How Do These Airborne Specs Look?

NYC XYZ:

Saddles are so personal, to borrow a phrase, "you gotta break a few eggs to
make an omelette."

I have half a dozen saddles in a wicker basket in my living room. I have a
1976 Brooks Team Pro on my one and only bike. I found the Brooks *in the
trash*

If you haven't tried a tensioned leather saddle (Brooks specifically) and
you're into "comfort" not racing, you might consider giving one a shot. I
will never go back to plastic saddles unless I get in to time trialing or
something - then I'll still probably look for a Brooks Swallow.

Download their catalog at:
http://www.brookssaddles.com/docs/catalogue_05_en.pdf
(right click and "Save As...")

See Sheldon Brown's page on saddles:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/saddles.html

For folks opinions on the Brooks:
http://www.mtbr.com/reviews/Saddle/product_22663.shtml
Note the 4.83/5.00 average rating.

Good luck.
Chris



"NYC XYZ" wrote in message
oups.com...

wrote:


There are no small charges at an lbs. They will want $30 for a stem
you can get for$10 online. LBS have crappy return policies. Order
saddles online then you can return them . Or get a Brooks B17 and be in
bliss. I wouldnt hesitate to buy a bike online.

I must say, many of the NYC LBSes don't seem to be too "caring"...maybe
they're tired of the same damned noobish concerns day after day. =)

It's true there are no small charges...fixing a flat is at least ten
bucks! (I do understand they've got more expenses, though.) The other
thing with LBSes is that you deal with "personalities"...it's not like
you go to McDonald's and just get your hamburger (LOL -- wait, hear me
out, don't flame me!), you go and the person wants to know why the hell
anyone would want pickles in their hamburger, why don't you try the
healthier chicken sandwich, whatever...I find it hard to talk to LBS
folks 'cause if they're knowledgeable about bikes it's like they're
running for the Presidency or something! =D

I mean, hell, if I want to annoy someone with my stupdity, I'll come to
usenet and do it.

But the Brooks B17?? Looks like any ol' saddle!

You mean the Serfas RX doesn't look comfy to you??

On Sat, 23 Jul 2005 14:44:12 GMT, "Bill Sornson"
wrote:

NYC XYZ wrote:

{whole buncha snippage}

I totally agree. Thing is, $1,200 for this bike is quite a deal! I'm
sure I'll fit...I've always bought pre-built bikes, and they've never
felt totally comfortable, whatever that means when it comes to
bicycling.

Have you ever been fit to a bike?

Giving up now, BS


Bill, he kind of reminds me of early Maggie, without the charm. This
guy is so full of preconceived ideas, that it will take a miracle to
get through to him.

For the OP, go to a LBS and get a professional fitting, bicycles can
be comfortable. Overly padded bike saddles are generally not
comfortable on longer rides. Another thing, two brands of bike with
the same size listing, may be very different. Geometry and where they
measure, affects this.

Maybe some background would help. What is your age and level of
fitness? How often do you ride? Do you wear padded bicycle shorts?
Where are you located?


Life is Good!
Jeff

But the Brooks B17?? Looks like any ol' saddle!


You mean the Serfas RX doesn't look comfy to you??
,

Those cushy saddles are fine for round the corner rides and such but
for longer rides you need to support the sit bones . Check out
www.mtbr.com and look at B17 reviews.
There are no better saddles at least for my butt. Proper sizing is
crucial. If you know what size you need then mail order is great.

On 23 Jul 2005 06:16:37 -0700, "NYC XYZ"
wrote:




Decent shorts? See, this is the thing -- I do look like an average
rider, the sort that doesn't wear the spandex and jerseys and helmets
(oops) and carry water bottles....

What do you have against water bottles? How are you going to ride 50+
miles, at a fast pace, and not drink any liquids?

You are asking questions, but then debating or dismissing the answers.
You don't like being numb in the crotch? Padded shorts might help
that.

Saddles are a personal thing, with certain general rules of thumb. You
need a saddle that lines up with your sit bones, one that is
comfortable for you. I went through four different saddles, before I
settled on a Selle Italia Prolink basic.

I really don't understand your reluctance to work with a LBS. They
have to ask questions to understand your needs, and they are going to
try to clear up your misconceptions, which would be no easy job.

If you buy a bike online, without at least getting a pro fit and then
assistance in fitting the new bike, you will continue to be
uncomfortable.


Life is Good!
Jeff

"NYC XYZ" wrote in message
oups.com...

Gooserider wrote:


Aluminum can be SCARY light, and steel isn't 5-10 pounds heavier. Try 1-2
pounds.

So what's generally lighter, all other things (frame geometry, etc.)
being equal -- ti, carbon fiber, aluminum, or quality steel?

I'm sure you couldn't stand to lose 5 pounds off your body, right?

Hehehe...5'11" and 230 lbs. -- I was statistically overweight for my
age and height even at my best shape of 185 lbs.!

Then you shouldn't be worrying so much about frame material and a couple of
pounds on the bike.

If you want to be comfortable, frame material is the least of your
concern.

Well, part of comfort for me would be not carrying so many pounds,
whether portaging over stairs or climbing long New Jersey hills!

Comfort is more about position and fit on the bike. Comfort is cumulative.

Tire size and frame geometry have far more to do with it.

Frame geometry affects weight??

No, but it definitely affects comfort. An upright position with less weight
on the hands makes a huge difference.

That being said,
don't you wonder why so many touring bikes are STEEL? :-)

LOL -- didn't know they were!

I'd say the majority are. There are some aluminum(Cannondale comes to mind)
and some Ti(Airborne, Lightspeed), but most are steel.

23 Jul 2005 06:29:31 -0700,
. com, "NYC XYZ"
wrote:

Mark
is a regular poster here and a nice guy, but don't talk politics with
him.

LOL -- politics? That's interesting...the bike advocacy orgs here in
NYC seem pretty left-of-center!

It's okay to talk politics with Mark as long as you're nuts enough to
agree with him.
--
zk

"NYC XYZ" wrote in message
ups.com...

Gooserider wrote:


The problem with buying Chinese goods is the very real possibility that
doing so supports our enemy.War with China over Taiwan is not out of the
question.

Of course, the other school of thought counters that this is precisely
why you must keep 'em engaged through trade. As their economy becomes
ever more dependent on foreign trade, etc., war becomes more and more
"impractical"...if Nixon hadn't gone to China, China might be just
another North Korea now.

Or, the Chinese will continue to pour massive amounts of money into their
military, strengthening them for the eventual takeover of Taiwan. That is
the more likely scenario.

The Chinese have a horrible human rights record, you know.

So do many US allies. That doesn't stop us from buying Saudi oil, etc.

There are alternatives to buying Chinese bicycles. Saudi oil, not so much.
At least not now. That's why I drive a car which gets excellent mileage, and
commute by bicycle 4 days/week. The cartels aren't getting rich off me.

People
there are routinely put in re-education camps, undergo forced
sterilization,
are placed in forced labor camps, and face other such horrible acts.

I totally agree. I just don't think that I can have any more effect on
those issues than the US government, which has very limited effect on
issues it considers even more important.

But you can do the right thing. I'll bet you wouldn't buy a shampoo you knew
was tested by being squirted in puppy's eyes(hypothetical, of course). Why
you wouldn't have a problem buying a bicycle made in a country whose
government routinely does worse things to people is beyond me.

Every
dollar you spend on Chinese goods goes to strengthen them both
economically
and militarily. I would no more buy Chinese goods than I would buy
conflict
diamonds.

Conflict diamonds? What are these, please?

http://www.un.org/peace/africa/Diamond.html
http://www.amnestyusa.org/diamonds/index.do

Basically, conflict diamonds are those from Sierra Leone, Angola, and Congo.
The sales of diamonds finance rebels who commit horrible atrocities against
the civilian populations. Chopping off hands and feet with machetes is
routine. I really don't think a little bling is worth somebody losing their
hands, and the UN agrees.

"NYC XYZ" wrote in message
ups.com...

di wrote:


why would you want a titanium hybrid?


I'M SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO ******GLAD****** YOU ASKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It seems like manufacturers also think there isn't a market out there
for folks who like their uprights (or upwrongs, as the 'bent crowd
likes to crow!) comfy as well as light and speedy.

I'm not into racing, but I do do a lot of bike riding for someone who's
not into racing! So I want to be comfortable...but that also means not
dealing with that extra five to ten pounds of a non-ti or carb-fi
bike....

I CAN'T be the only one who reasons this way...!

I went to so many bike shops around NYC, and they all gave me that WTF
stare...but it makes perfect sense to me! Why is the world so
black-and-white anyway?? I like comfort, but I also like performance!

When I lean more towards comfort (actually, when I have more cash) I'll
get a recumbent bike...for now, I'm still leaning towards out-and-out
performance -- but comfort's still a main, if not *the* main, factor!

Actually I wasn't even thinking about performance and hybrid in the same
chain of thought, most of the people I know who start with a hybrid and stay
with cycling will eventually go to either a good quality road bike or
mountain bike and drop the hybrid. BY the way you can buy a very good
recumbent for $1200.

wrote in message
oups.com...
since you want a Ti bike, I would suggest that you go he
http://www.habcycles.com/
Habanero frames are good quality, just like airborne. However, it is
smaller volume, and the owner, Mark, will spend more time talking to
you and answering all the questions that you have very patiently. Mark
is a regular poster here and a nice guy, but don't talk politics with
him.

Andres

Habaneros are still Chinese. If you want Ti, save up and buy a Litespeed.
Otherwise, there are plenty of perfectly fine bikes made from other
materials. Ti can't do anything good steel doesn't. So it doesn't rust? I
live in Florida, ride steel, and I don't have a rust problem. Proper
maintenance goes a long way. Ti is

"NYC XYZ" wrote in message
oups.com...

Gooserider wrote:


Airborne is fine, if you don't mind buying a Chinese bicycle.

Indeed! Oddly enough, Airborne notes on its website that although the
frame comes from a Chinese aerospace and satellite company (?!), their
bikes still qualify under US Trade regulations as American Made!

Ah, the wonders of free trade. How many American Ti fabricators could be
employed if those bikes were made here?

I don't
support communist dictatorships.

This is so interesting...what Red China products do you do without, and
what do you substitute them with? Like everything's made there these
days.

Can I find American made cheap plastic junk? No. Can I find bicycles, cars,
motorcycles, appliances, and electronics not made in China. Sure, and I
have.

I own three Taiwanese bikes, and an
American bike. The American bike is head and shoulders above the
Taiwanese
quality wise, but it was far more expensive, too. I wouldn't buy the
Airborne, but that's purely on an ethical level. I'm sure the quality is
fine.

Are you sure those so-called "Taiwanese" bikes aren't perhaps made in
some mainland China factory? I understand everybody's got factories in
China.

If the sticker says "Made in Taiwan", then that's the deal. They're all made
at the same factories, anyway.