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  #21  
Old October 26th 12, 11:47 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
john B.
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Posts: 2,603
Default helmet

On Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:12:49 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot
wrote:

On Thursday, October 25, 2012 8:37:46 PM UTC-4, SMS wrote:
On 10/25/2012 4:04 PM, AMuzi wrote:

If anyone here has an argument which we didn't thoroughly beat to death


in 1998, please start a new helmet thread and enlighten me.




Actually a lot has changed since 1998.



Snipped

Yes, a lot has changed. One thing is that it is nowextremely difficult to find a hard-shell bicycling helmet in the average bicycle shop.

I've had a few intersting personal experiences with two soft-shell helmets.

One was when I wiped out and smacked the side of my helmet clad head against the pavement. No contusions or anything else and was able to immediately get up and ride without having to wash off any blood or patch a cut on the head.

Interestingly enough the other was when I dropped another helmet from the bicycle handlebar where the helmet had been hanging by its fastened chinstrap and 3" x 1" section of the lower lwft side of the helmet broke off upon impact. That was not even 3' and it was a straight drop with no forward momentum.

I wear a helmet primarily for the use of the helmet mounted mirror.

I wonder if the US Army Kevlar helmet would be a better choice? ;)

Cheers


And when we see the stage racers tuck in and set off down the mountain
at 50 MPH they point and say "See there, He's wearing a helmet".

--
Cheers,
John B.
Ads
  #22  
Old October 26th 12, 01:02 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane Hébert
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Posts: 85
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On 10/25/2012 08:27 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 10/25/2012 6:12 PM, datakoll wrote:
Brandt was not wearing a helmet for his fatal accident. I have a fine
Nbar Bell and not worn.

I wonder what the stats are for serious head injuries with helmets
left on the rack ?


Which caused his broken femur or caused the anaesthesiologist's error
resulting in stroke?


Didn't know that he died. Sorry to hear that.
  #23  
Old October 26th 12, 01:40 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
datakoll
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Posts: 7,793
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last May
  #24  
Old October 26th 12, 03:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
thirty-six
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Posts: 10,049
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On 26 Oct, 00:05, AMuzi wrote:
If anyone here has an argument which we didn't thoroughly
beat to death in 1998, please start a new helmet thread and
enlighten me.

Oh, and if anyone thinks an argument here will change anyone
else's opinion, you might explain your reasoning.

--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971



It is in opposition to what I know in my heart. I shall not bow to
the slave-drivers.
  #25  
Old October 26th 12, 04:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 9,477
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On 10/25/2012 8:04 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:

Pray tell us; where in the world has bicycle usage remained the same or risen AFTER MANDATORY HELMET LAWS were introduced? Not Australia or New Zealand.


Australia and New Zealand.

Studies showed that mandatory helmet laws DO cause cycling rates to DROP. Frank has posted data and links to those studies many times.


Surely you're not gullible enough to believe any of the "studies" to
which Frank posts links.

"The enactment of legislation promoting helmet use is associated with an
increase in helmet use and a decrease in head injuries. For example, in
Victoria, Australia, helmet use increased from 31% to 75%, and cycling
fatalities decreased by 48%, after the introduction of mandatory helmet
laws, despite an increase in cycling among adults."

(Cameron MH, Vulcan AP, Finch CF, et al. Mandatory bicycle helmet use
following a decade of voluntary promotion in Victoria,
Australia — an evaluation. Accid Anal Prev 1994;26:325-37.)

The key thing to remember is that you have to be extremely wary of
statistics specifically selected to try and prove something that is
actually untrue. In the case of the claims of reduced cycling levels,
there were several key flaws. First they searched for a time period
where they could find an atypical decrease. Second they chose sub-groups
of cyclists that fit their goal, and ignored sub-groups that did not fit
their goal. Third, they ignored all other factors that cause an increase
or decrease in cycling rates. All of this was intentional of course.

It is true that immediately following the implementation of a helmet law
there is often a dip in cycling levels, at least for children. After a
year or so, levels will return to the previous level. This is especially
true if helmet usage was not promoted through education for a long
period prior to the law taking effect, for reasons such as the lack of
wide availability of helmets at the retail level, especially outside of
just bicycle shops. For adults, as the Victoria study showed, there was
not even a decrease in the first year, adult bicycle usage went up 44%
in the first year after the helmet law was introduced, though the
increase cannot be attributed to the helmet law since cycling rates
increase and decrease for a variety of reasons (if I employed the same
junk science and statistics as Frank, I would jump up and down and
insist that the 44% increase was solely because of the helmet law!).

If you look at the web sites that promulgate the most misinformation
about helmets, i.e. http://www.cyclehelmets.org and look at the data
for Victoria http://www.cyclehelmets.org/1020.html, it's quite
amusing. They a) omit the fact that adult cycling levels went way up
after the helmet law, b) do not include the data showing that even for
children, cycling levels eventually returned to pre-helmet law levels,
and c) don't mention that even if there had not been an all ages helmet
law enacted, there would still have been a helmet law for children. That
site is junk science at its worst. Of course that's not surprising when
you look at the supporters, it's a collection of the worst offenders
when it comes to using junk science and statistics
http://www.cyclehelmets.org/1121.html. It's not clear which of those
people are pushing the junk science and statistics and which of them
were simply gullible enough to believe it all.


  #26  
Old October 26th 12, 05:14 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jay Beattie
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Posts: 4,322
Default helmet

On Oct 25, 9:17*pm, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:18:29 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot

wrote:
On Thursday, October 25, 2012 9:11:38 PM UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
retro bicycle helmets:
http://www.bicycling.com/gearfinderproductdetail?gfid=12367


http://www.labicicletta.com/accessories/helmets/hairnet-head-cover.html
Grrrr... only avaiable in 53 to 57cm. *My inflated ego requires a 59cm
hat size.

Got myself one of those a few years back. Fantastic ventilation


The problem with so much ventilation is that you can't listen to music
through the helmet:
http://www.tunebug.com/tunebug-in-action/
http://justintimberlake.com/news/2010/badass_biker_need_tunes/

and will hold the skull pieces together in a major crash. ;)


Yep. *Saves time for the paramedics not needing to go searching the
roadway for all your skull fragments.


Not paramedics . . . coroners, although I worked with a guy (my boss)
who was the owner of a funeral home who, on one call, collected the
victim's brains and put them in to a hubcap. On Highway 17 -- your
neck of the woods, near Summit. I think he did it as a professional
courtesy. If people got splattered, we generally just went home . . .
except on HWY 17. The CHP was so worried that wrecks would cause more
wrecks (which they did) that the officers would declare people alive
even if they were in pieces. They would make us underpaid ambulance
drivers transport just to keep the road clear and to avoid the long
coroner's investigations. Otherwise, we were prohibited from hauling
dead people because it tied up EMS equipment. You would just go view
the carnage, declare something dead and go home . . . 10-55. 10-98,
10-19. Ah, the good old days.

-- Jay Beattie.


  #27  
Old October 26th 12, 06:12 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Lou Holtman[_5_]
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Posts: 826
Default helmet

Op vrijdag 26 oktober 2012 01:05:01 UTC+2 schreef AMuzi het volgende:
If anyone here has an argument which we didn't thoroughly

beat to death in 1998, please start a new helmet thread and

enlighten me.



Oh, and if anyone thinks an argument here will change anyone

else's opinion, you might explain your reasoning.



--

Andrew Muzi

www.yellowjersey.org/

Open every day since 1 April, 1971


It is the time of the year Andrew, but like you I asked the same questions. I don't care whether someone wears a helmet or not for whatever reason.

Lou
  #28  
Old October 26th 12, 06:49 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Art Harris
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Posts: 577
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Duane Hébert wrote:
Didn't know that he died. Sorry to hear that.



He didn't.

See:

http://rayhosler.wordpress.com/2012/...y-fallen-snow/

Art
  #29  
Old October 26th 12, 06:58 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane Hébert
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Posts: 85
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On 10/26/2012 01:49 PM, Art Harris wrote:
Duane Hébert wrote:
Didn't know that he died. Sorry to hear that.



He didn't.

See:

http://rayhosler.wordpress.com/2012/...y-fallen-snow/



Thanks. Yeah I got that further on in this thread.

  #30  
Old October 27th 12, 12:19 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
datakoll
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Posts: 7,793
Default helmet

On Friday, October 26, 2012 1:49:01 PM UTC-4, Art Harris wrote:
Duane Hébert wrote:

Didn't know that he died. Sorry to hear that.








He didn't.



See:



http://rayhosler.wordpress.com/2012/...y-fallen-snow/



Art


January February March April MAY June July Awgust....ry it its easy...

I hear JB went blind !
 




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