Derailleurs for FSA compact double and Ultegra STI

Hello,

My bike is currently setup with all Ultegra-triple (circa 2003 STI,
crank, FD, 9s cassette, and RD).

I'm planning on moving the crank, FD, and RD to a different bike. In
their place I'm installing an FSA compact double (50/34), and a new FD
and RD.

What is my best bet for the FD and RD for this setup? Of course
compatibility with 9s Ultegra STI levers is a must, and I'm planning on
using an 11-23 cassette. I've seen suggestions for the DA-7700 FD, but
I also see an FSA FD that claims to be specifically made for compact
doubles with a 16T capacity. My primary concerns are reliability and
shifting compatibility. I'm not concerned about weight.


Thanks for any suggestions,
Sam

wrote:
Hello,

My bike is currently setup with all Ultegra-triple (circa 2003 STI,
crank, FD, 9s cassette, and RD).

I'm planning on moving the crank, FD, and RD to a different bike. In
their place I'm installing an FSA compact double (50/34), and a new FD
and RD.

What is my best bet for the FD and RD for this setup? Of course
compatibility with 9s Ultegra STI levers is a must, and I'm planning on
using an 11-23 cassette. I've seen suggestions for the DA-7700 FD, but
I also see an FSA FD that claims to be specifically made for compact
doubles with a 16T capacity. My primary concerns are reliability and
shifting compatibility. I'm not concerned about weight.

6500 FD and RD or 7700/7800 RD. DO NOT use a 6600/7800(10s) FD, shorter
arms, not enough travel with 9s STI. IRD 'compact' not necessary.


Thanks for any suggestions,
Sam

On 2 Jan 2007 05:54:15 -0800, "Qui si parla Campagnolo"
wrote:


wrote:
Hello,

My bike is currently setup with all Ultegra-triple (circa 2003 STI,
crank, FD, 9s cassette, and RD).

I'm planning on moving the crank, FD, and RD to a different bike. In
their place I'm installing an FSA compact double (50/34), and a new FD
and RD.

What is my best bet for the FD and RD for this setup? Of course
compatibility with 9s Ultegra STI levers is a must, and I'm planning on
using an 11-23 cassette. I've seen suggestions for the DA-7700 FD, but
I also see an FSA FD that claims to be specifically made for compact
doubles with a 16T capacity. My primary concerns are reliability and
shifting compatibility. I'm not concerned about weight.

6500 FD and RD or 7700/7800 RD. DO NOT use a 6600/7800(10s) FD, shorter
arms, not enough travel with 9s STI. IRD 'compact' not necessary.

Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

Also, your cassette choice will give you gear ratios substantially
similar to a 12-25 with 53/39. So in that case, why go compact up
front at all?

The general idea for compact - at least my approach - is to gain at
least one lower gear over a "typical" 53/39 set up, with the sacrifice
of more 2 gear jumps in the block. Meanwhile, the 11 tooth cog saves
your high gear. So 11-25 at least would be necessary to gain one
lower gear. The problem with the gear jumps is one reason why I
switched to 10 speed when I went compact up front. I now run a
"radical" 11-28, so I can climb virtually anything seated using the
little ring, but can stay in the big ring in a larger variety of
terrain than before.

Doug Taylor wrote:
On 2 Jan 2007 05:54:15 -0800, "Qui si parla Campagnolo"
wrote:


wrote:
Hello,

My bike is currently setup with all Ultegra-triple (circa 2003 STI,
crank, FD, 9s cassette, and RD).

I'm planning on moving the crank, FD, and RD to a different bike. In
their place I'm installing an FSA compact double (50/34), and a new FD
and RD.

What is my best bet for the FD and RD for this setup? Of course
compatibility with 9s Ultegra STI levers is a must, and I'm planning on
using an 11-23 cassette. I've seen suggestions for the DA-7700 FD, but
I also see an FSA FD that claims to be specifically made for compact
doubles with a 16T capacity. My primary concerns are reliability and
shifting compatibility. I'm not concerned about weight.

6500 FD and RD or 7700/7800 RD. DO NOT use a 6600/7800(10s) FD, shorter
arms, not enough travel with 9s STI. IRD 'compact' not necessary.

Thanks for the tip regarding the 10s FD. I was wary of the 10s versions
already, because I'd read the cage was narrower to accomodate the 10s
chain.

Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

My main concern was compatibility; if the C-16 shifts fine with STI,
that does seem like the better approach.

Also, your cassette choice will give you gear ratios substantially
similar to a 12-25 with 53/39. So in that case, why go compact up
front at all?

The primary reason I'm going compact double on this bike is because an
FSA Carbon Pro is the only spare crankset I have laying around. You're
right that a 39/25 will give me nearly the same ratio as a 34/23, but I
can always swap out the cassette for a 12/27 if I find myself needing
lower gears. In addition, since I'm giving up my triple on this bike
(the recipient bike will be my touring bike, for which the triple
seemed more appropriate), I like having the option of lower gears later
on if I want them.

Thanks,
Sam

Doug Taylor wrote:
On 2 Jan 2007 05:54:15 -0800, "Qui si parla Campagnolo"
wrote:


wrote:
Hello,

My bike is currently setup with all Ultegra-triple (circa 2003 STI,
crank, FD, 9s cassette, and RD).

I'm planning on moving the crank, FD, and RD to a different bike. In
their place I'm installing an FSA compact double (50/34), and a new FD
and RD.

What is my best bet for the FD and RD for this setup? Of course
compatibility with 9s Ultegra STI levers is a must, and I'm planning on
using an 11-23 cassette. I've seen suggestions for the DA-7700 FD, but
I also see an FSA FD that claims to be specifically made for compact
doubles with a 16T capacity. My primary concerns are reliability and
shifting compatibility. I'm not concerned about weight.

6500 FD and RD or 7700/7800 RD. DO NOT use a 6600/7800(10s) FD, shorter
arms, not enough travel with 9s STI. IRD 'compact' not necessary.

Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

Because in the dozen or so I have installed, not necessary. 6500 one
works great.

Also, your cassette choice will give you gear ratios substantially
similar to a 12-25 with 53/39. So in that case, why go compact up
front at all?

Actually 50/34 and 11-23 gives a higher high and a lower low gear than
53/39-12/25 combo. Close but actually wider.

The general idea for compact - at least my approach - is to gain at
least one lower gear over a "typical" 53/39 set up, with the sacrifice
of more 2 gear jumps in the block. Meanwhile, the 11 tooth cog saves
your high gear. So 11-25 at least would be necessary to gain one
lower gear. The problem with the gear jumps is one reason why I
switched to 10 speed when I went compact up front. I now run a
"radical" 11-28, so I can climb virtually anything seated using the
little ring, but can stay in the big ring in a larger variety of
terrain than before.

On 3 Jan 2007 05:26:59 -0800, "Qui si parla Campagnolo"
wrote:



Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

Because in the dozen or so I have installed, not necessary. 6500 one
works great.

I don't own a bike shop, but my experience is quite different.
Shifting with Ultegra levers and Ultegra FD is noticeably slow and
sluggish going up from 34 to 50 now matter how cable tension or limits
are adjusted. But YMMV.

Oh, and probably no point in recommending installing a chain stopper
to avoid dropping the chain into the bottom bracket when shifting down
from 50 to 34: I'm sure you'll have a smug comeback to that as well.

Also, your cassette choice will give you gear ratios substantially
similar to a 12-25 with 53/39. So in that case, why go compact up
front at all?

Actually 50/34 and 11-23 gives a higher high and a lower low gear than
53/39-12/25 combo. Close but actually wider.

No duh. I can actually do math. I said "substantially" similar. The
differences, especially the low gears, would be hard to distinguish
unless your are some sort of princess and the pea pro, and I'm not.
YMMV again. The point of compact is LOWER gears, and combining an
11-23 with 50/34 in lieu of 12-25 with 53/39, is, I would be so bold
to assert, rather pointless.

On Wed, 03 Jan 2007 20:43:53 -0500, Doug Taylor
wrote:

Oh, and probably no point in recommending installing a chain stopper
to avoid dropping the chain into the bottom bracket when shifting down
from 50 to 34: I'm sure you'll have a smug comeback to that as well.

I ride with 51 or 50 x 38 or 39 quite a bit, and a chain stopper is
useful. Even on a well adjusted bike, frantic shifting on bumpy roads
can result in the chain falling.

Are things different with a 34?

--
JT
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Doug Taylor wrote:
On 3 Jan 2007 05:26:59 -0800, "Qui si parla Campagnolo"
wrote:



Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

Because in the dozen or so I have installed, not necessary. 6500 one
works great.

I don't own a bike shop, but my experience is quite different.
Shifting with Ultegra levers and Ultegra FD is noticeably slow and
sluggish going up from 34 to 50 now matter how cable tension or limits
are adjusted. But YMMV.

Oh, and probably no point in recommending installing a chain stopper
to avoid dropping the chain into the bottom bracket when shifting down
from 50 to 34: I'm sure you'll have a smug comeback to that as well.

What's yer problem? I'm not looking for an argument, just my
experience. OBTW-the 'standard' FD for shimano compact, which IS 50/34,
is their standard for double FD.

Also, your cassette choice will give you gear ratios substantially
similar to a 12-25 with 53/39. So in that case, why go compact up
front at all?

Actually 50/34 and 11-23 gives a higher high and a lower low gear than
53/39-12/25 combo. Close but actually wider.

No duh. I can actually do math. I said "substantially" similar. The
differences, especially the low gears, would be hard to distinguish
unless your are some sort of princess and the pea pro, and I'm not.
YMMV again. The point of compact is LOWER gears, and combining an
11-23 with 50/34 in lieu of 12-25 with 53/39, is, I would be so bold
to assert, rather pointless.

Take your pack off......

On Wed, 03 Jan 2007 20:43:53 -0500, Doug Taylor
wrote:

Compact FD not "necessary," but may work better than a Shimano 6500
with Ultegra levers. Having used all kinds of different lever/FD
combos with my 50/34 compact, I like a FSA C-16. Comparably priced,
so why not go for the compact specific?

Because in the dozen or so I have installed, not necessary. 6500 one
works great.

I don't own a bike shop, but my experience is quite different.
Shifting with Ultegra levers and Ultegra FD is noticeably slow and
sluggish going up from 34 to 50 now matter how cable tension or limits
are adjusted. But YMMV.

For any compact user (besides Peter, of course) who is interested, I
just reiterated this point once again on my own bikes.

Now both my bikes (the new good weather and the older bad weather) are
set up with FSA compact (old SLK/Octalink and new K-Force Mega Exo),
FSA C-16 front der., and Dura Ace left shifters.

Previously, only the newer bike had Dura Ace shifter + FSA C-16, and
it shifts up instantly, crisply, flawlessly.

The other bike started with Ultegra 9 speed shifter and standard
Ultegra front der., which was on the bike when it had standard
gearing. It shifted up, yes, but with hesitation, extra pedal
revolutions, extra force, frustration, etc.. I switched to the FSA
C-16 der. ($40 investment on e-bay NIB) and the shifting improved, but
not nearly to the level of the other bike. The slow and sluggish
shifting was particularly noticeable when riding rollers.

So, when I found a used 10 speed Dura Ace left shifter for sale for
$60 on e-bay, I scooped it up, and installed this evening. Voila!

Say what you will, YMMV, etc., etc. but I swear by all that is holy
and sacred that a Dura shifter kicks the Ultegra's butt all over the
map in performance, and the FSA C-16 manifestly outperforms the
Ultegra standard for the same price, and no need for a Dura Ace for
twice the price to get absolutely perfect shifting.

I don't race anymore, but those of you that do know that a finicky
front der. can be the difference between getting dropped or not.

My mere $0.02.