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#1
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However,
now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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#2
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On 3/20/2018 10:57 AM, Joerg wrote:
The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? Well, my favorite map is a map. I'm lucky that AAA issues a special "Northeast Ohio" map. It's at a relatively large scale (1" = 3.5 miles or so) and shows almost all roads, down to the gravel lanes in Amish country to the north. I've also got two ancient sets of the bicycle maps put out by the state back in the 1980s. These are on waterproof paper and show a recommended road every five miles or so, sort of a rough grid of recommendations for touring cyclists. I knew the DOT official in charge of generating these maps back then. She just hired college students for the summer and had them search data bases showing traffic count and road width for paved roads. IOW there was little or no on-the-ground testing; but I've found they still work pretty well. I have collections of county maps. If I'm heading out on a long ride, I'll throw the appropriate ones into my bike bag. The three above maps cover most of my long-distance day ride explorations. I led a team that produced a bike map for our two county area. We did do a lot of on-the-road ride testing. The idea was to rate the well-known or major roads, and to hopefully find nice "beginner" streets and roads on a roughly one mile grid. I sometimes throw that in my bike bag for rides to unfamiliar parts of the city. A few years ago, I planned a cross-Ohio tour for my wife and I plus a friend by using one of these books: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/575993 It worked well. I've also referred to USGS maps to plan rides and tours. The 1:24000 series is so detailed it shows individual buildings in less dense areas. It also shows things like fence lines, railroads, etc. and are quite beautiful, IMO. I have four of them that cover territory surrounding our house mounted on a wall for reference or inspiration for local rides. And I've used the 1:250,000 series to choose roads for rides out of the area. I appreciate the contour information, especially if I'm going to try a long ride into a hilly area, like to Pittsburgh. Trouble is, I think USGS maps are no longer available in paper. I treasure the ones I have. If you're setting out on a long tour, the Adventure Cycling maps are good, as long as you're willing to stick to their routes. We ran into complications on one tour when we deviated from the route and had a hard time finding anything more detailed than a state map. Of course, I'm talking about riding on (shudder!) roads! With CARS!! ;-) I'm lucky to live in a part of the country that was settled long before there were cars. Because of that, we have a wonderful network of country roads. And I'm pretty good at telling, from a map, which roads will have less traffic (which I prefer). I also use clues like streams and railroads to find less hilly routes (which I also prefer). -- - Frank Krygowski |
#3
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On 2018-03-20 10:24, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 3/20/2018 10:57 AM, Joerg wrote: The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? Well, my favorite map is a map. I'm lucky that AAA issues a special "Northeast Ohio" map. It's at a relatively large scale (1" = 3.5 miles or so) and shows almost all roads, down to the gravel lanes in Amish country to the north. I've also got two ancient sets of the bicycle maps put out by the state back in the 1980s. These are on waterproof paper and show a recommended road every five miles or so, sort of a rough grid of recommendations for touring cyclists. I knew the DOT official in charge of generating these maps back then. She just hired college students for the summer and had them search data bases showing traffic count and road width for paved roads. IOW there was little or no on-the-ground testing; but I've found they still work pretty well. I have collections of county maps. If I'm heading out on a long ride, I'll throw the appropriate ones into my bike bag. The three above maps cover most of my long-distance day ride explorations. I led a team that produced a bike map for our two county area. We did do a lot of on-the-road ride testing. The idea was to rate the well-known or major roads, and to hopefully find nice "beginner" streets and roads on a roughly one mile grid. I sometimes throw that in my bike bag for rides to unfamiliar parts of the city. A few years ago, I planned a cross-Ohio tour for my wife and I plus a friend by using one of these books: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/575993 It worked well. I've also referred to USGS maps to plan rides and tours. The 1:24000 series is so detailed it shows individual buildings in less dense areas. It also shows things like fence lines, railroads, etc. and are quite beautiful, IMO. I have four of them that cover territory surrounding our house mounted on a wall for reference or inspiration for local rides. And I've used the 1:250,000 series to choose roads for rides out of the area. I appreciate the contour information, especially if I'm going to try a long ride into a hilly area, like to Pittsburgh. Trouble is, I think USGS maps are no longer available in paper. I treasure the ones I have. If you're setting out on a long tour, the Adventure Cycling maps are good, as long as you're willing to stick to their routes. We ran into complications on one tour when we deviated from the route and had a hard time finding anything more detailed than a state map. Of course, I'm talking about riding on (shudder!) roads! With CARS!! ;-) Or course, I do not want maps where many bike paths and most of all singletrack routes are missing. I'm lucky to live in a part of the country that was settled long before there were cars. Because of that, we have a wonderful network of country roads. And I'm pretty good at telling, from a map, which roads will have less traffic (which I prefer). I also use clues like streams and railroads to find less hilly routes (which I also prefer). Here in the Wild West you need to sometimes use satellite view to find hidden gems among the trails, especially in the true wilderness. That's a bit tough with paper maps. Also, I'd like to occasionally zoom in and find out what's cooking at a particular location. That way I found more gems such as this: https://s3-media4.fl.yelpcdn.com/bph...4GsFBSCA/o.jpg I had no clue that there was a brewery with tap room almost on the El Dorado Trail (singletrack). These guys don't advertize much. One day I was looking for connector roads I could use up there and a "Brewery" tab showed up ... WHAT?! ... zoomed in some more ... Yeehaw! -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#4
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On 3/20/2018 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-20 10:24, Frank Krygowski wrote: On 3/20/2018 10:57 AM, Joerg wrote: The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? Well, my favorite map is a map. I'm lucky that AAA issues a special "Northeast Ohio" map. It's at a relatively large scale (1" = 3.5 miles or so) and shows almost all roads, down to the gravel lanes in Amish country to the north. I've also got two ancient sets of the bicycle maps put out by the state back in the 1980s. These are on waterproof paper and show a recommended road every five miles or so, sort of a rough grid of recommendations for touring cyclists. I knew the DOT official in charge of generating these maps back then. She just hired college students for the summer and had them search data bases showing traffic count and road width for paved roads. IOW there was little or no on-the-ground testing; but I've found they still work pretty well. I have collections of county maps. If I'm heading out on a long ride, I'll throw the appropriate ones into my bike bag. The three above maps cover most of my long-distance day ride explorations. I led a team that produced a bike map for our two county area. We did do a lot of on-the-road ride testing. The idea was to rate the well-known or major roads, and to hopefully find nice "beginner" streets and roads on a roughly one mile grid. I sometimes throw that in my bike bag for rides to unfamiliar parts of the city. A few years ago, I planned a cross-Ohio tour for my wife and I plus a friend by using one of these books: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/575993Â* It worked well. I've also referred to USGS maps to plan rides and tours. The 1:24000 series is so detailed it shows individual buildings in less dense areas. It also shows things like fence lines, railroads, etc. and are quite beautiful, IMO. I have four of them that cover territory surrounding our house mounted on a wall for reference or inspiration for local rides. And I've used the 1:250,000 series to choose roads for rides out of the area. I appreciate the contour information, especially if I'm going to try a long ride into a hilly area, like to Pittsburgh. Trouble is, I think USGS maps are no longer available in paper. I treasure the ones I have. If you're setting out on a long tour, the Adventure Cycling maps are good, as long as you're willing to stick to their routes. We ran into complications on one tour when we deviated from the route and had a hard time finding anything more detailed than a state map. Of course, I'm talking about riding on (shudder!) roads! With CARS!! ;-) Or course, I do not want maps where many bike paths and most of all singletrack routes are missing. I'm lucky to live in a part of the country that was settled long before there were cars. Because of that, we have a wonderful network of country roads. And I'm pretty good at telling, from a map, which roads will have less traffic (which I prefer). I also use clues like streams and railroads to find less hilly routes (which I also prefer). Here in the Wild West you need to sometimes use satellite view to find hidden gems among the trails, especially in the true wilderness. That's a bit tough with paper maps. Also, I'd like to occasionally zoom in and find out what's cooking at a particular location. That way I found more gems such as this: https://s3-media4.fl.yelpcdn.com/bph...4GsFBSCA/o.jpg I had no clue that there was a brewery with tap room almost on the El Dorado Trail (singletrack). These guys don't advertize much. One day I was looking for connector roads I could use up there and a "Brewery" tab showed up ... WHAT?! ... zoomed in some more ... Yeehaw! Well, I'm not surprised my advice wouldn't work for you. -- - Frank Krygowski |
#5
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 07:57:02 -0700, Joerg
wrote: The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. True. Google maps are sent as "tiles" which have all the text imbedded in the image. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. I haven't checked but is Open Cycle Map any different or better? https://www.opencyclemap.org Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? How about these? http://www.eldoradobikemap.com/applications/10/embed#10/38.7471/-120.5873 https://www.traillink.com/trail/el-dorado-trail/ -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#6
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On 2018-03-20 16:22, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 07:57:02 -0700, Joerg wrote: The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. True. Google maps are sent as "tiles" which have all the text imbedded in the image. That means they really botched it. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. I haven't checked but is Open Cycle Map any different or better? https://www.opencyclemap.org Same, the whole El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. It is an official trail, with signs and all. Also, when I keed in "USA" it didn't find it, had to scroll across the ocean. It started out above the UK so maybe they still see us as a colony :-) Mapquest isn't great either anymore. It auto-fills nonsensical stuff into the search field and so on. Those among you not using GPS, what do thee consult for cycling maps outside these three main ones? How about these? http://www.eldoradobikemap.com/applications/10/embed#10/38.7471/-120.5873 That is a little better but lacks descriptors such as trail names. It has the El Dorado Trail so people would probably find it with that. On the American River South Fork Trail people would get lost near Magnolia and Cronan Ranch though because you really need to know the trail names there. https://www.traillink.com/trail/el-dorado-trail/ Requires registration, password and all that. Why do people do this? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#7
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 16:56:55 -0700, Joerg
wrote: https://www.traillink.com/trail/el-dorado-trail/ Requires registration, password and all that. Why do people do this? For money, of course. I just tried Bing maps. No trails. This one requires registration but no fees: https://www.alltrails.com/trail/us/california/el-dorado-trail-from-smithflat Yet another: http://eldoradotrail.com/trail-map/ Do you want a map for Windoze or for Android? -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#8
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 17:34:25 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote: If you have a Garmin map display thing: https://www.gpsfiledepot.com/maps/view/696/ https://www.gpsfiledepot.com/maps/view/53 https://www.gpsfiledepot.com/maps/state/ca -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#9
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
Jeff Liebermann writes:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 07:57:02 -0700, Joerg wrote: The only Google service I used until recently was Googe maps. However, now they have made the font so small that it has become almost unreadable and to me, therefore, useless on any of my computers. From what I read in online searches that cannot be corrected by the user because it is supposedly rendered as graphics. True. Google maps are sent as "tiles" which have all the text imbedded in the image. Open Street Map is lacking a lot of information. For example, the whole long El Dorado Trail singletrack is missing. Yeah, one can edit that as a user but I don't want to re-invent the wheel. I haven't checked but is Open Cycle Map any different or better? https://www.opencyclemap.org I just took a look at my neighborhood. It looks just like the cycling layer in openstreetmap, and has the same problem: no highway numbers. Many of the numbered state highways here are perfectly reasonable for cycling, being cobbled together out of surface streets. The street names tend to change frequently, so highway numbers are quite helpful for navigation. The limited access freeways are not at all suitable for cycling, but they are still some of the most reliable landmarks available. |
#10
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Better map service for cycling than Google Maps?
On 2018-03-20 17:34, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018 16:56:55 -0700, Joerg wrote: https://www.traillink.com/trail/el-dorado-trail/ Requires registration, password and all that. Why do people do this? For money, of course. I just tried Bing maps. No trails. This one requires registration but no fees: https://www.alltrails.com/trail/us/california/el-dorado-trail-from-smithflat Yet another: http://eldoradotrail.com/trail-map/ Same thing, just a few dashed brown lines without any trail names. It's ok to find a general area where trails are but not for orientation. Do you want a map for Windoze or for Android? Windows. I don't have a smart phone yet because I don't see much use for it. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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