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Tin plated wire for binding spokes



 
 
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  #1  
Old March 7th 09, 08:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Nick L Plate
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Posts: 1,114
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. Also copper plated wire.
TJ
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  #2  
Old March 7th 09, 08:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jim beam[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 479
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. Also copper plated wire.
TJ


as long as the solder wets the spoke and the binding wire, it doesn't
really matter. since it's easy to solder to stainless if you use the
right flux, you may as well also use a stainless binding wire and
stainless spokes.

NEVER use chrome spokes - the plating cracks and initiates fatigue -
very short lived.
  #3  
Old March 7th 09, 08:52 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Nick L Plate
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,114
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

On 7 Mar, 19:19, jim beam wrote:
Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. *For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. *Also copper plated wire.
TJ


as long as the solder wets the spoke and the binding wire, it doesn't
really matter. *since it's easy to solder to stainless if you use the
right flux, you may as well also use a stainless binding wire and
stainless spokes.

NEVER use chrome spokes - the plating cracks and initiates fatigue -
very short lived.


I have used chrome spokes (not soldered) without succumbing to
fatigue. Do you mean there is a problem after soldering?
TJ
  #4  
Old March 7th 09, 09:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 114
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

On Mar 7, 2:07*pm, Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. *For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. *Also copper plated wire.
TJ


Hemp twine (the kind used as packing for bagpipe
drones) and (gross) blobs of epoxy.

Come to think of it, a pneumatic hog-ringer and
free-trade, certified organic pitch would prolly
work as well as anything.
  #5  
Old March 7th 09, 09:04 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
jim beam[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 479
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

Nick L Plate wrote:
On 7 Mar, 19:19, jim beam wrote:
Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. �For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. �Also copper plated wire.
TJ

as long as the solder wets the spoke and the binding wire, it doesn't
really matter. �since it's easy to solder to stainless if you use the
right flux, you may as well also use a stainless binding wire and
stainless spokes.

NEVER use chrome spokes - the plating cracks and initiates fatigue -
very short lived.


I have used chrome spokes (not soldered) without succumbing to
fatigue. Do you mean there is a problem after soldering?
TJ


no, i mean that as you bend them to lace the wheel, the brittle chrome
plate which is not as elastic as its substrate, cracks. each crack is
an initiation point for fatigue.
  #6  
Old March 7th 09, 09:35 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Nick L Plate
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,114
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

On 7 Mar, 20:01, wrote:
On Mar 7, 2:07*pm, Nick L Plate wrote:

Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. *For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. *Also copper plated wire.
TJ


Hemp twine (the kind used as packing for bagpipe
drones) and (gross) blobs of epoxy.

Come to think of it, a pneumatic hog-ringer and
free-trade, certified organic pitch would prolly
work as well as anything.


button thread and sealing wax? as tite as the spoke can bare.
tj
  #7  
Old March 7th 09, 10:08 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
A Muzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,551
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. Also copper plated wire.


A small area of solder after the ties are wrapped is simply to keep the
wire from unwinding. After soldering, the excess wire is snipped away.

This is not to advocate the technique, but only to clarify that the
solder should not adhere to the spoke itself. You can't readily solder
to stainless without silver (which is much hotter than lead solder) and
at any rate heating the spoke itself enough to wet with lead is also
more heat than is needed.

We use plain steel mechanic's wire, not tinned material. Finished wraps
get washed to remove any flux residue.

Although not a functional improvement to a wheel, some riders prefer the
look, especially on period restorations. What's a Spence Wolf Cinelli
without tied spokes?
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
  #8  
Old March 7th 09, 10:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Nick L Plate
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,114
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

On 7 Mar, 21:08, A Muzi wrote:
Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. *For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. *Also copper plated wire.


A small area of solder after the ties are wrapped is simply to keep the
wire from unwinding. After soldering, the excess wire is snipped away.

This is not to advocate the technique, but only to clarify that the
solder should not adhere to the spoke itself. You can't readily solder
to stainless without silver (which is much hotter than lead solder) and
at any rate heating the spoke itself enough to wet with lead is also
more heat than is needed.

We use plain steel mechanic's wire, not tinned material. Finished wraps
get washed to remove any flux residue.

Although not a functional improvement to a wheel, some riders prefer the
look, especially on period restorations. What's a Spence Wolf Cinelli
without tied spokes?
--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971


If there is no metallurgical bonding you cannot expect a gain in
lateral and torsional stiffness. The solder must bond to the spoke to
eliminate the relative longitudinal movement between the spokes. This
movement is evident in the wear at the crossing in a laced(woven)
wheel. I am doing it for 'functional improvement', not asthetics. It
also simplifies and speeds the swapping of a rim.
TJ
  #9  
Old March 7th 09, 11:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
A Muzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,551
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. Also copper plated wire.


A Muzi wrote:
A small area of solder after the ties are wrapped is simply to keep the
wire from unwinding. After soldering, the excess wire is snipped away.
This is not to advocate the technique, but only to clarify that the
solder should not adhere to the spoke itself. You can't readily solder
to stainless without silver (which is much hotter than lead solder) and
at any rate heating the spoke itself enough to wet with lead is also
more heat than is needed.
We use plain steel mechanic's wire, not tinned material. Finished wraps
get washed to remove any flux residue.
Although not a functional improvement to a wheel, some riders prefer the
look, especially on period restorations. What's a Spence Wolf Cinelli
without tied spokes?


Nick L Plate wrote:
If there is no metallurgical bonding you cannot expect a gain in
lateral and torsional stiffness. The solder must bond to the spoke to
eliminate the relative longitudinal movement between the spokes. This
movement is evident in the wear at the crossing in a laced(woven)
wheel. I am doing it for 'functional improvement', not asthetics. It
also simplifies and speeds the swapping of a rim.


Other testing could find no such effect but, as I said, no harm if you
prefer that (tedious) process.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
  #10  
Old March 7th 09, 11:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected][_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 214
Default Tin plated wire for binding spokes

On Mar 7, 2:48*pm, Nick L Plate wrote:
On 7 Mar, 21:08, A Muzi wrote:



Nick L Plate wrote:
Is the bond created using tin plated steel wire and tinmans solder
more resilient than that made with zinc plated wire. *For use on zinc
plated, chrome or stainless spokes. *Also copper plated wire.


A small area of solder after the ties are wrapped is simply to keep the
wire from unwinding. After soldering, the excess wire is snipped away.


This is not to advocate the technique, but only to clarify that the
solder should not adhere to the spoke itself. You can't readily solder
to stainless without silver (which is much hotter than lead solder) and
at any rate heating the spoke itself enough to wet with lead is also
more heat than is needed.


We use plain steel mechanic's wire, not tinned material. Finished wraps
get washed to remove any flux residue.


Although not a functional improvement to a wheel, some riders prefer the
look, especially on period restorations. What's a Spence Wolf Cinelli
without tied spokes?
--
Andrew Muzi
* www.yellowjersey.org/
* Open every day since 1 April, 1971


If there is no metallurgical bonding you cannot expect a gain in
lateral and torsional stiffness. The solder must bond to the spoke to
eliminate the relative longitudinal movement between the spokes. *This
movement is evident in the wear at the crossing in a laced(woven)
wheel. *I am doing it for 'functional improvement', not asthetics. *It
also simplifies and speeds the swapping of a rim.
TJ


Dear Trevor,

http://www.ozbizz.com/melton/kensbikes/snowflake.htm

Cheers,

Carl Fogel
 




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