DT Swiss RR 1.1 rims?

Joseph Santaniello writes:

As Jobst pointed out, they only have single-wall eyelets, which
may be a valid concern.

Why? I haven't heard of problems with these rims yet. Have you?

We read reports of rims developing cracks around eyelets often on
this forum. Many riders do not recall when heavier deep-V aero
rims were rare and most good rims had sockets AND eyelets. Aero
rims showed that spokes hanging in a deep-V on a narrow thick bed
did not crack rims. Subsequently spoke sockets have vanished from
nearly all other rims and now they crack. We don't have any user
reports of durability of these or similar new rims as they become
available but there is no indication why they should be immune to
cracking, considering that they do not have thicker walls.
Besides, they are anodized which can accelerate cracking.

Me and my bike weigh about 110kg. I ride on rough roads. I will be
using 32 hole Ultegra hubs. These are to be training wheels, with
durability and comfort the two most important factors. I am looking
for a somewhat wide rim as I intend to perhaps use 24 or 25 width
tires.

Do you suppose silver non-anodized Mavic Open Pro would be a good
choice? I have also been considering going back to tubulars and
using the Mavic Reflex.

I don't know, not having any experience with these or other rims on
the market. My assessment comes from the experience I had with other
rims that had only eyelets or just washers and the reports I read
here. I still have a supply of MA-2 rims and they have sockets, use
36 spokes and do not crack.

I do not understand why rims need drain holes, having ridden for many
thousands of miles in rain with no water problems. The only water
problem I had was fortuitous in that I was crossing streams and riding
with snow on the rims before making a hard braking descent on the
Nufenen Pass in the Alps. On that descent enough steam came hissing
out around the valve stem that I thought my front tire was leaking,
when in fact it was steam from braking into hairpin turns. From this
I learned how hot rims get and how quickly they cool off... and why
tubular rim glue melts.

Jobst Brandt

Lou Holtman writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing water
from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the nipple
inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole that has
a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim fairly
easy. These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I would
like to see a picture on the web if I can.

Jobst Brandt

wrote:
Lou Holtman writes:
DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the

http://www.dtswiss.ch/index.asp?fuseaction=rims.bikedetail&id=8


like to see a picture on the web if I can.

Looks like any standard rim to me...

--
MfG/Best regards
helmut springer

wrote:
Lou Holtman writes:


DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing water
from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the nipple
inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole that has
a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim fairly
easy. These rims need drain holes.


What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I would
like to see a picture on the web if I can.

Jobst Brandt

The DT rims are conventional rims, the other...I don't know what they
call them. Advantages? Well I don't know; fashion? aerodynamics? Looks?

Look at the wheels on the Campy website for example.

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu

Helmut Springer writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the DT
Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the outside.
The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing water from
leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the nipple inside
the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole that has a
large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim fairly easy.
These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I
would like to see a picture on the web if I can.

http://www.dtswiss.ch/index.asp?fuse...ikedetail&id=8

Looks like any standard rim to me...

As he said: "The other rims have the nipple inside the rim and the
spoke enters the rim through a hole that has a large diameter allowing
the water to get in the rim fairly easy. These rims need drain
holes."

And I say again: "What is the advantage of these rims and what are
they called? I would like to see a picture on the web if I can."

Jobst Brandt

wrote:
Lou Holtman writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing water
from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the nipple
inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole that has
a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim fairly
easy. These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I would
like to see a picture on the web if I can.

Jobst Brandt

The WH-550 is the only one I have on hand that has a non-conventional
construction. Here are some pics:

http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0282.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0283.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0284.jpg

I guess the advantages a

Straight pull spokes don't have the stress issues of a bend.
The nipples inboard concentrated the weight inboard.
aero section of spokes goes all the way to the rim where they have the
greatest speed and thus drag?

The main problem is they have too few spokes, but that is a different
story.

Joseph

Lou Holtman writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing
water from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the
nipple inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole
that has a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim
fairly easy. These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I
would like to see a picture on the web if I can.

The DT rims are conventional rims, the other...

I think that was apparent from the URL of them that I posted.

I don't know what they call them. Advantages? Well I don't know;
fashion? aerodynamics? Looks?

Look at the wheels on the Campy website for example.

I already did and saw no rim cross sections shown. Those wheels, seen
from a distance, all look much alike except for spoke pattern and the
ones on the Campagnolo page seem to be mostly radial, which has no
effect on water entering the rim.

Jobst Brandt

Joseph Santaniello writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing
water from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the
nipple inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole
that has a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim
fairly easy. These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I
would like to see a picture on the web if I can.

The WH-550 is the only one I have on hand that has a non-conventional
construction. Here are some pics:

http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0282.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0283.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0284.jpg

Thanks, excellent pictures. It seems a better solution would have
been to put seals under the spoke heads. They would have helped in
preventing rotation and kept the water out.

I guess the advantages a

Straight pull spokes don't have the stress issues of a bend. The
nipples inboard concentrated the weight inboard. Aero section of
spokes goes all the way to the rim where they have the greatest
speed and thus drag?

That's if you think that this is going to improve bicycling for you.

The main problem is they have too few spokes, but that is a
different story.

Well... that goes along with the flat spokes. Does it make any
difference. I notice on the Campagnolo page that these wheels cost
many times more than the ones I ride,

Jobst Brandt

wrote:
Lou Holtman writes:


DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing
water from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the
nipple inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole
that has a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim
fairly easy. These rims need drain holes.


What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I
would like to see a picture on the web if I can.


The DT rims are conventional rims, the other...


I think that was apparent from the URL of them that I posted.


I don't know what they call them. Advantages? Well I don't know;
fashion? aerodynamics? Looks?


Look at the wheels on the Campy website for example.


I already did and saw no rim cross sections shown. Those wheels, seen
from a distance, all look much alike except for spoke pattern and the
ones on the Campagnolo page seem to be mostly radial, which has no
effect on water entering the rim.

Maybe you looked at this already,

http://www.campagnolo.com/pdf/726915...N_CL_PART2.pdf

The hole where the spoke enters the rim has a larger diameter then the
spoke itself, allowing water to enter the box section via the spokes.

Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu

wrote:
Joseph Santaniello writes:

DT Swiss RR1.1 are conventional rims with the nipples on the
outside. The are seated firmly against the eyelets preventing
water from leaking in via the spokes. The other rims have the
nipple inside the rim and the spoke enters the rim through a hole
that has a large diameter allowing the water to get in the rim
fairly easy. These rims need drain holes.

What is the advantage of these rims and what are they called? I
would like to see a picture on the web if I can.

The WH-550 is the only one I have on hand that has a non-conventional
construction. Here are some pics:

http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0282.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0283.jpg
http://www.arbitrary.org/550/IMG_0284.jpg

Thanks, excellent pictures. It seems a better solution would have
been to put seals under the spoke heads. They would have helped in
preventing rotation and kept the water out.

They do have some sort of plastic seat inside the rim, but that is sort
of beside the point. These wheels are just an example of rims with a
drainage hole. The Campy Proton is a very conventional wheel with
normal spokes, etc, yet it too has a drain hole. I don't have any on
hand for photos.

I guess the advantages a

Straight pull spokes don't have the stress issues of a bend. The
nipples inboard concentrated the weight inboard. Aero section of
spokes goes all the way to the rim where they have the greatest
speed and thus drag?

That's if you think that this is going to improve bicycling for you.

I do not, and that is why they are unused. I came across those for
free, but they are not suitable for my needs, so they are looking for a
new home.

The main problem is they have too few spokes, but that is a
different story.

Well... that goes along with the flat spokes. Does it make any
difference. I notice on the Campagnolo page that these wheels cost
many times more than the ones I ride,

Jobst Brandt

The only "Boutique" wheels I have been interested in are the Fulcrum
Racing 5 wheels. They have conventional spokes (except for 2 over size
ones opposite the rim joint supposedly to balance the wheel), a sane
spoke count, and are reasonably priced. But they don't have drain
holes!

I still do not know why I get so much water in my rims. Is it maybe my
weight seats and un-seats the nipple so much with each rotation that a
larger gap appears letting in more water? The rims I have used recently
have all collected enough water that I deem it a problem that needs a
solution. Ideally the water would not get in there in the first place,
but that is hard to ensure.

Joseph