isn't much of a consideration. I'm about your size, and I prefer 36-spoke wheels, because I'd just as soon not have to true them after every ride. I've been giving you the benefit of the doubt, but you're looking more and more trollish to me. |
#109
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
RonSonic wrote: I just want a hooker who's a virgin and can cook. You can certainly have it, depending on the order. We'll all get tired of explaining things long before you know everything. Well, yes, that too...I am grateful for the feedback, but much of it is general and actually kind of side-steps my original question about how the Airborne specs look. It's been a very interesting and informative discussion for me, thank you once again, but my questions haven't been answered directly and exactly as much as other issues relating to fit, LBSes, Chinese Commies, other brands, etc. Like anything else they wear and need maintenance. You seem to put in some pretty serious mileage too. Basically, my bike is my car. I guess I just got to grow out of that kid's mindset of a bike being...well, just a bike! Something you ride hard and beat up on, if you know what I mean. Yeah, that can be rough on parts. I'm not much lighter. Right, so I was wondering if the Airborne parts are good reliable parts...for example, even though I'm a noob when it comes to technical matters even I know that metal pedals will outlast plastic ones. I'd suggest starting from there. What about the Trek would you change or improve? Look at it from a baseline, unless you just want to try something completely different. Could be even lighter! That's why these Airbornes appeal to me so much...the upright Airborne seems like a Trek 7500, but much lighter! I was also hoping the titanium frame was stronger than aluminum. Really isn't all that complicated is it. Shouldn't be painful or uncomfortable though. I think the difference between a bike that fits well and one that doesn't is that you can adapt to the one that fits, the one that doesn't is always gonna hurt. Well I guess it's like describing colors to a congenitally blind man -- I just haven't any idea how it couldn't "hurt" to some degree. For example we talk about "breaking in" a saddle, and when you feel that heavy "chew toy" grade leather then reach down and feel your own ass you gotta wonder just which is the one doing the breaking in. Nonetheless we do get comfortable after some miles. I'd always supposed I'd gotten used to it, is all. Actually, the problem is most semantic and epistemological here...what does "pain" and "comfort" mean here, and can it ever be communicated adequately? Perhaps I've made y'all think of undue pain when in fact I may be describing simple physical inconveniences such as any sport would task of the human body. Ron |
#110
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How Do These Airborne Specs Look?
"NYC XYZ" wrote in message ups.com... Gooserider wrote: Since I would automatically add clipless pedals(maybe a combo clip/platform), a rack, and fenders, it would reach $1200 in no time. However, a fifty dollar upgrade here and there amortized over time would be no big deal. I think I would upgrade the derailleurs and crank(go to Deore or even 105, maybe a Sugino crankset). Other than that, it would be OK for years. That's the thing...what do all these parts mean? If a ti frame isn't inherently/obviously/absolutely better than a cromo/steel/alum one, how are some cranks and pedals and whatnot better than others? It depends on what your qualifications for "better" are.I don't think that frame weight matters for 99% of the population. If you think that a bike that's five pouds lighter makes a difference, you should lose the five pounds off your ass and really fly! Higher end components work better, especially rear deraillerurs. Fenders and a rack are just accessories to make the bike more useful---racks carry stuff and fenders keep grime off your back and face. And of course, clipless pedals are self-explanatory. There's a reason Surlys are big with messengers. I think the Cross-Check complete bike package is just about the best deal going. But what makes it such a good deal, and vis-a-vis the Airborne offerings?? Plus---it doesn't have a flashy paint job, nor does it scream "TITANIUM PLEASE STEAL ME". Wait, any bike screams that in NYC.... LOL -- I've even had quick-release "wings" stolen from my bike! |
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