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Stronger rubber cement?



 
 
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  #71  
Old January 5th 17, 06:41 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH
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Posts: 2,011
Default Stronger rubber cement?

Maybe...

Also possible leak continues hardening substance then catylizing into the upside down mass.

Common in caulking gun tunes of eg GE silicone...as a quality product example.
Ads
  #72  
Old January 5th 17, 07:55 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
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Posts: 4,018
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 11:59:28 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

Try these:

https://www.amazon.com/Sunlite-Thorn.../dp/B000BMT2TM

I never looked back. Reviews are mixed and sometimes they do have poor
valve attachment. Also, some are thick only towards the running surface
and that is less protecting than thick all around.


Thanks. I should probably get something like that instead of the
cheap tubes that I've been buying. Note that the cheap tubes seem to
leak without any riding. I've built wheels, applied pressure, and
watched the pressure drop slowly over a period of several days. The
leaks are small, difficult to find, tricky to plug without a patch,
and very irritating.

Incidentally, I use mostly Presta valves:
https://www.amazon.com/Sunlite-Thorn-Resistant-Presta-Valve/dp/B000AO9ZX4/

So ask before buying in order to be able to return if not as promised.
As Forest Gump said, "Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know
what you gonna get".


I rarely return anything unless its dead on arrival or they shipped me
the wrong stuff. I'll probably just buy one set tubes and see what
happens. $14/ea for 27x1.25. Grumble...

The thicker a tube the better it usually is.


If it means that I don't have to pump up the tires every time I go for
a ride, I'll pay the price.
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #73  
Old January 5th 17, 11:04 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tosspot[_3_]
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Posts: 1,563
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 04/01/17 20:05, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-03 17:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.


Thanks to all responders (also Barry and Doug). I'll order Slime Rubber
Cement with my next Amazon shipment because that's what David uses, he
says it works well and it isn't expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/Slime-1050-Ru.../dp/B003V9UU66


Whatwhat!! Are you *seriously* claiming r.b.t has been useful!? What
ever is the world coming to?

Let's get back to chain lubes, that's much more fun :-)

  #74  
Old January 5th 17, 01:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH
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Posts: 2,011
Default Stronger rubber cement?

If there are pin holes yawl bought bad tubes. Buy from Specialized mail odor on Nevada. The supply may vary, winter is OK. Spec thorn proof tubes made with thicker bottom are noticeably more difficult to move into into into into motion ...so if ura weenie ? Being insensate, I transcend that moment n move on joyous n buoyed by air pressure.

Specs with slime like compounds are lighter but more $$, a more difficult problematic repair.

The tube problem as the tire problem is jorgian ... there is an obvious answer on the market so move there with $$
  #75  
Old January 5th 17, 04:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 3,345
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 8:47:35 PM UTC-8, Phil Lee wrote:
Joerg considered Wed, 04 Jan 2017
07:38:10 -0800 the perfect time to write:

On 2017-01-04 01:19, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 01:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.

UK, but must be available all over

http://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acat...r-Patches.html


Go up to 180mmx95mm and are less than a UKP per patch.


Thanks! Time for a trip to the autoparts store since there is

http://www.vipal-usa.com/repair_line_e.html

Looks like a Brazilian company.


The 30mm patches are 13 squids per 100! Surely, surely even Joerg can't
get through that amount that fast!


I hardly get flats but when I do they are hardcore. Typically caused by
those notorious #%&^!! flimsy side walls of bicycle tires. Which is also
why I am always on the lookout for tires with better side walls. For the
MTB I found that Asian ones do better in that domain but haven't found
any yet for the road bike. Will try CST, their Conquistare tires look
promising but I could not find reviews.

Heavier tires are generally better and finally those appeared for 29".
For 700c it's still slim pickens.


You do know that 29" ARE 700c, both using a bead seat diameter of
622mm?
It's just that one description is used for MTB and the other for road
use.


I have been told that many times. But my CX bike feels absolutely NOTHING like the 29er did. On that the wheels felt massive and heavy. On the CX bike they are nothing of the sort.
  #76  
Old January 5th 17, 04:59 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 19
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 8:04:38 PM UTC-5, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/


You can use place a second offset patch over an existing Rema patch. This way you can patch long slits using the F1 (25mm) Rema round patch. Patch one at a time, then sand the top of the patch in the direction of the patch center to the end, apply the vulcanizing fluid and apply the next. Repeat the process until the entire slit is patched.

Make sure you start and end about 15 mm beyond the slit. You may also want to cut a small circle around the ends of the slit to stop the slit from expanding when the tube is inflated.

You have not stated the tube size. This is important because the patch must fit within the width of the tube when the tube is flat. I've found I have to use the F0 (16 mm) patch for tube widths less than 25 mm. I've found the wider F1 (25 mm) patch will work with tubes with a nominal width of 28 mm and above.

It's important that the patch edges are "glued." I've found the best way to insure this is to lie the tube on a flat surface and burnish the patch onto the tube after it's applied. I use a center to outside burnishing motion. I use the rounded edge of a Rema patch kit as my burnishing tool.

There are some rubber compounds that won't work with the Rema vulcanizing fluid. It also won't work in cold temperatures or when the tube is wet. However, I've found that most of the time the reason that patches don't adhere is due to improper application - pilot error. Sand over a bigger area than you spread the vulcanizing fluid; spread the vulcanizing fluid over a bigger area than the patch. Spread a thin layer of the vulcanizing fluid and let it dry before applying the patch. Don't blow on the vulcanizing fluid to hasten its drying - the moisture in your breath will neutralize it.

If your tube has a rubber composition that will not work with the Rema vulcanizing fluid, you may want to reconsider your tube choice.

I assume the reason you opt for a thick tube is to avoid flats. However, you are paying 3 times what I pay for normal thickness tubes. At about $0.75 per flat repair, I can make a lot of them to my inexpensive tube before reaching your $15 threshold.
  #77  
Old January 5th 17, 04:59 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Posts: 6,016
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 2017-01-05 07:34, wrote:
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 8:47:35 PM UTC-8, Phil Lee wrote:
Joerg considered Wed, 04 Jan 2017
07:38:10 -0800 the perfect time to write:

On 2017-01-04 01:19, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 01:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in
the patch kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast
or where multiple cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side
wall blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of
an inch long. The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore,
expensive. $15-20 each and that's not something to be thrown
out lightly. Instead of the li'l REMA patches I need to use
thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube but this has to
be vulcanized/cemented really well.

UK, but must be available all over

http://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acat...r-Patches.html




Go up to 180mmx95mm and are less than a UKP per patch.


Thanks! Time for a trip to the autoparts store since there is

http://www.vipal-usa.com/repair_line_e.html

Looks like a Brazilian company.


The 30mm patches are 13 squids per 100! Surely, surely even
Joerg can't get through that amount that fast!


I hardly get flats but when I do they are hardcore. Typically
caused by those notorious #%&^!! flimsy side walls of bicycle
tires. Which is also why I am always on the lookout for tires
with better side walls. For the MTB I found that Asian ones do
better in that domain but haven't found any yet for the road
bike. Will try CST, their Conquistare tires look promising but I
could not find reviews.

Heavier tires are generally better and finally those appeared for
29". For 700c it's still slim pickens.


You do know that 29" ARE 700c, both using a bead seat diameter of
622mm? It's just that one description is used for MTB and the other
for road use.


I have been told that many times. But my CX bike feels absolutely
NOTHING like the 29er did. On that the wheels felt massive and heavy.
On the CX bike they are nothing of the sort.


Phil should try to mount a 29" Intense Trail Taker tire or similar on a
700c road bike. Then it would quickly sink in why this will never work :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #78  
Old January 5th 17, 05:03 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 2017-01-04 15:48, wrote:
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 9:53:05 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-04 08:37,
wrote:
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 7:41:16 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-04 06:26,
wrote:
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 5:04:38 PM UTC-8, Joerg
wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement
in the patch kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so
fast or where multiple cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side
wall blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths
of an inch long. The tubes I use are super thick and,
therefore, expensive. $15-20 each and that's not something
to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l REMA patches
I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Jeorg, considering the amount and extent of flats that you
get perhaps you should observe Tosspot's recommendations:

http://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acat...-PSF_Plus.html






:-)

I don't get many flats but if I do they are nasty tears on the
sides where tubes flex all the time. Caused by side wall
failures of tires.

So I need something that is super strong in the vulcanizing
process and where the tube or can contents won't dry out after
just a few months of storage. I always fix at home so cold
storage and the necessity to use pressure tools and such would
be no problem.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Considering that you get sidewall failures you should probably
only use tires that have bead to bead belts and also high
thread-count cords. Doing so would give you a dramatic drop in
the failures.



That was the reason for the tire thread a while ago. Retroguybilly
suggested CST Correre but they don't come in 25mm. I will try
their Conquistare tires which supposedly are 3-ply in the
sidewalls. Unfortunately only for the foldable versions.

The Gatorskin Hardshells are claimed to have improved side walls as
well but I am concerned that they also run too small like regular
Gatorskins. I am tired of having to wrestle them on. They do have
good life span though and I get 2500mi out of a rear tire. Most
other riders with other tires out here get 2000mi or less.


If
you're getting failures of Gatorskins that must be some sort of
terrain you commute on.


It's unavoidable out here. There is often the occasional "Pavement
ends in 200ft" or plain old singletrack that has to be conquered by
road bike to get to another town. Like at least once a week he

https://goo.gl/maps/fyCyQs3MC6x

This is also why my road bike is almost as dirty as my MTB. Which
causes another problem for the side walls. A week ago I stopped
because of a weird phhhsssrrt... phhhsssrrt noise. Turns out mud
had caked in the crown of the fork, dried up and was rubbing
against the tire.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/


Because of my loss of memory it really irritates me to see a picture
like that and know that I've ridden that route on a road bike and yet
I can only recognize it if I do it again. It's like the Aptos ride we
do. Not only did I recognize every inch of it but I had to be LED
because I couldn't remember which turns to take.


This one is the "path" from El Dorado Hills to Folsom. The picture shows
the end of Saratoga Way. After going through mud for a little while
you'll end up at the dead end of Iron Point Road in Folsom.


We did a San Geronimo ride a month and a half ago and I remembered
the restaurant we had lunch in and the route out even though I
couldn't remember the route in.


Restaurant always sounds tempting. Provided they have good beer on tap.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #79  
Old January 5th 17, 05:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 1/5/2017 9:59 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-05 07:34, wrote:
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 8:47:35 PM UTC-8, Phil
Lee wrote:
Joerg considered Wed, 04 Jan
2017
07:38:10 -0800 the perfect time to write:

On 2017-01-04 01:19, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 01:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber
cement in
the patch kits? Ideally something that won't dry out
so fast
or where multiple cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from
side
wall blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two
tenths of
an inch long. The tubes I use are super thick and,
therefore,
expensive. $15-20 each and that's not something to be
thrown
out lightly. Instead of the li'l REMA patches I need
to use
thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube but this
has to
be vulcanized/cemented really well.

UK, but must be available all over

http://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acat...r-Patches.html





Go up to 180mmx95mm and are less than a UKP per patch.


Thanks! Time for a trip to the autoparts store since
there is

http://www.vipal-usa.com/repair_line_e.html

Looks like a Brazilian company.


The 30mm patches are 13 squids per 100! Surely, surely
even
Joerg can't get through that amount that fast!


I hardly get flats but when I do they are hardcore.
Typically
caused by those notorious #%&^!! flimsy side walls of
bicycle
tires. Which is also why I am always on the lookout for
tires
with better side walls. For the MTB I found that Asian
ones do
better in that domain but haven't found any yet for the
road
bike. Will try CST, their Conquistare tires look
promising but I
could not find reviews.

Heavier tires are generally better and finally those
appeared for
29". For 700c it's still slim pickens.

You do know that 29" ARE 700c, both using a bead seat
diameter of
622mm? It's just that one description is used for MTB and
the other
for road use.


I have been told that many times. But my CX bike feels
absolutely
NOTHING like the 29er did. On that the wheels felt massive
and heavy.
On the CX bike they are nothing of the sort.


Phil should try to mount a 29" Intense Trail Taker tire or
similar on a 700c road bike. Then it would quickly sink in
why this will never work :-)


Joerg, don't be ridiculous. Phil Lee was correct.

A 559mm 26x2.3 tire will mount on the rim but can't possibly
fit inside the frame or fork of a Bridgestone CB1. So what?
A perfectly common 700-35C touring tire won't clear in your
road bike either.

That unsuitably wide tires exist for any given rim diameter
in any given frame doesn't make them different ISO sizes.
There are a spectrum of widths for almost every ISO format,
choice is good!

p.s. A 700-18 ultralight tire would fit your road bike rim
as well. For you, I'd suggest a wider tire.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #80  
Old January 5th 17, 05:47 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,345
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Thursday, January 5, 2017 at 8:31:22 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/5/2017 9:59 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-05 07:34, wrote:
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 8:47:35 PM UTC-8, Phil
Lee wrote:
Joerg considered Wed, 04 Jan
2017
07:38:10 -0800 the perfect time to write:

On 2017-01-04 01:19, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 01:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber
cement in
the patch kits? Ideally something that won't dry out
so fast
or where multiple cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from
side
wall blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two
tenths of
an inch long. The tubes I use are super thick and,
therefore,
expensive. $15-20 each and that's not something to be
thrown
out lightly. Instead of the li'l REMA patches I need
to use
thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube but this
has to
be vulcanized/cemented really well.

UK, but must be available all over

http://www.tyre-equipment.co.uk/acat...r-Patches.html





Go up to 180mmx95mm and are less than a UKP per patch.


Thanks! Time for a trip to the autoparts store since
there is

http://www.vipal-usa.com/repair_line_e.html

Looks like a Brazilian company.


The 30mm patches are 13 squids per 100! Surely, surely
even
Joerg can't get through that amount that fast!


I hardly get flats but when I do they are hardcore.
Typically
caused by those notorious #%&^!! flimsy side walls of
bicycle
tires. Which is also why I am always on the lookout for
tires
with better side walls. For the MTB I found that Asian
ones do
better in that domain but haven't found any yet for the
road
bike. Will try CST, their Conquistare tires look
promising but I
could not find reviews.

Heavier tires are generally better and finally those
appeared for
29". For 700c it's still slim pickens.

You do know that 29" ARE 700c, both using a bead seat
diameter of
622mm? It's just that one description is used for MTB and
the other
for road use.

I have been told that many times. But my CX bike feels
absolutely
NOTHING like the 29er did. On that the wheels felt massive
and heavy.
On the CX bike they are nothing of the sort.


Phil should try to mount a 29" Intense Trail Taker tire or
similar on a 700c road bike. Then it would quickly sink in
why this will never work :-)


Joerg, don't be ridiculous. Phil Lee was correct.

A 559mm 26x2.3 tire will mount on the rim but can't possibly
fit inside the frame or fork of a Bridgestone CB1. So what?
A perfectly common 700-35C touring tire won't clear in your
road bike either.

That unsuitably wide tires exist for any given rim diameter
in any given frame doesn't make them different ISO sizes.
There are a spectrum of widths for almost every ISO format,
choice is good!

p.s. A 700-18 ultralight tire would fit your road bike rim
as well. For you, I'd suggest a wider tire.


In order to make this a regular road bike capable of mounting at least a 32 would be to exchange the crank for a compact and reset the spacing of the front derailleur.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/5920793876.html

This gives you the best of all possible worlds.
 




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