Reducing bicycle chain service to zero

On 5/20/2016 7:01 AM, jbeattie wrote:

snip

I use a skillet and olive oil -- medium high heat. Brown the chain on one side, turn it and then add shallots and a clove of fresh garlic. I then remove the chain and place it over a bed of fresh bar tape, al dente.

No need to me so sarcastic. There's nothing really wrong with
recreational chain maintenance. If it makes someone feel good thinking
that they doing something good for their chain then more power to them.
There are a lot worse ways to spend one's time.

What I don't like is recreational vehicle oil changing. "My grandfather
did 3000 mile oil changes so I should too," even though modern detergent
motor oils, when paired with a quality filter, can easily go 5000-10,000
miles with no negative effects at all.

And Jay, you live in Portland. Coffee scented chain lube is what you
should be using:
http://www.jensonusa.com/Dumonde-Tech-Cafe-Chain-Lube. Or you could
buy this http://www.planttherapy.com/coffee-essential-oil and add it
to whatever chain lube you are presently using. Get with the program.

On 5/20/2016 10:29 AM, sms wrote:
On 5/19/2016 7:14 PM, James wrote:


I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I did this once with a short section of excess chain, then took it apart
to examine the wax penetration. It had certainly got in to all the
spaces within the chain.

It does get in. But since it is not fluid, it quickly is rubbed off.
Chain waxing needs to be done very often, even when you add oil to it.

It's a shame Mr. Scharf is so willing to expound on stuff he knows
nothing about.

Or to put it less politely: Bull****!

For one example: Before riding coast to coast (east to west), I waxed
all three of our bikes' chains. Once the chains began to squeak
slightly, I used oil for the rest of the trip. But the first oil was
applied somewhere in Iowa, IIRC. That's despite daily rain for the
first two weeks of the trip.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On 5/20/2016 9:01 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, May 19, 2016 at 7:14:19 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 19/05/16 21:02, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2016 02:27:16 -0700, sms
wrote:



At least no one seems to be doing hot waxing of chains anymore!


Oh? I thought that both James and Frank were chain waxers?


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I use a skillet and olive oil -- medium high heat. Brown the chain on one side, turn it and then add shallots and a clove of fresh garlic. I then remove the chain and place it over a bed of fresh bar tape, al dente.

-- Jay Beattie.


Every sauce has a pasta shape. Do you slice the tape to
linguini or pinch it into farfalle or what? I don't want to
screw this up.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 20/05/2016 12:49 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 5/20/2016 9:01 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, May 19, 2016 at 7:14:19 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 19/05/16 21:02, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2016 02:27:16 -0700, sms
wrote:



At least no one seems to be doing hot waxing of chains anymore!


Oh? I thought that both James and Frank were chain waxers?


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is
needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I use a skillet and olive oil -- medium high heat. Brown the chain on
one side, turn it and then add shallots and a clove of fresh garlic. I
then remove the chain and place it over a bed of fresh bar tape, al
dente.

-- Jay Beattie.


Every sauce has a pasta shape. Do you slice the tape to linguini or
pinch it into farfalle or what? I don't want to screw this up.


There are some go to sauces that work on most pasta. I'd recommend an
Aioli sauce if you're not sure.

On Friday, May 20, 2016 at 3:01:59 PM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:

I use a skillet and olive oil -- medium high heat. Brown the chain on one side, turn it and then add shallots and a clove of fresh garlic. I then remove the chain and place it over a bed of fresh bar tape, al dente.

-- Jay Beattie.

we ate al fresco but the police arrived and said cannibalism is illegal

andre jute
this joke works only in illiteracy of all lower case

On Friday, May 20, 2016 at 6:09:40 PM UTC+1, Duane wrote:
On 20/05/2016 12:49 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 5/20/2016 9:01 AM, jbeattie wrote:
On Thursday, May 19, 2016 at 7:14:19 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 19/05/16 21:02, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2016 02:27:16 -0700, sms
wrote:



At least no one seems to be doing hot waxing of chains anymore!


Oh? I thought that both James and Frank were chain waxers?


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is
needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I use a skillet and olive oil -- medium high heat. Brown the chain on
one side, turn it and then add shallots and a clove of fresh garlic. I
then remove the chain and place it over a bed of fresh bar tape, al
dente.

-- Jay Beattie.


Every sauce has a pasta shape. Do you slice the tape to linguini or
pinch it into farfalle or what? I don't want to screw this up.


There are some go to sauces that work on most pasta. I'd recommend an
Aioli sauce if you're not sure.

Lidl has the best sauces.

Andre Jute
Short order cook

On Friday, May 20, 2016 at 4:29:48 PM UTC+1, sms wrote:

What I don't like is recreational vehicle oil changing. "My grandfather
did 3000 mile oil changes so I should too," even though modern detergent
motor oils, when paired with a quality filter, can easily go 5000-10,000
miles with no negative effects at all.

Back when I was an undergraduate, I wrecked my Porsche racing in a storm drain up in what was then Rhodesia and, not having too much money and having to be in class 1500m (or so, just for the usual kibbitzer assholes) away on Monday morning, went to a Saturday-morning auction and bought an ex-police Jaguar Mk II with a quarter million miles on the clock. The seats, which had started red, were black with the accumulated sweat of beefy men in a car without air conditioning. But the engine was fine because every 3000 miles they drained the oil hot and filled it up and drove on, the car being in use 24 hours a day, never allowed to cool down. I put 10K on it as my personal party car because sooner or later that got wrecked (I replaced the inside with new seats and carpets from a crashed Mk II) and then we put another 30K on it as a tow car for my racing cars, and then I swapped it for another car. It was still going good, because my mechanics kept up the 3000m oil change schedule.

Perhaps you should send your smart granddad to RBT, Scharfie.

Andre Jute
Wisdom of the ages

On Thu, 19 May 2016 22:57:49 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 5/19/2016 10:14 PM, James wrote:


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is
needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I did this once with a short section of excess chain, then took it apart
to examine the wax penetration. It had certainly got in to all the
spaces within the chain.

In dry riding conditions, I may only maintain my chain about every
2000km (which is 2months for me).

My "special" wax is a blend of ordinary candle wax and motor oil and
gear oil. The aim is that there is enough oil in there so that the wax
is just going soft at about 40 degrees C.

I very rarely need to clean the cassette, chain rings or derailleurs.
They simply don't get filthy.

The chain doesn't squeak, unless perhaps it is near time to re-lube
anyway and I have a wet ride or two. If I've been for a wet ride the
day before, I might give the chain a quick squirt of WD40, which
dissolves some of the remaining wax and allows the oil to become more
mobile. Wipe off excess before riding.

I suggested to a local mobile bicycle mechanic that she might be
interested in trying a wax/oil blend and cooking chains. She said "No",
because heating the chain to hot wax temperatures would weaken it.

So much for science, eh?

And I wax my chain on the bike. I use a propane torch to warm about a
foot of chain, then I take a chunk of cold wax with an oil mix (much
like James') and scrape some onto the warm chain. Next I use the torch
to heat the chain links hotter, so the wax melts and runs in. I wipe
off the excess by running the chain through paper towels in my fist. I
protect the bike parts from the heat with a shield of aluminum sheet.

Takes maybe five minutes per bike, and I usually do several bikes at a
time, once I've got the torch, wax and paper towels out.


I take it that you don't have a carbon fiber bike :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

On Fri, 20 May 2016 12:14:13 +1000, James
wrote:

On 19/05/16 21:02, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2016 02:27:16 -0700, sms
wrote:



At least no one seems to be doing hot waxing of chains anymore!


Oh? I thought that both James and Frank were chain waxers?


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I did this once with a short section of excess chain, then took it apart
to examine the wax penetration. It had certainly got in to all the
spaces within the chain.

In dry riding conditions, I may only maintain my chain about every
2000km (which is 2months for me).

My "special" wax is a blend of ordinary candle wax and motor oil and
gear oil. The aim is that there is enough oil in there so that the wax
is just going soft at about 40 degrees C.

I very rarely need to clean the cassette, chain rings or derailleurs.
They simply don't get filthy.

The chain doesn't squeak, unless perhaps it is near time to re-lube
anyway and I have a wet ride or two. If I've been for a wet ride the
day before, I might give the chain a quick squirt of WD40, which
dissolves some of the remaining wax and allows the oil to become more
mobile. Wipe off excess before riding.

I suggested to a local mobile bicycle mechanic that she might be
interested in trying a wax/oil blend and cooking chains. She said "No",
because heating the chain to hot wax temperatures would weaken it.

So much for science, eh?

I'm not sure what sort of pot you are using but I was using a sort of
electrical heated wok - because I found one that was cheap - and I was
doing what I believe you were doing. Wipe the crud off and throw it in
the pot.

Anyway, as my pot was a wok if you dropped it when it was cold the wax
fell out easily and I noticed that the bottom portion of the wax was
turning a dirty black while the upper portion remained wax colored. I
suspect that the hot wax is acting as a sort of solvent and actually
cleaning the chain as well as lubricating it.

As for hot wax softening chains... isn't science wonderful :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

On Fri, 20 May 2016 07:29:58 -0700, sms
wrote:

On 5/19/2016 7:14 PM, James wrote:
On 19/05/16 21:02, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 19 May 2016 02:27:16 -0700, sms
wrote:



At least no one seems to be doing hot waxing of chains anymore!


Oh? I thought that both James and Frank were chain waxers?


I alternate between 2 chains used on the one cassette. To facilitate
swapping the chains, I use a quick link (Connex). Removing or
installing a chain takes seconds, and no special one use only pin is
needed.

I don't generally bother to clean a chain before I "cook" it in hot wax.
I use an old cooking pot that is half full of my "special" home brew
wax (more on that later), put it on the stove with the chain in it. I
like to get the wax temperature quite hot, and stir the chain a little
to flex the links and try to allow air to escape. I then remove the
chain with a hook, wipe it down with a rag, and hang it to cool.

I did this once with a short section of excess chain, then took it apart
to examine the wax penetration. It had certainly got in to all the
spaces within the chain.

It does get in. But since it is not fluid, it quickly is rubbed off.
Chain waxing needs to be done very often, even when you add oil to it.

"Paraffin (canning wax), although clean, works poorly because it is not
mobile and cannot replenish the bearing surfaces once it has been
displaced."

The Connex link is essential on the narrower chains that are removed
from the bike for cleaning and lubrication. But how many people are
spending $20 on a Connex link in order to perform this sort of chain
maintenance which is no better than cleaning and lubing on the bicycle
which only takes a few minutes?

Are you selling these $20 "Connex links"? Or just don't know what you
are talking about?

After all, Wiggle is selling the 7 - 8 speed links at $3.82 and the 10
speed links at $8.40.

The description of your little business is sounding less and less like
"guerrilla marketing" and more and more like "Robber Baron Marketing".


As an aside, it's a shame how John Allen is ruining Sheldon's web site
with so much misinformation. He rails against motor oil as a chain
lubricant because of the detergent properties. But non-detergent 30W
motor oil is readily available and works very well if you are soaking
your chain in oil.

You seem to have the bit in your teeth this morning, don't you. "He
rails against motor oil as a chain lubricant".

Actually what he said was " I [John Allen] rode once with someone who
had used it (motor oil) the day before, and her chain was already
squeaking."

While I would agree that facts are probably a bit thin on the ground
in your little universe, I would have to say that John's statement
sounds more like a "statement of fact" than a "rail".

(rail ~ verb 1. complain bitterly, 2. enclose with rails )
--
cheers,

John B.