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Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly?



 
 
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  #71  
Old September 16th 18, 01:29 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 200
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:44:38 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg





My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came out
and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road bike
won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our bus
racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on that MTB
is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just can't imagine
why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of racks,
some partially good, some bad, and you never know which one comes.
Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end points, so I'd
need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And carry a camera
because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even a
regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making a
Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack design
undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc of the
wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to drop to the
bottom to be safe. The downward force of the clamping arm holds it
in place. That bike is fine. It's not going anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in place
if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an emergency
situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to rest sloppily,
with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's not
rocket science, it's easy.


Go to the SportWorks catalog. There are many available designs, and
newer designs do have an open wheel tray, but keep in mind that it is the
front wheel that matters, and the short tray models probably support an
equal percentage of the arc of the wheel even when the wheel rides up in
the closed wheel tray. Have you seen bicycles littering the roadway? I
rode home last night and saw dozens of bikes of various shapes and sizes
on the fronts of our local TriMet buses. No complaints were heard, but
then again, we're tough Oregonians living in the wilds of Portland.

-- Jay Beattie.





And my 42" wheelbase bike (2.5" longer than Joerg's) fits just fine on the
racks of our local buses. Maybe they just do things a little bit better in
those socialist countries whose steel and aluminum exports poses a security
threat to the USA.

Ads
  #72  
Old September 16th 18, 02:43 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 370
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On Sun, 16 Sep 2018 00:29:49 +0000 (UTC), Ralph Barone
wrote:

jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:44:38 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg





My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came out
and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road bike
won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our bus
racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on that MTB
is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just can't imagine
why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of racks,
some partially good, some bad, and you never know which one comes.
Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end points, so I'd
need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And carry a camera
because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even a
regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making a
Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack design
undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc of the
wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to drop to the
bottom to be safe. The downward force of the clamping arm holds it
in place. That bike is fine. It's not going anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in place
if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an emergency
situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to rest sloppily,
with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's not
rocket science, it's easy.


Go to the SportWorks catalog. There are many available designs, and
newer designs do have an open wheel tray, but keep in mind that it is the
front wheel that matters, and the short tray models probably support an
equal percentage of the arc of the wheel even when the wheel rides up in
the closed wheel tray. Have you seen bicycles littering the roadway? I
rode home last night and saw dozens of bikes of various shapes and sizes
on the fronts of our local TriMet buses. No complaints were heard, but
then again, we're tough Oregonians living in the wilds of Portland.

-- Jay Beattie.





And my 42" wheelbase bike (2.5" longer than Joerg's) fits just fine on the
racks of our local buses. Maybe they just do things a little bit better in
those socialist countries whose steel and aluminum exports poses a security
threat to the USA.



Ah but California does such a wonderful job of supporting and
nurturing the illegal immigrants, unemployed, unwed mothers and all
the other indigents.

Obviously bicycle racks have to be relegated to a second class
refinement.
--
Cheers

John B.
  #73  
Old September 16th 18, 03:24 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,434
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On 9/15/2018 12:56 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/15/2018 10:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 10:44:38 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg






My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came out
and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road bike
won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our bus
racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on that MTB
is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just can't imagine
why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of racks,
some partially good, some bad, and you never know which one comes.
Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end points, so I'd
need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And carry a camera
because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even a
regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making a
Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack design
undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc of the
wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to drop to the
bottom to be safe.* The downward force of the clamping arm holds it
in place. That bike is fine. It's not going anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in place
if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an emergency
situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to rest sloppily,
with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's not
rocket science, it's easy.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/


I REALLY feel sorry for you. So much negativity must make bicycling
such a chore rather than a pleasure. The there's waiting for a bus and
having to hope that it is one of the ones with a rack that'll fit your
bike. What a way t o have to live and bicycle. Here where I am I can
put my MTB, my road or my touring bike on any of the bus racks without
any trouble and i do not have to worry about that the next bus coming
will have a rack my bike won't fit.

Cheers


meanwhile some ask why, others ask, 'why not?'

https://macgyverisms.wonderhowto.com...r-car-0138393/


https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listc...hreadid=107511

https://www.motherearthnews.com/diy/...zmaz84jazloeck

https://www.blessthisstuff.com/stuff...misc/tuf-rack/

http://wcswanson.net/dnn/OtherProjec...rProjects.aspx


Well, those won't work for Joerg.


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #74  
Old September 16th 18, 04:46 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 370
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 22:24:51 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 9/15/2018 12:56 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/15/2018 10:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 10:44:38 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg






My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came out
and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road bike
won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our bus
racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on that MTB
is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just can't imagine
why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of racks,
some partially good, some bad, and you never know which one comes.
Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end points, so I'd
need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And carry a camera
because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even a
regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making a
Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack design
undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc of the
wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to drop to the
bottom to be safe.* The downward force of the clamping arm holds it
in place. That bike is fine. It's not going anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in place
if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an emergency
situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to rest sloppily,
with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's not
rocket science, it's easy.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I REALLY feel sorry for you. So much negativity must make bicycling
such a chore rather than a pleasure. The there's waiting for a bus and
having to hope that it is one of the ones with a rack that'll fit your
bike. What a way t o have to live and bicycle. Here where I am I can
put my MTB, my road or my touring bike on any of the bus racks without
any trouble and i do not have to worry about that the next bus coming
will have a rack my bike won't fit.

Cheers


meanwhile some ask why, others ask, 'why not?'

https://macgyverisms.wonderhowto.com...r-car-0138393/


https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listc...hreadid=107511

https://www.motherearthnews.com/diy/...zmaz84jazloeck

https://www.blessthisstuff.com/stuff...misc/tuf-rack/

http://wcswanson.net/dnn/OtherProjec...rProjects.aspx


Well, those won't work for Joerg.


I'm a bit dubious about the first one though - held on with suction
cups?
--
Cheers

John B.
  #75  
Old September 16th 18, 03:51 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,865
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On 9/15/2018 10:46 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 22:24:51 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 9/15/2018 12:56 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/15/2018 10:46 AM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 10:44:38 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg






My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came out
and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road bike
won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our bus
racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on that MTB
is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just can't imagine
why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of racks,
some partially good, some bad, and you never know which one comes.
Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end points, so I'd
need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And carry a camera
because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even a
regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making a
Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack design
undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc of the
wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to drop to the
bottom to be safe. The downward force of the clamping arm holds it
in place. That bike is fine. It's not going anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in place
if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an emergency
situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to rest sloppily,
with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's not
rocket science, it's easy.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I REALLY feel sorry for you. So much negativity must make bicycling
such a chore rather than a pleasure. The there's waiting for a bus and
having to hope that it is one of the ones with a rack that'll fit your
bike. What a way t o have to live and bicycle. Here where I am I can
put my MTB, my road or my touring bike on any of the bus racks without
any trouble and i do not have to worry about that the next bus coming
will have a rack my bike won't fit.

Cheers


meanwhile some ask why, others ask, 'why not?'

https://macgyverisms.wonderhowto.com...r-car-0138393/


https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listc...hreadid=107511

https://www.motherearthnews.com/diy/...zmaz84jazloeck

https://www.blessthisstuff.com/stuff...misc/tuf-rack/

http://wcswanson.net/dnn/OtherProjec...rProjects.aspx


Well, those won't work for Joerg.


I'm a bit dubious about the first one though - held on with suction
cups?
--
Cheers

John B.


Yeah, that's how we capitalist roaders and running dogs[1]
think. Even duct tape, foul as it may be, is better than
applying to some government program.

[1] Chairman Mao's version of 'basket of deplorables'. I
wear both labels with pride.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #76  
Old September 16th 18, 04:03 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,607
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On 2018-09-15 12:36, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:44:38 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 18:00, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-14 14:35, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:09:36 PM UTC-4, Joerg
wrote:
On 2018-09-14 12:28, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/14/2018 12:26 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-13 18:03, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


... They work for odd shaped bikes around he
http://farm1.staticflickr.com/93/248...3cdf194b2f.jpg




https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rying_bike.jpg





My road bike measures 39-1/2" axle to axle. That is not
outlandishly
large and should fit. But it did not.

This sounds more and more like an operator problem.


If the bike doesn't go in then it doesn't go in. It's that
simple.

At the first time the bus driver (himself a cyclist) came
out and tried, then scratching his head what we could do.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

I'd like to see an image of the ACTUAL bus rack your road
bike won't fit into. Me long wheelbase 1980's MTB fits in our
bus racks without any problems at all and the wheelbase on
that MTB is longer than most modern 26" wheels MTBs. I just
can't imagine why you can't get even a 1980's road bike into
your bus rack.


It's not that easy. First, they seem to have a plethora of
racks, some partially good, some bad, and you never know which
one comes. Then the bus is on a hot schedule and loops, no end
points, so I'd need to have a buddy to take a pic, fast. And
carry a camera because my phone doesn't have one.

Look at the link Jay pointed out, that shows the problem. Even
a regular 26" bike started to ride up on the slot ends. See at
0:33min, front wheel rides up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETtnX_KScI8

At :33 is a road bike with 700C wheels, unless Bianchi is making
a Volpe variant with 650B. It does have flat bars. The rack
design undoubtedly requires that a certain percentage of the arc
of the wheel is within the tray, but the bike doesn't have to
drop to the bottom to be safe. The downward force of the
clamping arm holds it in place. That bike is fine. It's not going
anywhere.


The more the rear tire rides up the less safe the bike is held in
place if this bus has to make a sudden sharp left turn in an
emergency situation. At 0:35min you can see that the bike comes to
rest sloppily, with the rear wheel partially out.

What is so difficult to design a rack so bikes don't do this? It's
not rocket science, it's easy.


Go to the SportWorks catalog. There are many available designs, and
newer designs do have an open wheel tray, but keep in mind that it is
the front wheel that matters, and the short tray models probably
support an equal percentage of the arc of the wheel even when the
wheel rides up in the closed wheel tray.



The only thing that holds a bike with its rear wheel almost out of the
slot is the frcition of the hook and that material was a bit worn on the
racks I used. When I loaded my MTB "correctly" with front wheel hooked
and real wheel sticking mostly out of the slot I could easily cause the
whole bike to slip back out of the rack with one hand. Obviously not
safe. The driver came out and agreed. He said the only way might a
non-standard loading where the hook goes over the rear wheel and then
cinching down the front wheel hard. With the emphasis on hard, really
hard, something you don't want to do to a road bike rim and tire.
Luckily the hook could be pushed under the (solidly mounted) panniers
and I had a strong bungee. Without that I could not have used the bus.
Same for my buddy despite his bike being a frame size smaller.


... Have you seen bicycles littering the roadway?


No, but heard of cases where bikes flew out. A case that took the cake
was where the transit agency later told the cyclist that by placing a
bike in the rack the passenger assumes responsibility, so no claim (his
bike ended up under the bus).


... I rode home last night and saw dozens of
bikes of various shapes and sizes on the fronts of our local TriMet
buses. No complaints were heard, but then again, we're tough
Oregonians living in the wilds of Portland.


TriMet might have selected properly designed racks. Just like some rack
slots on our transit buses are perfectly ok.

Anyhow, we can discuss this until the cows come home. When the rear
wheel rides up out of the slot it's not safe.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #77  
Old September 16th 18, 05:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,434
Default Bus bike rack too short, how to strap in a bike quickly? [update]

On 9/16/2018 11:03 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-15 12:36, jbeattie wrote:

* ... Have you seen bicycles littering the roadway?


No, but heard of cases where bikes flew out. A case that took the cake
was where the transit agency later told the cyclist that by placing a
bike in the rack the passenger assumes responsibility, so no claim (his
bike ended up under the bus).


But since (you say) the racks are so very unsafe, there must be hundreds
of cases of bikes popping out! You're just not looking for the evidence!

Or is there perhaps another explanation for your unique assessment of
this supposedly critical problem?

--
- Frank Krygowski
 




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