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Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?



 
 
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  #51  
Old September 15th 17, 07:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 9/15/2017 1:03 PM, Joerg wrote:

On a bicycle one would like a few more features, for example an
uphill-disable that sheds the load unless the bus voltage is or becomes
critically low. Another potential feature could be energy harvesting
downhill by maximizing the power output during those times. 3-axis
sensors could help determining such conditions automatically. Endless
possibilities but, of course, there will come a point where it becomes
"technology looking for a home" and more does not make sense.


I do think the complications you propose would not make sense. The gains
would be too small to justify the expense of the design and manufacturing.

We've reached a stage where a spinning dynamo driving an LED light with
decent optics provides plenty of light for all road cyclists except
perhaps those with very unusual riding conditions. (Of course, they
don't provide enough light for those with unusual levels of paranoia,
but that's a separate matter.) This system is permanently mounted on the
bike, just like the corresponding components on a car. It's ready at the
flick of a switch and it's extremely reliable, requiring not even
tending to batteries. It has almost no downsides except, perhaps, first
cost; and those buying boutique frames, tires, wheels, cranks and
shifters shouldn't complain about cost.

I see no need to complicate such a successful system.

--
- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #52  
Old September 15th 17, 07:43 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 2017-09-15 11:15, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 1:03 PM, Joerg wrote:

On a bicycle one would like a few more features, for example an
uphill-disable that sheds the load unless the bus voltage is or
becomes critically low. Another potential feature could be energy
harvesting downhill by maximizing the power output during those times.
3-axis sensors could help determining such conditions automatically.
Endless possibilities but, of course, there will come a point where it
becomes "technology looking for a home" and more does not make sense.


I do think the complications you propose would not make sense. The gains
would be too small to justify the expense of the design and manufacturing.


MPPT would sure make sense for any real system with on-board battery.
It's not rocket science anymore these days. The other stuff is more candy.


We've reached a stage where a spinning dynamo driving an LED light with
decent optics provides plenty of light for all road cyclists except
perhaps those with very unusual riding conditions. (Of course, they
don't provide enough light for those with unusual levels of paranoia,
but that's a separate matter.)



As I've said before try out some real trail riding. At half brightness I
can comfortably ride at 10mph at night, at full bore of about 1000
lumens 15mph is feasible. For 20mph I'd need more but I don't have to
ride the singletrack that fast at night.


... This system is permanently mounted on the
bike, just like the corresponding components on a car. It's ready at the
flick of a switch and it's extremely reliable, requiring not even
tending to batteries.



How does it keep the lights at full brightness during a long uphill
slog? Like some of these sections:

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/5041564


... It has almost no downsides except, perhaps, first
cost; and those buying boutique frames, tires, wheels, cranks and
shifters shouldn't complain about cost.

I see no need to complicate such a successful system.


Not sure what kind of system you are talking about right now.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #53  
Old September 15th 17, 08:43 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 9/15/2017 2:43 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 11:15, Frank Krygowski wrote:

We've reached a stage where a spinning dynamo driving an LED light with
decent optics provides plenty of light for all road cyclists except
perhaps those with very unusual riding conditions. (Of course, they
don't provide enough light for those with unusual levels of paranoia,
but that's a separate matter.)


As I've said before try out some real trail riding. At half brightness I
can comfortably ride at 10mph at night, at full bore of about 1000
lumens 15mph is feasible. For 20mph I'd need more but I don't have to
ride the singletrack that fast at night.


Do a search for the word "road" in my post above. I'm not claiming gonzo
mountain bikers should switch to hub dynamos - although I have done
forest single track with my utility bike and its hub dyno and B&M light.
I suspect I rode much slower than enthusiastic mountain bikers would
want to ride.


Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* ... This system is permanently mounted on the
bike, just like the corresponding components on a car. It's ready at the
flick of a switch and it's extremely reliable, requiring not even
tending to batteries.



How does it keep the lights at full brightness during a long uphill
slog? Like some of these sections:

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/5041564


The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.

For decades I rode home from work climbing the hill of a river valley.
There was one pitch with 10% grade, and a lot more with about 5% to 6%
grade. I did this with a roller dyno driving a halogen headlamp. I never
experienced a problem.

And as mentioned, that system (plus its tailight, an additional low-tech
blinkie and reflectors) was the setup that got spontaneous compliments
from various motorists. "I could see you from way back there!" etc.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* ... It has almost no downsides except, perhaps, first
cost; and those buying boutique frames, tires, wheels, cranks and
shifters shouldn't complain about cost.

I see no need to complicate such a successful system.


Not sure what kind of system you are talking about right now.


I'm talking about a decent dynamo driving a decent LED headlight with
optics optimized for the road. Oh, and an ordinary taillight plus
reflectors.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #54  
Old September 15th 17, 09:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 2:43 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 11:15, Frank Krygowski wrote:

We've reached a stage where a spinning dynamo driving an LED light with
decent optics provides plenty of light for all road cyclists except
perhaps those with very unusual riding conditions. (Of course, they
don't provide enough light for those with unusual levels of paranoia,
but that's a separate matter.)


As I've said before try out some real trail riding. At half brightness
I can comfortably ride at 10mph at night, at full bore of about 1000
lumens 15mph is feasible. For 20mph I'd need more but I don't have to
ride the singletrack that fast at night.


Do a search for the word "road" in my post above. I'm not claiming gonzo
mountain bikers should switch to hub dynamos - although I have done
forest single track with my utility bike and its hub dyno and B&M light.
I suspect I rode much slower than enthusiastic mountain bikers would
want to ride.


In many areas of the country such as where I live there is often no
choice. Even on my road bike I have to travel partly along trails. One
of the many reasons why both bikes have the same light, except the raod
bike sarries twice the battery capacity.


... This system is permanently mounted on the
bike, just like the corresponding components on a car. It's ready at the
flick of a switch and it's extremely reliable, requiring not even
tending to batteries.



How does it keep the lights at full brightness during a long uphill
slog? Like some of these sections:

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/5041564


The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


For decades I rode home from work climbing the hill of a river valley.
There was one pitch with 10% grade, and a lot more with about 5% to 6%
grade. I did this with a roller dyno driving a halogen headlamp. I never
experienced a problem.

And as mentioned, that system (plus its tailight, an additional low-tech
blinkie and reflectors) was the setup that got spontaneous compliments
from various motorists. "I could see you from way back there!" etc.


That wasn't my impression when I was in Germany lately, after they
switched to "better" lights.


... It has almost no downsides except, perhaps, first
cost; and those buying boutique frames, tires, wheels, cranks and
shifters shouldn't complain about cost.

I see no need to complicate such a successful system.


Not sure what kind of system you are talking about right now.


I'm talking about a decent dynamo driving a decent LED headlight with
optics optimized for the road. Oh, and an ordinary taillight plus
reflectors.


To me that "system" is incomplete without a battery.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #55  
Old September 15th 17, 11:55 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 9/15/2017 4:01 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:

The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


Yeah, yeah - "Danger! Danger!"

If I'm climbing a steep hill riding on the right side of the road, and a
redneck is soused enough to cross all the way over to hit me head on, I
don't think extra lumens from my headlamp are going to make much
difference. That sort of guy would be as likely to hit head-on another
guy driving a pickup.

Also: How often does that fantasy disaster happen anyway? Perhaps once
in 500 million miles of riding? Just because you can imagine something,
Joerg, it doesn't mean it's likely to happen.

As I and others have said here, cyclists seem to get more clearance and
care from motorists in the daytime than at night. There have been
countless times that motorists either waited to turn left across my
path, or waited to pull out from stop signs, when I was at least half a
block away. They could have made their move five times, but they waited
for me until I passed.

Also, as I've reported, I clearly recall the night I was driving and saw
our city's most dedicated utility cyclist when he was about at least a
block away, coming toward me at night on a fairly busy city street. His
headlight at the time? A Cateye halogen light powered by two C cells. It
was probably half as bright as the dynamo light I was using at the time.

I'm talking about a decent dynamo driving a decent LED headlight with
optics optimized for the road. Oh, and an ordinary taillight plus
reflectors.


To me that "system" is incomplete without a battery.


But everyone else should realize that to you, a bike is incomplete if it
doesn't have motorcycle-grade tires, chain and brakes, plus the ability
to carry a full keg of beer. Your requirements are rather unusual.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #56  
Old September 16th 17, 12:15 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 2017-09-15 15:55, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 4:01 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:

The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


Yeah, yeah - "Danger! Danger!"


One of them just killed another cyclist here, from behind. This time it
was an off-duty police office one the bike who died. Now you can stick
you head back into the sand and pretend it doesn't happen.


If I'm climbing a steep hill riding on the right side of the road, and a
redneck is soused enough to cross all the way over to hit me head on, I
don't think extra lumens from my headlamp are going to make much
difference. That sort of guy would be as likely to hit head-on another
guy driving a pickup.


Most come from behind. That is why I have very bright rear lights as
well, and multiple ones.


Also: How often does that fantasy disaster happen anyway? Perhaps once
in 500 million miles of riding? Just because you can imagine something,
Joerg, it doesn't mean it's likely to happen.


Roughly every month in NorCal. The larger number of people who got hit
and hurt is not reported in newspapers. I had numerous close calls
myself so I know.


As I and others have said here, cyclists seem to get more clearance and
care from motorists in the daytime than at night. There have been
countless times that motorists either waited to turn left across my
path, or waited to pull out from stop signs, when I was at least half a
block away. They could have made their move five times, but they waited
for me until I passed.


For me it's two blocks when the light is on high 8-)


Also, as I've reported, I clearly recall the night I was driving and saw
our city's most dedicated utility cyclist when he was about at least a
block away, coming toward me at night on a fairly busy city street. His
headlight at the time? A Cateye halogen light powered by two C cells. It
was probably half as bright as the dynamo light I was using at the time.


The best one here is a guy where you think from a mile a way that a
Union Pacific locomotive is approaching. Nobody fails to see him.


I'm talking about a decent dynamo driving a decent LED headlight with
optics optimized for the road. Oh, and an ordinary taillight plus
reflectors.


To me that "system" is incomplete without a battery.


But everyone else should realize that to you, a bike is incomplete if it
doesn't have motorcycle-grade tires, chain and brakes, plus the ability
to carry a full keg of beer. Your requirements are rather unusual.


No, they are utility-based. I am one of the few riders here who can ride
3000mi without a flat. As for beer, I could easily carry a whole crate,
on the MTB as well as the road bike. A bicycle without trunk space is
IMO a sub-par vehicle and not very useful to me. BTW, I am not the only
one around town who thinks that way and mods his bikes accordingly. A
71-year old rider in our village immediately equips a new bike with a
trailer hitch, else it's incomplete to him.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #57  
Old September 16th 17, 01:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:55:45 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 4:01 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:

The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


Yeah, yeah - "Danger! Danger!"

If I'm climbing a steep hill riding on the right side of the road, and a
redneck is soused enough to cross all the way over to hit me head on, I
don't think extra lumens from my headlamp are going to make much
difference. That sort of guy would be as likely to hit head-on another
guy driving a pickup.


You may actually attract him, like a moth. You will certainly attract the back of my hand if you run a 1000 lumen headlight on a MUP.

On multi-lane roads, headlights aren't for preventing head-ons. That's what center-lines are for. Headlights get the attention of cars turning or entering traffic.

A headlight might prevent a head-on on a single lane road with blind curves at night, particularly if an on-coming car can see a light on the other side of a curve. But considering that drunk drivers run head-on into other cars with bright lights all the time, its unlikely that a bright light on a bike would make much difference with a drunk in a tight situation like that.

A bright light will get the attention of people who are actually paying attention (assuming that there are not a lot of confusing light sources), and it will help you see the road -- but you don't need 1000 lumens to do either of those things on a dry night. I rarely use the 800 lumen setting on my all-in-one or the 1400 lumen setting on my Seca. I use that on dark trail only.

As for DRLs, the benefit of DRLs was supposedly proved with flea-watt, hub level magnet powered lights. https://www.reelight.com/en/products...ady-light-set/ The flashlight on my iPhone dwarfs the light output of a Reelight.

My dyno light is clearly lacking in some situations, but 2K and 3K lumen lights are pretty dopey on the road. And one of the most noticeable DRLs I've seen lately was a SuperNova E3 that passed me going the other way in SLC. So for DRLs, dynos would be perfect -- assuming you need to be running a light nonstop all day.

-- Jay Beattie.
  #58  
Old September 16th 17, 02:15 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On 9/15/2017 7:15 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 15:55, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 4:01 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:

The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really
that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


Yeah, yeah - "Danger! Danger!"


One of them just killed another cyclist here, from behind. This time it
was an off-duty police office one the bike who died. Now you can stick
you head back into the sand and pretend it doesn't happen.


I thought we were talking about a drunk crossing to the wrong side of
the road and hitting a person head-on because he was climbing a hill
with a dynamo headlight. Don't pretend that's what happened.

Yes, I know that cyclists get killed by cars. That happens about 750
times per year. I also know that pedestrians get killed by cars, about
4500 per year, and motorists get killed in cars, about 35,000 per year.
Don't stick your head in the sand, Joerg!

Also: How often does that fantasy disaster happen anyway? Perhaps once
in 500 million miles of riding? Just because you can imagine something,
Joerg, it doesn't mean it's likely to happen.


Roughly every month in NorCal.


Every month some slow-climbing cyclist gets run over because his dynamo
light is too dim? Baloney.

The larger number of people who got hit
and hurt is not reported in newspapers. I had numerous close calls
myself so I know.


The far larger number of pedestrians who get hit and hurt is also not
reported in newspapers. And close calls happen to them as well as to
motorists, motorcyclists, inline skaters, pogo stick operators and
housewives washing dishes.
Also, as I've reported, I clearly recall the night I was driving and saw
our city's most dedicated utility cyclist when he was about at least a
block away, coming toward me at night on a fairly busy city street. His
headlight at the time? A Cateye halogen light powered by two C cells. It
was probably half as bright as the dynamo light I was using at the time.


The best one here is a guy where you think from a mile a way that a
Union Pacific locomotive is approaching. Nobody fails to see him.


So, another jerk who thinks he needs to blind other road users. Wonderful.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #59  
Old September 16th 17, 03:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:01:59 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 2:43 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 11:15, Frank Krygowski wrote:

We've reached a stage where a spinning dynamo driving an LED light with
decent optics provides plenty of light for all road cyclists except
perhaps those with very unusual riding conditions. (Of course, they
don't provide enough light for those with unusual levels of paranoia,
but that's a separate matter.)

As I've said before try out some real trail riding. At half brightness
I can comfortably ride at 10mph at night, at full bore of about 1000
lumens 15mph is feasible. For 20mph I'd need more but I don't have to
ride the singletrack that fast at night.


Do a search for the word "road" in my post above. I'm not claiming gonzo
mountain bikers should switch to hub dynamos - although I have done
forest single track with my utility bike and its hub dyno and B&M light.
I suspect I rode much slower than enthusiastic mountain bikers would
want to ride.


In many areas of the country such as where I live there is often no
choice. Even on my road bike I have to travel partly along trails. One
of the many reasons why both bikes have the same light, except the raod
bike sarries twice the battery capacity.


... This system is permanently mounted on the
bike, just like the corresponding components on a car. It's ready at the
flick of a switch and it's extremely reliable, requiring not even
tending to batteries.


How does it keep the lights at full brightness during a long uphill
slog? Like some of these sections:

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/5041564


The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.

But why should a "red neck" driving a pickup be soused?
any more than a bicyclist?

After all:
https://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2...eaths/?mcubz=1
Some 21 percent of autopsies for New York City bicyclists who died
within three hours of their accidents detected alcohol in the body,
according to a Department of Health and Mental Hygiene study that
examined fatal bicycling accidents in New York City from 1996 to 2005.
http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/pe...facts/bicycles
Among bicyclists ages 16 and older who were killed in 2015, 23 percent
had blood alcohol concentrations (BACs) at or above 0.08 percent.
http://www.bhsi.org/alcohol.htm
Blood alcohol levels were estimated from medical records, visits to
crash sites and testing of 342 passing bicyclists for breath alcohol.
At the .08 grams/deciliter level, legally drunk in most states, the
odds of a fatal or serious injury rose by 2,000 per cent. The risk
rose as alcohol rose, beginning at a 600 per cent increase if the
blood level was only .02 grams/deciliter, equivalent to one drink. The
..08 level is typically associated with four to five drinks.

Sounds like it isn't the Redneck we have to look out for it is the
drunken bicyclist.

--
Cheers,

John B.

  #60  
Old September 16th 17, 04:07 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,697
Default Is there an updated Dynotest somewhere?

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 16:15:37 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-09-15 15:55, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/15/2017 4:01 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-15 12:43, Frank Krygowski wrote:

The variation in brightess from, say, 6 mph to 20+ mph isn't really that
great. But more important, when a person is riding uphill slowly, they
don't need to see 1/4 mile ahead. Having a headlight that's slightly
dimmer uphill is no disadvantage.


Until the soused redneck in his dilapidated pickup truck comes tearing
along and doesn't see you in time.


Yeah, yeah - "Danger! Danger!"


One of them just killed another cyclist here, from behind. This time it
was an off-duty police office one the bike who died. Now you can stick
you head back into the sand and pretend it doesn't happen.


If I'm climbing a steep hill riding on the right side of the road, and a
redneck is soused enough to cross all the way over to hit me head on, I
don't think extra lumens from my headlamp are going to make much
difference. That sort of guy would be as likely to hit head-on another
guy driving a pickup.


Most come from behind. That is why I have very bright rear lights as
well, and multiple ones.


Also: How often does that fantasy disaster happen anyway? Perhaps once
in 500 million miles of riding? Just because you can imagine something,
Joerg, it doesn't mean it's likely to happen.


Roughly every month in NorCal. The larger number of people who got hit
and hurt is not reported in newspapers. I had numerous close calls
myself so I know.


But the numbers are out there. I read, for example:

http://www.geklaw.com/pi_bicycle_stats_and_facts.htm
California Highway Patrol gathered statistics for 1,997 accidents
which show that the bicyclist was placed at fault approximately sixty
percent of the time where the rider was severely injured or sustained
fatal injuries.
http://www.ots.ca.gov/Media.../2015_...nce_Report.pdf
128 bicycle fatalities.
Assuming that the CHP isn't telling lies had the 128 bicycle
fatalities been obeying the law the number would have read "Bicycle
Deaths Reach 51.2".

Danger! Danger!

--
Cheers,

John B.

 




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