A Cycling & bikes forum. CycleBanter.com

Go Back   Home » CycleBanter.com forum » rec.bicycles » Techniques
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #71  
Old April 12th 15, 09:22 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
James[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,153
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:
Lou Holtman wrote:
Joe Riel schreef op 12-4-2015 om 5:28:
James writes:

On 11/04/15 18:05, Lou Holtman wrote:

Hey Jay I'm not saying that anyone, Amaricans or Europians, should spend
whatever a Rohloff hub costs. I was wondering why you see more Rohloff
hubs in Europe on normal bikes (I count 5 or 6 in the bike parking at
work just on utility bikes) than in the USA. Ride whatever you like, or
can affort. I will only respond if the arguments to not buy a Rohloff
hub or an other IGH are not correct such as drag, complexity or weight etc.


Last I checked, the weight of a Rohloff hub was quite a bit more than
a rear hub with a cassette, front and rear derailleur and one
chainring. Did I not add up the weight of components correctly?

Besides the price, the wide range and rather coarse steps is a bit
off-putting. My normal road bike has a gear range (highest/lowest)
under 3, the Moulton's is 3.3. The Rohloff's range is over 5. I'd
prefer something with finer steps and smaller range. I might consider
one for the Moulton---its original Suntour shifters has remained in
friction mode 'cause the indexed never worked properly, and the shifting
on it really sucks. But the price would be hard to justify. I'd
presumably be stuck with a chain tensioner.


The 'big' 13% steps is a 'problem' for road use. Rohloff is meant for ATB
use or loaded touring were the gear range is necessary and the big steps
less important. My road bikes have derailleur system except the
winterbike where maintenance/reliability is more important.

Lou


Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.

--
JS
Ads
  #72  
Old April 12th 15, 12:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,422
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On Sunday, April 12, 2015 at 9:22:45 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:
Lou Holtman @ wrote:
Joe Riel schreef op 12-4-2015 om 5:28:
James writes:

On 11/04/15 18:05, Lou Holtman wrote:

Hey Jay I'm not saying that anyone, Amaricans or Europians, should spend
whatever a Rohloff hub costs. I was wondering why you see more Rohloff
hubs in Europe on normal bikes (I count 5 or 6 in the bike parking at
work just on utility bikes) than in the USA. Ride whatever you like, or
can affort. I will only respond if the arguments to not buy a Rohloff
hub or an other IGH are not correct such as drag, complexity or weight etc.


Last I checked, the weight of a Rohloff hub was quite a bit more than
a rear hub with a cassette, front and rear derailleur and one
chainring. Did I not add up the weight of components correctly?

Besides the price, the wide range and rather coarse steps is a bit
off-putting. My normal road bike has a gear range (highest/lowest)
under 3, the Moulton's is 3.3. The Rohloff's range is over 5. I'd
prefer something with finer steps and smaller range. I might consider
one for the Moulton---its original Suntour shifters has remained in
friction mode 'cause the indexed never worked properly, and the shifting
on it really sucks. But the price would be hard to justify. I'd
presumably be stuck with a chain tensioner.


The 'big' 13% steps is a 'problem' for road use. Rohloff is meant for ATB
use or loaded touring were the gear range is necessary and the big steps
less important. My road bikes have derailleur system except the
winterbike where maintenance/reliability is more important.

Lou


Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.

--
JS


Barone needn't wreck the advantages of the Rohloff to get close-coupled gear steps on a Rohloff installation. He can fit Florian Schlumpff's two speed bottom bracket gearbox, and then still have all the Rolloff advantages, including the capability and advantages of a totally enclosed chain by fitting a Chainglider (which is the subject of this thread -- see first post).

Andre Jute
  #73  
Old April 12th 15, 02:03 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,374
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

so post links describing the Rollo's innards ?

  #74  
Old April 12th 15, 03:25 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On 4/12/2015 4:22 AM, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:


Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.


That's a popular setup with Bike Friday folding bikes. See "What is the
SRAM 3x9 Dual Drive? " at https://www.bikefriday.com/bicycles/faqs/

(However, our Fridays have more conventional gears: front triple
cranks, 9 speed rear derailleurs.)


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #75  
Old April 12th 15, 04:49 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 321
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

Andre Jute wrote:
On Sunday, April 12, 2015 at 9:22:45 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:
Lou Holtman @ wrote:
Joe Riel schreef op 12-4-2015 om 5:28:
James writes:

On 11/04/15 18:05, Lou Holtman wrote:

Hey Jay I'm not saying that anyone, Amaricans or Europians, should spend
whatever a Rohloff hub costs. I was wondering why you see more Rohloff
hubs in Europe on normal bikes (I count 5 or 6 in the bike parking at
work just on utility bikes) than in the USA. Ride whatever you like, or
can affort. I will only respond if the arguments to not buy a Rohloff
hub or an other IGH are not correct such as drag, complexity or weight etc.


Last I checked, the weight of a Rohloff hub was quite a bit more than
a rear hub with a cassette, front and rear derailleur and one
chainring. Did I not add up the weight of components correctly?

Besides the price, the wide range and rather coarse steps is a bit
off-putting. My normal road bike has a gear range (highest/lowest)
under 3, the Moulton's is 3.3. The Rohloff's range is over 5. I'd
prefer something with finer steps and smaller range. I might consider
one for the Moulton---its original Suntour shifters has remained in
friction mode 'cause the indexed never worked properly, and the shifting
on it really sucks. But the price would be hard to justify. I'd
presumably be stuck with a chain tensioner.


The 'big' 13% steps is a 'problem' for road use. Rohloff is meant for ATB
use or loaded touring were the gear range is necessary and the big steps
less important. My road bikes have derailleur system except the
winterbike where maintenance/reliability is more important.

Lou

Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.

--
JS


Barone needn't wreck the advantages of the Rohloff to get close-coupled
gear steps on a Rohloff installation. He can fit Florian Schlumpff's two
speed bottom bracket gearbox, and then still have all the Rolloff
advantages, including the capability and advantages of a totally enclosed
chain by fitting a Chainglider (which is the subject of this thread -- see first post).

Andre Jute


Except the Schlumpf comes with either a 1.65:1 or 2.5:1 ratio. To "fill in
the holes" on a Rohloff, you would be looking either for a 1:08.1 or two
1.04:1 ratios. Now it may be that the Schlumpf actually splits a ratio
further up in the box, but then you're back to that annoying "up one on
this shifter and down four on the other" that so confuses people with
derailleurs.

PS: Thread drift happens. Live with it.
  #76  
Old April 12th 15, 09:32 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,422
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On Sunday, April 12, 2015 at 4:28:55 AM UTC+1, JoeRiel wrote:
James writes:

On 11/04/15 18:05, Lou Holtman wrote:

Hey Jay I'm not saying that anyone, Amaricans or Europians, should spend
whatever a Rohloff hub costs. I was wondering why you see more Rohloff
hubs in Europe on normal bikes (I count 5 or 6 in the bike parking at
work just on utility bikes) than in the USA. Ride whatever you like, or
can affort. I will only respond if the arguments to not buy a Rohloff
hub or an other IGH are not correct such as drag, complexity or weight etc.


Last I checked, the weight of a Rohloff hub was quite a bit more than
a rear hub with a cassette, front and rear derailleur and one
chainring. Did I not add up the weight of components correctly?


Besides the price, the wide range and rather coarse steps is a bit
off-putting. My normal road bike has a gear range (highest/lowest)
under 3, the Moulton's is 3.3. The Rohloff's range is over 5. I'd
prefer something with finer steps and smaller range. I might consider
one for the Moulton---its original Suntour shifters has remained in
friction mode 'cause the indexed never worked properly, and the shifting
on it really sucks. But the price would be hard to justify. I'd
presumably be stuck with a chain tensioner.

--
Joe Riel


If the Rohloff had less range, the roadies would whine that it doesn't have enough range. But if you consider a big range a disadvantage, there are the Shimano 8-speeds with a range around 300%, which I found quite adequate even in my hilly terrain until I moved up a particularly steep hill. I have tables for gear-inch developments in the Shimano's gears, and speeds, for various chainring/sprocket/cadence combos, if you are really interested, and can publish them; just ask. Samples for Rohloff are he http://coolmainpress.com/BICYCLINGHebieChainglider.html

Andre Jute
  #77  
Old April 12th 15, 10:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Andre Jute[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,422
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On Sunday, April 12, 2015 at 4:49:12 PM UTC+1, Ralph Barone wrote:
Andre Jute wrote:
On Sunday, April 12, 2015 at 9:22:45 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:
Lou Holtman @ wrote:
Joe Riel schreef op 12-4-2015 om 5:28:
James writes:

On 11/04/15 18:05, Lou Holtman wrote:

Hey Jay I'm not saying that anyone, Amaricans or Europians, should spend
whatever a Rohloff hub costs. I was wondering why you see more Rohloff
hubs in Europe on normal bikes (I count 5 or 6 in the bike parking at
work just on utility bikes) than in the USA. Ride whatever you like, or
can affort. I will only respond if the arguments to not buy a Rohloff
hub or an other IGH are not correct such as drag, complexity or weight etc.


Last I checked, the weight of a Rohloff hub was quite a bit more than
a rear hub with a cassette, front and rear derailleur and one
chainring. Did I not add up the weight of components correctly?

Besides the price, the wide range and rather coarse steps is a bit
off-putting. My normal road bike has a gear range (highest/lowest)
under 3, the Moulton's is 3.3. The Rohloff's range is over 5. I'd
prefer something with finer steps and smaller range. I might consider
one for the Moulton---its original Suntour shifters has remained in
friction mode 'cause the indexed never worked properly, and the shifting
on it really sucks. But the price would be hard to justify. I'd
presumably be stuck with a chain tensioner.


The 'big' 13% steps is a 'problem' for road use. Rohloff is meant for ATB
use or loaded touring were the gear range is necessary and the big steps
less important. My road bikes have derailleur system except the
winterbike where maintenance/reliability is more important.

Lou

Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.

--
JS


Barone needn't wreck the advantages of the Rohloff to get close-coupled
gear steps on a Rohloff installation. He can fit Florian Schlumpff's two
speed bottom bracket gearbox, and then still have all the Rolloff
advantages, including the capability and advantages of a totally enclosed
chain by fitting a Chainglider (which is the subject of this thread -- see first post).

Andre Jute


Except the Schlumpf comes with either a 1.65:1 or 2.5:1 ratio. To "fill in
the holes" on a Rohloff, you would be looking either for a 1:08.1 or two
1.04:1 ratios. Now it may be that the Schlumpf actually splits a ratio
further up in the box, but then you're back to that annoying "up one on
this shifter and down four on the other" that so confuses people with
derailleurs.


A few people use double chainrings and front derailleurs with Rohloff HGB; they think it's the bee's knees.

To be fair, the drop handlebar crowd among the tourers do occasionally mention that they would like narrower brackets at the top of the Rohloff range; they're generally guys with road racing backgrounds.

PS: Thread drift happens. Live with it.


A chain that goes 3500 miles without any cleaning or lubrication added is a genuine technical advance, and it seems likely to hit my arbitrary target of 4506km, but you guys want to talk about a gearbox I've had for six or eight years, and that Chalo had for several more years, and that Sheldon had long ago, that you could have asked Lou about for years and years, and that Pete Creswell and I have discussed here before without anyone else showing much interest? Weird, if you ask me, and more than a little behind the wave. You guys had better not take up surfing when you retire...

Andre Jute
  #78  
Old April 13th 15, 01:53 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 606
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

On Sun, 12 Apr 2015 10:25:39 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 4/12/2015 4:22 AM, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:


Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.


That's a popular setup with Bike Friday folding bikes. See "What is the
SRAM 3x9 Dual Drive? " at https://www.bikefriday.com/bicycles/faqs/

(However, our Fridays have more conventional gears: front triple
cranks, 9 speed rear derailleurs.)


Or use a two or three chain rings and shift the front, which would be
a relatively easy modification.

A 50-16, for example, gives a 84.38 gear inches while a 49-16 ration
is 82.69 which is less then a shift from a 16 to 17 tooth cassette cog
which is from 84.38 to 79.41.

--
Cheers,

John B.
  #79  
Old April 13th 15, 02:25 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,374
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

MERELY a curiosity

https://www.google.com/#q=ROHLOFF+BI...R+HUB&tbm=shop

as for the chain guard what is real is chain cleaning and lubing is necessary o matter what Jute sez.

but the Hebe works only with an internal hub.

anyway...what's the use able temp range for a Rollo ? run Madison in January ?

  #80  
Old April 13th 15, 04:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 321
Default Inside a Chainglider after 3500km with zero chain maintenance

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 12 Apr 2015 10:25:39 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 4/12/2015 4:22 AM, James wrote:
On 12/04/15 16:26, Ralph Barone wrote:


Could you squeeze a 2 gear cluster onto a Rohloff hub? A 17-16 with a
derailleur would split the Rohloff ratios quite nicely (admittedly, by
throwing away the one main advantage of the hub).


You can get SA IGH that takes a cassette. You can then effectively do
away with the triple chainring and front derailleur.


That's a popular setup with Bike Friday folding bikes. See "What is the
SRAM 3x9 Dual Drive? " at https://www.bikefriday.com/bicycles/faqs/

(However, our Fridays have more conventional gears: front triple
cranks, 9 speed rear derailleurs.)


Or use a two or three chain rings and shift the front, which would be
a relatively easy modification.

A 50-16, for example, gives a 84.38 gear inches while a 49-16 ration
is 82.69 which is less then a shift from a 16 to 17 tooth cassette cog
which is from 84.38 to 79.41.



That's probably the easiest way to split the ratios on a Rohloff, but rear
derailleurs shift better than the front ones, so I was just exploring the
idea space.
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Factory lube/chaincase experiment (X8 chain, Chainglider chain case,Surly SS & Rohloff gears) Andre Jute[_2_] Techniques 15 July 14th 13 08:07 PM
4605km from one chain: KMC X8 and Hebie Chainglider does the business Andre Jute[_2_] Techniques 26 June 19th 11 04:54 PM
Chain rub on inside of Front Derailleur [email protected] Techniques 5 July 3rd 06 01:46 PM
Front Derailleur problems (chain falls off inside) Post to newsgroup General 11 October 25th 03 03:18 AM
Front Derailleur problems (chain falls off inside) Post to newsgroup Techniques 1 October 23rd 03 08:23 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 CycleBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.