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#11
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Tom Kunich is [an] ass
David Damerell writes:
Quoting : Michael Press writes: No, changing the subject header does not change alter the threading. Speak for your own news reader. Tin, the UNIX threaded news reader that I use, keeps threads by title No; you are misusing the term "thread". A "thread" is a group of articles associated because of Message-IDs and References lines. What tin does is group-by-Subject, which is inferior to true threading. The answer is to get a newsreader which functions correctly. Given that Jobst uses Emacs, he's got a great option in Gnus right on his computer (M-x gnus). The current version is 5.10.6, I think; the CVS version is 5.11. All he has to do is set up his .gnus config file and he is in business. There are some great e-mail client options as well. |
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#12
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Tom Kunich is [an] ass
Jobst Brandt wrote: Tom Sherman writes: ....By the way, changing the title loses the thread and starts a new one, which is also none too good for tracking where the discussion arose.... I will remind you of this thread: http://tinyurl.com/d4tky Note who changed the thread title. I missed that entirely as my spell checker offered AOL for the misspelled word OL. Apparently I changed that inadvertently. The new version of my spell checker no longer offers AOL as the first replacement choice for OL. I make enough typos that I usually spell check the item which then starts at the top of the page. I am disappointed. I thought it was a clever bit of intentional humor. -- Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley |
#13
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Changing the title does WHAT? (Was: who cares.)
In article ,
Werehatrack wrote: On Wed, 28 Dec 2005 06:07:44 GMT, "Nuckin' Futz" wrote: wrote: ... By the way, changing the title loses the thread and starts a new one No it doesn't. With the majority of the various newsreaders I have used, the behavior reported by Jobst is what takes place. While there are newsreaders which thread only by the references and which display the subject breakages (or don't, in at least one particularly antimemorable case), the most popular neewsreaders do not, in fact, do this. As a result, on the whole, Jobst's observation is accurate; for most readers, changing the subject breaks the thread. Whether this is a Good Thing, a Bad Thing, a Stupid Misfeature, a Matter Of Preference, an Inconsequential Piece Of Minutiae, or Grounds For A Flame Jihad is, of course, something that has been debated endlessly...but given the behavior of the most commonly used readers, it appears that the thread-by-reference side can't claim a victory just yet. Most news readers _can_ thread using the References header and the Message-ID header. Sometimes setting the configuration is daunting. As I said elsewhere, Tin can be so configured. -- Michael Press |
#14
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Tom Kunich is [an] ass
Michael Press:
David Damerell wrote: What tin does is group-by-Subject, which is inferior to true threading. The answer is to get a newsreader which functions correctly. That is what Tin does by default, but Tin can sort by references. Aha! I'm glad that's fixed. 2 References, thread on ''References:'' only. 3 Both Subject and References, thread on ''References:'' then ''Subject:'' (default). So I think option 2 is the right thing here. Presumably what #3 does is to group by Subject but use References: correctly within sets of articles with a common Subject line, like Google Groups. -- David Damerell Distortion Field! Today is Second Brieday, December. |
#15
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Changing the title does WHAT? (Was: who cares.)
Quoting Werehatrack :
the most popular neewsreaders do not, in fact, do this. As a result, on the whole, Jobst's observation is accurate; for most readers, changing the subject breaks the thread. No. What a "thread" is is not dependent on the observer's newsreader; it's a property of the articles. That is the only way we can use the term meaningfully. That many popular newsreaders are broken is unfortunate, but really, it's up to them to fix it. -- David Damerell Distortion Field! Today is Second Brieday, December. |
#16
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Changing the title does WHAT?
The following is what Tin thinks a thread is and Tin is a lot older
than most newsreaders used by most participants in thei forum. The term "thread" as in T-I-N "Threaded Internet News" http://www.tin.org/ http://www.informatik.uni-hamburg.de...faq.html#ToC02 ================================================== ========================= Thu, 29 Dec 2005 10:38:16 rec.bicycles.tech Thread 7 of 16 Lines 14 Changing the title does WHAT? (... RespNo 3 of 3 David Damerell at Linux Unlimited Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech Quoting Werehatrack : the most popular neewsreaders do not, in fact, do this. As a result, on the whole, Jobst's observation is accurate; for most readers, changing the subject breaks the thread. No. What a "thread" is is not dependent on the observer's newsreader; it's a property of the articles. That is the only way we can use the term meaningfully. That many popular newsreaders are broken is unfortunate, but really, it's up to them to fix it. -- David Damerell Distortion Field! Today is Second Brieday, December. ================================================== ========================= Jobst Brandt |
#17
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Changing the title does WHAT?
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#18
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Changing the title does WHAT? (Was: who cares.)
In article ,
David Damerell wrote: Quoting Werehatrack : the most popular neewsreaders do not, in fact, do this. As a result, on the whole, Jobst's observation is accurate; for most readers, changing the subject breaks the thread. No. What a "thread" is is not dependent on the observer's newsreader; it's a property of the articles. That is the only way we can use the term meaningfully. That many popular newsreaders are broken is unfortunate, but really, it's up to them to fix it. Do you know that most news readers cannot organize article headers according to the References headers? Which ones? I have used Netscape, Tin, and Newswatcher; these three can. -- Michael Press |
#20
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Changing the title does WHAT? (Was: who cares.)
On Wed, 28 Dec 2005 20:24:24 GMT, Werehatrack
wrote: With the majority of the various newsreaders I have used, the behavior reported by Jobst is what takes place. While there are newsreaders which thread only by the references and which display the subject breakages (or don't, in at least one particularly antimemorable case), the most popular neewsreaders do not, in fact, do this. As a result, on the whole, Jobst's observation is accurate; for most readers, changing the subject breaks the thread. Mine actually has an option, I can thread by Reference or by SUbject, but I greatly prefer to do so by Subject. Jasper |
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