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Making America into Amsterdam



 
 
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  #171  
Old July 17th 18, 12:33 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 6,042
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 1:41 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 10:23, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 1:19 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 09:08, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 7:56:37 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-15 15:01, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


We met at a coffee shop this morning, but I didn't partake. Got
up to 95F, and I ran out of water, so I stopped at a market with
my cohorts.* Also stopped for a little ferry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfIcrKZesw&t=3s What a beautiful
day it was. No pubs. Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and
no pubs -- although I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol.
Obviously two no-fun rides because they didn't involve a pub of
any kind.


Somewhere between 95-100F yesterday, did a 20-miler after church.

http://mikebikehike.com/wp-content/u...6/IMG_0140.jpg

No, this ain't my bike. In contrast to some here who find that
"unusual" lots of people in our area ride with panniers. For longer
rides in hilly terrain without water spigots there is no
alternative other that schlepping a hydration pack which will
result in profuse sweating. Or drink American River water and get
E-Coli.

Oh, and I had an IPA on the way back 8-)

Again, you're mixing road and trail.* That's a road bike with
panniers with probably 28mm tires and, gasp, ordinary rim brakes.
It's not going trail riding any time soon.


I have Nashbar Daytrekker panniers on both my road bike and my MTB.


I don't think it's unusual to see road bikes with panniers.* I
probably saw 20-30 cyclists with panniers on the way to work this
morning. I think its unusual to need panniers with tons of junk in
them for a recreational weekend ride with friends, and in your case,
drinking at a pub.


It is when you find another rider bleeding and in need of something to
stop that.


Because riding a bike is so damned dangerous, one comes across bleeding
riders nearly every day!!


A few times a year. They aren't always cyclists.


Well, at least ALL your "Danger! Danger!" isn't applied to cyclists.

Is that not worth it in
your opinion? You'd just bid them a good day and leave? I sure don't. As
the scouts say, be prepared, always.


I've seen only a tiny amount of bleeding in over 45 years of adult
cycling. And the "bleeding" I've seen would be better described as
seeping - specifically, the little bit of blood that comes from minor
road rash. What do I carry on my bike to prepare for that? Precisely
nothing.

My wife tends to worry a bit more than I do, and when attending a
certain medical seminar she was once given a tiny, near useless first
aid kit. She carried it in her bike bag for years and never used it. She
finally ditched it.

But we have no mountain lions around here, and our coyotes seem quite timid.

You would not believe how often my "excess baggage" has saved the day
for others with serious signs of dehydration and zero ounces in their
bottles.


You're right about that: I would not believe. Unless, that is, you're
going to give us a very, very low number.


One guy (on a hike in Yosemite) would most likely not have made it if it
wasn't for a large excess stash of water and food in our backpacks. ...
A Chinese tourist in Grand Canyon ran out of water and gave up on the
trail, in the glistening sun. Just wanted to "stay there". I have her a
lot of water and food until she perked up.


Oh, silly me. I thought we were talking about bicycling!


--
- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #172  
Old July 17th 18, 12:49 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,042
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 2:05 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 10:14, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 1:20 AM, wrote:
On Wednesday, July 4, 2018 at 11:21:46 AM UTC-5, duane wrote:

Is there any place that is seriously looking at bike infrastructure to
increase revenues?

Here the motivation is to reduce the number of cars in a city that
can't
handle much more traffic.* Cycling is treated in much the same way as
public transit. The city wants to reduce motor vehicle traffic in town.

In my city, which has many miles of bike paths, the bike paths are
under the parks and recreation department of the government.* In my
city we treat bike paths as parks.* Recreational areas.* I doubt any
park in the country has paid for itself.* Parks are generally built as
a quality of life enhancement.


And I strongly agree with that policy. Almost all bike paths, IME, are
really linear parks.

Trouble is, there are many of these linear parks that are built using
transportation funds. I don't think that's appropriate.


That assertion is wrong.

https://www.cityofberkeley.info/bicy...walkingguides/

It even says transportation on their web site. Because that's what many
bike paths are.


sigh Joerg, what are we talking about here? The maps they have up
there mostly cover streets, not trails. Yes, streets are for
transportation. But as I said, almost all bike paths are really linear
parks. IOW their recreational use _far_ exceeds their transportation use
- like by a 100 to 1 ratio.


Although there are a few miles of bike paths alongside the busy roads
going into the downtown.* I suppose those are for vehicle reduction
purposes.


Those can possibly justify transportation funding. With them, the issue
tends to be quality of design. There's currently too much pushing for
crazy and confusing "innovation."


Unless it's done right.


The apologists for weird facilities are always saying "Well, the old
facilities weren't done right. Now we're doing it right."

But DC's quite new "protected" lanes had intersections with crash rates
between two times and five times worse than before the installation.
Columbus, Ohio's one mile of "protected" cycle track had a crash
increase of over 600%. No, that's not a typo. That facility was put in
just three years ago.

Deaths in "protected" cycle tracks keep popping up in the news, usually
because a straight-ahead cyclist surprises a turning motorist. Hmm: A
straight ahead bike lane hidden from view, to the right of a right turn
motor vehicle lane? Gosh, what could go wrong?

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #173  
Old July 17th 18, 01:11 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,042
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 12:46, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 10:19:52 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:

I've use rope to tow another rider. When the rear derailer gets
pretzeled out in the boonies the only other option would be to hoof
it and be late.


Or straighten the derailleur with your hand and ride on. Again, we're
talking about road bikes. With my last crash, I not only straightened
the derailleur enough to continue riding, ...



In our case the outer shell of the derailer was no longer in one piece,
the chain was throughly mangled and IIRC one of the derailer idlers had
gone AWOL. That presents a minor inconvenience.


The classic solution is to shorten the chain so it fits from appropriate
chainring to appropriate rear cog, bypassing the derailleur. Start by
finding a nail plus a rock, of course...

I've fixed a couple rear derailleurs for riders that had overshifted
them into the spokes. They were mangled, but using normal bike tools I
got the derailleurs functioning well enough to finish long rides. But of
course, Joerg's disasters are worse than anything that happens around here.

This week's ride will be Lotus to Folsom and back. No roads, no cell
coverage, hoofing it out can easily take half a day depending on where
you crash. And only if both hooves still work.


I did off-road rides longer than that before there was cell coverage
anywhere.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #174  
Old July 17th 18, 02:34 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,554
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/16/2018 7:11 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 12:46, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 10:19:52 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:

-what the hell I'll snip it-

This week's ride will be Lotus to Folsom and back. No
roads, no cell coverage, hoofing it out can easily take
half a day depending on where you crash. And only if both
hooves still work.


I did off-road rides longer than that before there was cell
coverage anywhere.



As did the prolific Mr Hibell:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Hibell

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #175  
Old July 17th 18, 02:42 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
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Posts: 70
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Mon, 16 Jul 2018 19:33:37 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 7/16/2018 1:41 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 10:23, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/16/2018 1:19 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 09:08, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 7:56:37 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-15 15:01, jbeattie wrote:

[...]


We met at a coffee shop this morning, but I didn't partake. Got
up to 95F, and I ran out of water, so I stopped at a market with
my cohorts.* Also stopped for a little ferry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfIcrKZesw&t=3s What a beautiful
day it was. No pubs. Yesterday was a death ride with my son, and
no pubs -- although I did have a beer at home, and Tylenol.
Obviously two no-fun rides because they didn't involve a pub of
any kind.


Somewhere between 95-100F yesterday, did a 20-miler after church.

http://mikebikehike.com/wp-content/u...6/IMG_0140.jpg

No, this ain't my bike. In contrast to some here who find that
"unusual" lots of people in our area ride with panniers. For longer
rides in hilly terrain without water spigots there is no
alternative other that schlepping a hydration pack which will
result in profuse sweating. Or drink American River water and get
E-Coli.

Oh, and I had an IPA on the way back 8-)

Again, you're mixing road and trail.* That's a road bike with
panniers with probably 28mm tires and, gasp, ordinary rim brakes.
It's not going trail riding any time soon.


I have Nashbar Daytrekker panniers on both my road bike and my MTB.


I don't think it's unusual to see road bikes with panniers.* I
probably saw 20-30 cyclists with panniers on the way to work this
morning. I think its unusual to need panniers with tons of junk in
them for a recreational weekend ride with friends, and in your case,
drinking at a pub.


It is when you find another rider bleeding and in need of something to
stop that.

Because riding a bike is so damned dangerous, one comes across bleeding
riders nearly every day!!


A few times a year. They aren't always cyclists.


Well, at least ALL your "Danger! Danger!" isn't applied to cyclists.

Is that not worth it in
your opinion? You'd just bid them a good day and leave? I sure don't. As
the scouts say, be prepared, always.


I've seen only a tiny amount of bleeding in over 45 years of adult
cycling. And the "bleeding" I've seen would be better described as
seeping - specifically, the little bit of blood that comes from minor
road rash. What do I carry on my bike to prepare for that? Precisely
nothing.

My wife tends to worry a bit more than I do, and when attending a
certain medical seminar she was once given a tiny, near useless first
aid kit. She carried it in her bike bag for years and never used it. She
finally ditched it.

But we have no mountain lions around here, and our coyotes seem quite timid.

You would not believe how often my "excess baggage" has saved the day
for others with serious signs of dehydration and zero ounces in their
bottles.

You're right about that: I would not believe. Unless, that is, you're
going to give us a very, very low number.


One guy (on a hike in Yosemite) would most likely not have made it if it
wasn't for a large excess stash of water and food in our backpacks. ...
A Chinese tourist in Grand Canyon ran out of water and gave up on the
trail, in the glistening sun. Just wanted to "stay there". I have her a
lot of water and food until she perked up.


Oh, silly me. I thought we were talking about bicycling!


How strange.

Over here the Chinese tourists all travel in groups on pre-arranged
tours. There are two reasons for this, firstly some of the more remote
Chinese dialects probably won't be understood outside their local
regions and secondly that the Chinese, like the Japanese before them,
tend to be on prepaid tours. Pay the full amount of the tour tour cost
before you depart and enjoy a fun filled, jam packed, vacation with
every minute supervised by the tour guide.

We recently had a tour boat sink in Phuket and a number of Chinese
were drowned. The next morning the news announced that 27,000 Chinese
had cancelled their visit to Phuket. They seem to act as groups.

Wandering about alone and getting dehydrated just doesn't seem to
happen with the Chinese here. Strange that they are so different in
America.

Or perhaps they aren't. After all he quotes the Chinese saying "I
wanna stay here" something that would be impossible with a real
Chinese Tour member as he wouldn't have spoken English and if he were
speaking the kind of Chinese that you hear in N.E. Thailand it would
sound much like "Koi Yak Hi Chow You Mong Me".

But then the Chinese have figured in some of the more imaginative
writing. Remember Fu Manchu and the Yellow Peril ?
  #176  
Old July 17th 18, 04:29 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joy Beeson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,122
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Mon, 16 Jul 2018 13:29:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

I've heard rumors that people used to ride bikes before cell phone
coverage ever existed. Can that really be true?


Yes, but every place that was open to the public had a pay phone.

Whenever I pass Fribley Field, I cast a nostalgic eye at the two posts
that guard the empty spot where I made many a call for pick-up.


--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net



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  #177  
Old July 17th 18, 04:50 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,039
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Monday, July 16, 2018 at 11:29:30 PM UTC-4, Joy Beeson wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jul 2018 13:29:07 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote:

I've heard rumors that people used to ride bikes before cell phone
coverage ever existed. Can that really be true?


Yes, but every place that was open to the public had a pay phone.


The longest mountain bike I recall was about 50 miles. I suppose that we might
have found a pay phone by riding half a mile to a mile off our route. But we
never did that. As in every other ride I've ever done, we didn't need to.

Maybe it will be different once mountain lions re-settle our area.

- Frank Krygowski
  #178  
Old July 17th 18, 05:21 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joy Beeson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,122
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Mon, 16 Jul 2018 09:08:52 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

That's a road bike with panniers with probably 28mm tires and,
gasp, ordinary rim brakes. It's not going trail riding any time soon.


Depends on who is riding it.

Despite the dismal results of Thursday's MRI, I still think that I
could take my road bike anywhere the young boys can take their
mountain bikes. But I haven't been on the trails much after the local
Powers that Be built a "Greenway" that obliterated most of the trail
that I used to use as a shortcut to Southtown, and I mostly walk.*

So the Heritage Trail is one "bike path" that I do use for
transportation -- but it's *very* telling that an essential feature of
every "bike path" is a parking lot at each end.

Well, the Beyer Farm Trail has three ends and only two parking lots. I
use the Beyer trail whenever I want to add a couple of miles to a trip
downtown.

---------
* I find it amusing that I never have the right of way in the Boys'
Camp. When I'm on the walkway, I'm on my bike, and when I'm on the
bike trails, I'm walking.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/



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  #179  
Old July 17th 18, 01:00 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 166
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 16/07/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 12:46, jbeattie wrote:


snip

************************* ************ ... I rode five miles to a
rural tavern with a broken hand -- which now has a dandy plate and
screws in it. I doubt they had a fine micro-brewed double IPA, but
they did have ice cubes.



Lucky you. Now try that on singletrack with loose rocks strewn all over.



Hence my confusion Jay.

snip
  #180  
Old July 17th 18, 02:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 166
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 17/07/2018 8:00 AM, Duane wrote:
On 16/07/2018 5:42 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-16 12:46, jbeattie wrote:


snip

************************* ************ ... I rode five miles to a
rural tavern with a broken hand -- which now has a dandy plate and
screws in it. I doubt they had a fine micro-brewed double IPA, but
they did have ice cubes.



Lucky you. Now try that on singletrack with loose rocks strewn all over.



Hence my confusion Jay.

snip


Actually looks like it's a thing:
https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mt...iking-problem/
 




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