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#11
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On Monday, June 5, 2017 at 1:41:21 AM UTC+1, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/4/2017 7:16 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 14:53:56 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute wrote: On Sunday, June 4, 2017 at 2:58:38 AM UTC+1, Jeff Liebermann wrote: http://www.designboom.com/technology/luca-agnelli-milano-bici-milan-electric-bicycles-04-18-2016/ http://www.agnellimilanobici.com 1950's retro style hybrid electric bicycle for the 70 year old nostalgia aficionado, who wants a bicycle with power augmentation, built onto a sprung mountain bike frame. Kickstand, fenders, big headlight, chrome, white-wall fat tires, and gas tank are included. It's everything I wanted in a bicycle when I was 15 years old. I think your memory is going, Jeff. I don't think so. There are many things I would rather forget, but my bicycle preferences are not included. At 15 you would already have been too smart to fall for this crap. At 15, I was an aspiring juvenile delinquent, where my concept of the ideal bicycle was defined as the model that would make the fastest getaway. "Because I'm only a journeyman antique furniture faker, whenever my bikes look like **** or fall apart [as Doug Cimperman points out], instead of fixing the problem, I leave it to bite the credulous buyer in the balls, and build my next monstrosity." Isn't that the current trend in product design? Customer tested devices, usually at the customers expense. That's what crowd funding is really all about. You get a small discount to be the first person among your tribe to own a genuine defective prototype. I bought a few of those on Kickstarter which I soon found badly implemented good ideas. When first to market is what makes the profits, it's tempting to sell an unfinished design or prototype just to shave off a few days from the product release date. I suspect the supply of second childhood 70+ year old bicycle collectors, that are into bicycle nostalgia, and have the money to pay for an imported semi-custom machine, is rather limited. Whomever gets there first, will probably end up with the entire market. Even if this bike doesn't fall apart, as Doug says, and plants the rider on his face, there's another problem with that suspension. It pivots the lower steering inclination around the bottom of the head tube to compress a horizontal helical spring against the frame. (...) Have you ever considered the possibility that these bicycles were not meant to be ridden? They have the look of a "show" bicycle, which is meant to demonstrate the discerning taste of the buyer, to those who have no taste. The photos are from "craft-works exhibition at stone island showroom in via savona 54" which is apparently a clothing fashion outlet in a Milan mall, not a bicycle showroom: http://www.stoneisland.com Notice that no prices are mentioned, which suggests that they are outrageously high. The best part of the bicycles shown is the (probably) powder coated paint job, which is certainly not worth risking a ding or a paint flake by riding it on the streets. The whole thing, if anyone ever manages to get it up to speed, say downhill, that bike will switch from dangerous understeer to lethal oversteer and back quite unpredictably, several times a second. Well, when I was 15 years old, I rode around on something with a front wheel that wobbled badly enough that steering was rather erratic. However, since I didn't know that this was not normal, I simply adapted and rider merrily and erratically down the sidewalk. Whomever buys these bicycles is probably more concerned about how it looks than how it rides. Also, since these bicycles were made to be shown, not ridden, in the unlikely event that someone actually tries to ride one, it will be very very slowly. That's the only way to insure that the owners riding companions can get a good look at the machine and are thus able to contrive admiring comments. Therefore, I wouldn't worry much about steering and mechanical difficulties. Frankly, I wouldn't want a clown with such a poor grasp of geometry as luca agnelli (his rendition of his name) to "restore" any furniture I may sit on, never mind "design" a bicycle I would (refuse to) ride. No problem. If I end up with one, I won't let you ride it. Personally, I like it, not because of the engineering or design, but because it conglomerated into one machine, all the worst design aspects of 1950's bicycles. Bicycle kitsch perhaps? https://www.google.com/search?q=kitsch&tbm=isch I ask for no more than competence. Is that really too much? Careful what you ask for. It may not be what you really need or want. In this case, anyone who demonstrates competence soon starts a dot com company, gets involved way over his head, produces ever decreasing quality products, gets sued by his stockholders, and ends up either impoverished, or retired in opulent splendor after a government bailout. Competence is not the road to quality products. Gresham smiles from beyond the grave. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. |
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#12
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
I doahno if fork crit is on target...
concept may sell as variable trail with low speeds n ballon tires gives an over the top lope to the ride. The Scott may use a spring fork |
#13
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
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#14
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
wrote: You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. Maybe, but it's getting really difficult to support a positive attitude. We have an internet that has become a disruptive force at every level of society and the economy. We have a health care system that is built on payment for treatment instead of payment for results, which is promoting being sick as a lifestyle. We have an economy that is in danger of outsourcing itself to its competitors. We have a government that is doing it's best to function in the best interests of everyone except its constituency. We have inflation in key sectors that don't appear on the charts (food, housing, transportation, energy). We have a retirement system that has produced entitlements that are impossible to fund. We have a postal system that is working for the benefit of retirees, junk mail companies, and congressional budget raiders. We have a patent system that supports patent trolls, encourages litigation, and promotes patenting everything in sight. We have a transportation infrastructure, that was mostly built in the 1950's, that is now crumbling, rotting, or rusting away. We have a president, who was elected as the lesser evil, and is living up to that description. We have 80% of business startups failing in the first 18 months. We have a business philosophy that tends to privatize profits and socialize costs. We have an education system that runs at the speed of the slowest students and ignores those with any real potential. We have a country where 99% of the bicycles sold are imported. And, that's just the USA. Other countries have similar problems with the added bonus of regional and ethnic problems. If there is any hope for humanity, it's not going to come from the mess we have today. Little wonder there is some interest in retro-tech, nostalgia, and vintage bicycles. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On Sun, 04 Jun 2017 23:46:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote: On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute wrote: You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. Maybe, but it's getting really difficult to support a positive attitude. We have an internet that has become a disruptive force at every level of society and the economy. We have a health care system that is built on payment for treatment instead of payment for results, which is promoting being sick as a lifestyle. We have an economy that is in danger of outsourcing itself to its competitors. We have a government that is doing it's best to function in the best interests of everyone except its constituency. We have inflation in key sectors that don't appear on the charts (food, housing, transportation, energy). We have a retirement system that has produced entitlements that are impossible to fund. We have a postal system that is working for the benefit of retirees, junk mail companies, and congressional budget raiders. We have a patent system that supports patent trolls, encourages litigation, and promotes patenting everything in sight. We have a transportation infrastructure, that was mostly built in the 1950's, that is now crumbling, rotting, or rusting away. We have a president, who was elected as the lesser evil, and is living up to that description. We have 80% of business startups failing in the first 18 months. We have a business philosophy that tends to privatize profits and socialize costs. We have an education system that runs at the speed of the slowest students and ignores those with any real potential. We have a country where 99% of the bicycles sold are imported. And, that's just the USA. Other countries have similar problems with the added bonus of regional and ethnic problems. If there is any hope for humanity, it's not going to come from the mess we have today. Little wonder there is some interest in retro-tech, nostalgia, and vintage bicycles. A Australian friend forwarded this to me via email: The definition of the word Conundrum is: Something that is puzzling or confusing. Here are six Conundrums of socialism in the United States of America. 1. America is capitalist and greedy - yet half of the population is subsidized. 2. Half of the population is subsidized - yet they think they are victims. 3. They think they are victims - yet their representatives run the government. 4. Their representatives run the government - yet the poor keep getting poorer. 5. The poor keep getting poorer - yet they have things that people in other countries only dream about. 6. They have things that people in other countries only dream about - yet they want America to be more like those other countries. Think about it! And that, my friends, pretty much sums up the USA in the 21st Century. Makes you wonder who is doing the math. These three, short sentences tell you a lot about the direction of our current government and cultural environment: 1. We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works. And here's another one worth considering: 2. Seems we constantly hear about how Social Security is going to run out of money. But we never hear about welfare or food stamps running out of money! What's interesting is the first group "worked for" their money, but the second didn't. Think about it.....and Last but not least : 3. Why are we cutting benefits for our veterans, no pay raises for our military and cutting our army to a level lower than before WWII, but we are not stopping the payments or benefits to illegal aliens. ---------------------- I have no idea whether any of this is correct or makes sense but it is very reminiscent of much of the complaints I see on the Internet. -- Cheers, John B. |
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On 6/5/2017 1:46 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute wrote: You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. Maybe, but it's getting really difficult to support a positive attitude. We have an internet that has become a disruptive force at every level of society and the economy. We have a health care system that is built on payment for treatment instead of payment for results, which is promoting being sick as a lifestyle. We have an economy that is in danger of outsourcing itself to its competitors. We have a government that is doing it's best to function in the best interests of everyone except its constituency. We have inflation in key sectors that don't appear on the charts (food, housing, transportation, energy). We have a retirement system that has produced entitlements that are impossible to fund. We have a postal system that is working for the benefit of retirees, junk mail companies, and congressional budget raiders. We have a patent system that supports patent trolls, encourages litigation, and promotes patenting everything in sight. We have a transportation infrastructure, that was mostly built in the 1950's, that is now crumbling, rotting, or rusting away. We have a president, who was elected as the lesser evil, and is living up to that description. We have 80% of business startups failing in the first 18 months. We have a business philosophy that tends to privatize profits and socialize costs. We have an education system that runs at the speed of the slowest students and ignores those with any real potential. We have a country where 99% of the bicycles sold are imported. And, that's just the USA. Other countries have similar problems with the added bonus of regional and ethnic problems. If there is any hope for humanity, it's not going to come from the mess we have today. Little wonder there is some interest in retro-tech, nostalgia, and vintage bicycles. If you're not angry, you're not paying attention. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#17
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On 6/5/2017 4:01 AM, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jun 2017 23:46:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute wrote: You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. Maybe, but it's getting really difficult to support a positive attitude. We have an internet that has become a disruptive force at every level of society and the economy. We have a health care system that is built on payment for treatment instead of payment for results, which is promoting being sick as a lifestyle. We have an economy that is in danger of outsourcing itself to its competitors. We have a government that is doing it's best to function in the best interests of everyone except its constituency. We have inflation in key sectors that don't appear on the charts (food, housing, transportation, energy). We have a retirement system that has produced entitlements that are impossible to fund. We have a postal system that is working for the benefit of retirees, junk mail companies, and congressional budget raiders. We have a patent system that supports patent trolls, encourages litigation, and promotes patenting everything in sight. We have a transportation infrastructure, that was mostly built in the 1950's, that is now crumbling, rotting, or rusting away. We have a president, who was elected as the lesser evil, and is living up to that description. We have 80% of business startups failing in the first 18 months. We have a business philosophy that tends to privatize profits and socialize costs. We have an education system that runs at the speed of the slowest students and ignores those with any real potential. We have a country where 99% of the bicycles sold are imported. And, that's just the USA. Other countries have similar problems with the added bonus of regional and ethnic problems. If there is any hope for humanity, it's not going to come from the mess we have today. Little wonder there is some interest in retro-tech, nostalgia, and vintage bicycles. A Australian friend forwarded this to me via email: The definition of the word Conundrum is: Something that is puzzling or confusing. Here are six Conundrums of socialism in the United States of America. 1. America is capitalist and greedy - yet half of the population is subsidized. 2. Half of the population is subsidized - yet they think they are victims. 3. They think they are victims - yet their representatives run the government. 4. Their representatives run the government - yet the poor keep getting poorer. 5. The poor keep getting poorer - yet they have things that people in other countries only dream about. 6. They have things that people in other countries only dream about - yet they want America to be more like those other countries. Think about it! And that, my friends, pretty much sums up the USA in the 21st Century. Makes you wonder who is doing the math. These three, short sentences tell you a lot about the direction of our current government and cultural environment: 1. We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works. And here's another one worth considering: 2. Seems we constantly hear about how Social Security is going to run out of money. But we never hear about welfare or food stamps running out of money! What's interesting is the first group "worked for" their money, but the second didn't. Think about it.....and Last but not least : 3. Why are we cutting benefits for our veterans, no pay raises for our military and cutting our army to a level lower than before WWII, but we are not stopping the payments or benefits to illegal aliens. ---------------------- I have no idea whether any of this is correct or makes sense but it is very reminiscent of much of the complaints I see on the Internet. It may well be that 'The Constitution is not a suicide pact', but now that we've fully abandoned it, this suicide pact is all we have. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On Monday, June 5, 2017 at 8:48:18 AM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote:
On 6/5/2017 1:46 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 18:56:17 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute wrote: You fellows are such cynics! Andre Jute There is hope for humanity yet. There has to be. Maybe, but it's getting really difficult to support a positive attitude. We have an internet that has become a disruptive force at every level of society and the economy. We have a health care system that is built on payment for treatment instead of payment for results, which is promoting being sick as a lifestyle. We have an economy that is in danger of outsourcing itself to its competitors. We have a government that is doing it's best to function in the best interests of everyone except its constituency. We have inflation in key sectors that don't appear on the charts (food, housing, transportation, energy). We have a retirement system that has produced entitlements that are impossible to fund. We have a postal system that is working for the benefit of retirees, junk mail companies, and congressional budget raiders. We have a patent system that supports patent trolls, encourages litigation, and promotes patenting everything in sight. We have a transportation infrastructure, that was mostly built in the 1950's, that is now crumbling, rotting, or rusting away. We have a president, who was elected as the lesser evil, and is living up to that description. We have 80% of business startups failing in the first 18 months. We have a business philosophy that tends to privatize profits and socialize costs. We have an education system that runs at the speed of the slowest students and ignores those with any real potential. We have a country where 99% of the bicycles sold are imported. And, that's just the USA. Other countries have similar problems with the added bonus of regional and ethnic problems. If there is any hope for humanity, it's not going to come from the mess we have today. Little wonder there is some interest in retro-tech, nostalgia, and vintage bicycles. If you're not angry, you're not paying attention. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 Cambodia is in election.. from the NYT Briefing Every year, The Economist magazine assesses the state of democracy across the world, based on five categories: electoral process and pluralism; civil liberties; the functioning of government; political participation; and political culture. In 2016, the most recent list, Cambodia ranked 112th, just ahead of Myanmar and Iraq. (Norway was first, the U.S. ranked 21st, and North Korea was last.) In Cambodia, the opposition claimed gains in Sunday’s election that could shake Prime Minister Hun Sen’s grip on power. He has governed since 1985. But as Sophal Ear, a Cambodian-American political scientist, observed, “At some point, things change, whether you want them to or not.” read some ConLaw, you'll feel better. |
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
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#20
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1950's style hybrid electric bicycles
On Mon, 05 Jun 2017 07:48:16 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
If you're not angry, you're not paying attention. If I were not angry, it must mean that I'm satisfied with the current situation, which of course is not the case. Therefore, I must obviously be angry. Welcome to the digital world of extreme everything. However, that's not reality. In between rebellious anger and complaisant acceptance of the status quo, is a wide range of attitudes the actions. Each is a response to either a specific major problem, a wide range of minor problems, proposed solutions, and a cost/benefit calculation. If the outcome seems beneficial and can be achieved with little cost or risk, then things start to happen. However, if the status quo is tolerable, the cost of change is high, and the risks of making things worse is probable, then nothing happens. Eventually, we reach a balancing point, somewhere between utopia and hell, where most everyone is moderately satisfied with the current situation, and nothing changes. Welcome to the analog world of the greatest good for the greatest number, also known as mass mediocrity. WWI was the war to end all wars. WWII was to make the world safe for democracy. If there is going to be a WWIII, it will be highly xenophobic and based on "Make America Great Again". Welcome to retro-politics. The real problem with American politics is that we don't have a real leader or leadership. Without the drive provided by a leader, American politics would come to a grinding halt, with all political efforts aimed at maintaining the status quo and redistributing the existing assets. The succession of the last 50 years of presidential losers should demonstrate clearly that we unable and unwilling to elect a real leadership. So, we rot in place and then complain that our position as the world leader in everything is disappearing. It never occurs to us that in order to be a leading nation, we must have a functional leader. Mob rule by the GUM (great unwashed masses) isn't sustainable. The solution is easy. Change everything(tm). -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
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