Braze on v Band on Downtube shifters

Since I can use a 8 from 9 speed cassette on my tourer with 9 speed shifters
my next question, which I shall check out for myself soon, is this.

Can the band on band-on shifters (Shimano 105 6 speed) be used to mount
braze-on downtube shifters on a frame with no braze-ons ? Can the band be
used to mount downtube cable stops should I decide to use STi or bar end
shifters ?

As an aside, why can't one simply change the SIS piece in downtube levers to
convert them from one set of speeds to another ? Looking at the exploded
diagrams in Shimano.com, there is a small ratchet type component in a lever
which maybe ought to be exchangable for a higher (or lower) number of speed
one. Maybe I'll give this a shot too.

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MSeries wrote:
Since I can use a 8 from 9 speed cassette on my tourer with 9 speed
shifters my next question, which I shall check out for myself soon,
is this.

Can the band on band-on shifters (Shimano 105 6 speed) be used to
mount braze-on downtube shifters on a frame with no braze-ons ?

Not sure but I think they probably can. Longer bolts may help if the
fit's not too good.

Can
the band be used to mount downtube cable stops should I decide to use
STi or bar end shifters

Yes. I'm doing precisely that with a 105 6sp band-on bit with Campag
stops (on my 1984/5 Raleigh Royal*!) - and I expect Shimano stops would
also fit (but Campag's can be used with Shimano STI if not). I ain't ever
going back to down tubies!

As an aside, why can't one simply change the SIS piece in downtube
levers to convert them from one set of speeds to another ? Looking at
the exploded diagrams in Shimano.com, there is a small ratchet type
component in a lever which maybe ought to be exchangable for a higher
(or lower) number of speed one. Maybe I'll give this a shot too.

I'm not sure about that (give it a go), but the 6sp levers can be used
with more speeds, as they are, simply by shifting the lever down beyond
the 1st position - so you'll have six indexed gears and the rest friction.
Trouble is, the index will be wrong for 9sp-spacing; might be ok for 8sp.

* I'm enjoying riding this bike a lot at the moment: completely rebuilt
with Campag 9sp triple and 700c wheels, etc; only original component is
the rear brake caliper. At long last all my upgrades and adjustments have
come together and it's a practical and reasonably comfortably bike. Not
fast, but I only notice this when looking at the speedo up hills or trying
to overtake cars! :-)

~PB

MSeries wrote:
Since I can use a 8 from 9 speed cassette on my tourer with 9 speed
shifters my next question, which I shall check out for myself soon,
is this.

Can the band on band-on shifters (Shimano 105 6 speed) be used to
mount braze-on downtube shifters on a frame with no braze-ons ?

Not sure but I think they probably can. Longer bolts may help if the
fit's not too good.

Can
the band be used to mount downtube cable stops should I decide to use
STi or bar end shifters

Yes. I'm doing precisely that with a 105 6sp band-on bit with Campag
stops (on my 1984/5 Raleigh Royal*!) - and I expect Shimano stops would
also fit (but Campag's can be used with Shimano STI if not). I ain't ever
going back to down tubies!

As an aside, why can't one simply change the SIS piece in downtube
levers to convert them from one set of speeds to another ? Looking at
the exploded diagrams in Shimano.com, there is a small ratchet type
component in a lever which maybe ought to be exchangable for a higher
(or lower) number of speed one. Maybe I'll give this a shot too.

I'm not sure about that (give it a go), but the 6sp levers can be used
with more speeds, as they are, simply by shifting the lever down beyond
the 1st position - so you'll have six indexed gears and the rest friction.
Trouble is, the index will be wrong for 9sp-spacing; might be ok for 8sp.

* I'm enjoying riding this bike a lot at the moment: completely rebuilt
with Campag 9sp triple and 700c wheels, etc; only original component is
the rear brake caliper. At long last all my upgrades and adjustments have
come together and it's a practical and reasonably comfortably bike. Not
fast, but I only notice this when looking at the speedo up hills or trying
to overtake cars! :-)

~PB

Pete Biggs wrote:
MSeries wrote:
Since I can use a 8 from 9 speed cassette on my tourer with 9 speed
shifters my next question, which I shall check out for myself soon,
is this.

Can the band on band-on shifters (Shimano 105 6 speed) be used to
mount braze-on downtube shifters on a frame with no braze-ons ?

Not sure but I think they probably can. Longer bolts may help if the
fit's not too good.

Can
the band be used to mount downtube cable stops should I decide to use
STi or bar end shifters

Yes. I'm doing precisely that with a 105 6sp band-on bit with Campag
stops (on my 1984/5 Raleigh Royal*!) - and I expect Shimano stops
would also fit (but Campag's can be used with Shimano STI if not). I
ain't ever going back to down tubies!

As an aside, why can't one simply change the SIS piece in downtube
levers to convert them from one set of speeds to another ? Looking at
the exploded diagrams in Shimano.com, there is a small ratchet type
component in a lever which maybe ought to be exchangable for a higher
(or lower) number of speed one. Maybe I'll give this a shot too.

I'm not sure about that (give it a go), but the 6sp levers can be used
with more speeds, as they are, simply by shifting the lever down
beyond the 1st position - so you'll have six indexed gears and the
rest friction. Trouble is, the index will be wrong for 9sp-spacing;
might be ok for 8sp.


* I'm enjoying riding this bike a lot at the moment: completely
rebuilt with Campag 9sp triple and 700c wheels, etc; only original
component is the rear brake caliper. At long last all my upgrades
and adjustments have come together and it's a practical and
reasonably comfortably bike. Not fast, but I only notice this when
looking at the speedo up hills or trying to overtake cars! :-)

~PB

Gives me encouragement Pete. I was hoping to keep with DT levers to keep the
cost of the upgrade down so I was looking at Dura Ace 9 Levers. If I
couldn't make them fit on the band then maybe bar end or STi, then of course
I'd need the stops.

My Royal has original bars, brakes, stem, seat pin, chainset, mudguards,
forks. It has the original brake levers at present but I have some new (2nd
user) aero ones to fit. Until last night had the original BB too. The paint
work is in poor state but I love the double lining and it would cost a
fortune to get it redone like that. Wheels are 700c, Deore hubs, Mavic Mach
3 CD rims, built at Condor Cycles. Very strong, very true after thousands of
laden miles.

I have not used this bike much in the last 10 years and I'm getting it ready
for some winter/spring rides and LeJOG next year.

I am in the process of writing my LeJOG blog describing my thoughts leading
up to my ride, the upgrade will be described in there.


--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely.

Pete Biggs wrote:
MSeries wrote:
Since I can use a 8 from 9 speed cassette on my tourer with 9 speed
shifters my next question, which I shall check out for myself soon,
is this.

Can the band on band-on shifters (Shimano 105 6 speed) be used to
mount braze-on downtube shifters on a frame with no braze-ons ?

Not sure but I think they probably can. Longer bolts may help if the
fit's not too good.

Can
the band be used to mount downtube cable stops should I decide to use
STi or bar end shifters

Yes. I'm doing precisely that with a 105 6sp band-on bit with Campag
stops (on my 1984/5 Raleigh Royal*!) - and I expect Shimano stops
would also fit (but Campag's can be used with Shimano STI if not). I
ain't ever going back to down tubies!

As an aside, why can't one simply change the SIS piece in downtube
levers to convert them from one set of speeds to another ? Looking at
the exploded diagrams in Shimano.com, there is a small ratchet type
component in a lever which maybe ought to be exchangable for a higher
(or lower) number of speed one. Maybe I'll give this a shot too.

I'm not sure about that (give it a go), but the 6sp levers can be used
with more speeds, as they are, simply by shifting the lever down
beyond the 1st position - so you'll have six indexed gears and the
rest friction. Trouble is, the index will be wrong for 9sp-spacing;
might be ok for 8sp.


* I'm enjoying riding this bike a lot at the moment: completely
rebuilt with Campag 9sp triple and 700c wheels, etc; only original
component is the rear brake caliper. At long last all my upgrades
and adjustments have come together and it's a practical and
reasonably comfortably bike. Not fast, but I only notice this when
looking at the speedo up hills or trying to overtake cars! :-)

~PB

Gives me encouragement Pete. I was hoping to keep with DT levers to keep the
cost of the upgrade down so I was looking at Dura Ace 9 Levers. If I
couldn't make them fit on the band then maybe bar end or STi, then of course
I'd need the stops.

My Royal has original bars, brakes, stem, seat pin, chainset, mudguards,
forks. It has the original brake levers at present but I have some new (2nd
user) aero ones to fit. Until last night had the original BB too. The paint
work is in poor state but I love the double lining and it would cost a
fortune to get it redone like that. Wheels are 700c, Deore hubs, Mavic Mach
3 CD rims, built at Condor Cycles. Very strong, very true after thousands of
laden miles.

I have not used this bike much in the last 10 years and I'm getting it ready
for some winter/spring rides and LeJOG next year.

I am in the process of writing my LeJOG blog describing my thoughts leading
up to my ride, the upgrade will be described in there.


--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely.

I've seen clamp-on cable stops, in case the other solution doesn't
work for you.

I'm also a little skeptical that the indexing from your 6-speed shifters
will work correctly. Do you have a friction mode available? I know the
old Suntours barcons did, but I can't remember about the Shimanos.



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bhutata wrote:
I've seen clamp-on cable stops, in case the other solution doesn't
work for you.

Incorporating cable adjusters? Don't strictly need adjusters but they
help a lot.

I'm also a little skeptical that the indexing from your 6-speed
shifters will work correctly. Do you have a friction mode available?
I know the old Suntours barcons did, but I can't remember about the
Shimanos.

At least one of the Shimano 105 6sp versions has a switchable friction
mode, but the OP may be getting 9sp levers in any case.

~PB