Bonds-baseball vs Landis-cycling

On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 15:34:00 GMT, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"RonSonic" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 03:41:31 GMT, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com
wrote:

wrote in message
egroups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Exactly what is it that you believe that Barry Bonds did that would
improve
his hand-eye coordination?

HGH. That's what I'd use or recommend.

I find that pretty hilarious considering the fact that there is a lot of
research concerning growth hormone since there are a dozen fairly common
conditions that are treated with growth hormones.

What HAS been found: Given to growth hormone deficient children during their
normal growing periods it has been shown to increase their heights but not
by much. (2-3 inches). Given to senior citizens who naturally manufacture
very little growth hormone it has been found to STATISTICALLY increase lean
body mass and retain bone density while controls are losing both. It has
also been used for MS patients without any agreement whether or not it has
had any effect.

There are also a load of problems caused by excessive growth hormone in
normal people.

If someone wants to take growth hormone, more power to them. But they
shouldn't be allowed any public medical support when the side effects
cripple them.

malignant dumbass -

You asked what Bonds might have done and I answered. You did not ask whether it
was a good idea or whether it was something that should be recommended to all.

Ron

On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 15:35:15 GMT, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"RonSonic" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 03:41:31 GMT, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com
wrote:

wrote in message
egroups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Let's assume that Bonds did take steroids - all it would do would be to
increase his muscle mass. That ain't what gives you home runs.

It is if you've already got the other tools to hit a major league pitch.
There
are damn few people who have those skills and gifts, if you add muscle
then it
gets scary.

So perhaps we ought to outlaw weight training then?

Malignant dumbass -

There are so many thousands of things in this world that deserve argument, there
is no need to reach for an argument.

Ron

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 16:22:14 -0700, wrote:

present. A game played in 1948 is equal to a game played in 2007.

This is very interesting. Don't they try to improve the material that
the bat and the ball are made of? Like, to make the bat swing stronger
and the ball fly further? Not as much freedom for engineering as in
cycling, but still...

There's some indication that they changed the ball to make it more
lively. No official confirmation from MLB.

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 15:03:49 -0700, wrote:

Bonds continues playing, being paid millions, and being a hero, while
FLyod's carreer is ruined, he has a stigma of a cheater and has to
raise money to get lawyers to defend himself.

Bonds never tested positive for any substance. Unlike cycling, a
positive test is required to suspend a MLB player. Bonds is under
suspicion because of his association with Balco Labs who had produced
a steroid that was undetectable using the methods of that time.
Obviously, Bonds could have been using that steroid and never tested
positive.

If MLB is to suspend Bonds, and wipe his records off the books, they
have to do it by having Bonds implicated by other people testifying
that they saw him uses steroids.

In article
et,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Exactly what is it that you believe that Barry Bonds did that would improve
his hand-eye coordination? Do you have any idea at all what steroids do?

Let's assume that Bonds did take steroids - all it would do would be to
increase his muscle mass. That ain't what gives you home runs.

Anabolic steroids build muscle mass
and that helps hit the ball further
and throw the ball harder. Also aids
in recovery, allowing an athlete to
be closer to the top of his game for
more extended periods.

Barry Bonds did take anabolic steroids.
http://hedgehogcentral.blogspot.com/2007/05/barry-bonds-chemical-creation.html
http://jeromeprophet.blogspot.com/2007/08/barry-bonds-before-and-after-steroids.html
http://www.babeslovebaseball.com/2007/05/welcome-to-alleged-juicer-round.html

--
Michael Press

"Michael Press" wrote in message
...
In article
et,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Exactly what is it that you believe that Barry Bonds did that would
improve
his hand-eye coordination? Do you have any idea at all what steroids do?

Let's assume that Bonds did take steroids - all it would do would be to
increase his muscle mass. That ain't what gives you home runs.

Anabolic steroids build muscle mass
and that helps hit the ball further
and throw the ball harder. Also aids
in recovery, allowing an athlete to
be closer to the top of his game for
more extended periods.

Barry Bonds did take anabolic steroids.
http://hedgehogcentral.blogspot.com/2007/05/barry-bonds-chemical-creation.html
http://jeromeprophet.blogspot.com/2007/08/barry-bonds-before-and-after-steroids.html
http://www.babeslovebaseball.com/2007/05/welcome-to-alleged-juicer-round.html

In the same period of time that Bonds weight changed I went from 145 lbs to
200. My hat size increased from 6 7/8ths to 7 1/4th despite my going bald.
My shoe size went from 11 to 12. I never used any sort of steroids in any
form.

Is it your belief that he "bulked up" somehow more than he could have simply
by lifting weights and getting older?

On Aug 9, 6:03 pm, wrote:
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Bonds continues playing, being paid millions, and being a hero, while
FLyod's carreer is ruined, he has a stigma of a cheater and has to
raise money to get lawyers to defend himself.

Am I missing something? Apparently if a guy is involved in a sport
that everyone in this country cares about it suddenly becomes OK to
use drugs. Same thing with nordic skiing in the 2002 winter olympics.
Hey, who cares about cycling and nordic skiing, they are all on drugs
anyway, let's screw them all. But if it's baseball - hey, wait a
minute....

OK, after much thought, I believe I have some kind of answer. It
starts with the Butch Reynolds case, in which he won a lawsuit against
the international athletics federation for tens of millions of dollars
in the early 1990's. I think that because of this case probably the
American professional sports organizations realized that their
athletes might all start long legal battles with huge lawsuits if
there were equivalent suspensions in their sport. Given all the
qualified lawyers ready to take up such cases, and the possibility of
getting bankrupted if any one athlete actually won his case, the
organizations decided not to embark on strong sanctions for doping.

On the other hand, European athletes were much less willing or able to
fight their cases and, in general, it seems much harder to sue and win
for numerous millions over in Europe. There is also the fact that
European athletes don't understand their rights, e.g., their claims of
"proving their innocence" last year. If every cyclist accused of
doping brought as much effort into challenging the case as landis did,
then the situation would be impossible. That situation might be
exactly what would happen in US professional sports started rigorous
anti-doping measures.

-ilan

In article
k.net
,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

"Michael Press" wrote in message
...
In article
et,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Exactly what is it that you believe that Barry Bonds did that would
improve
his hand-eye coordination? Do you have any idea at all what steroids do?

Let's assume that Bonds did take steroids - all it would do would be to
increase his muscle mass. That ain't what gives you home runs.

Anabolic steroids build muscle mass
and that helps hit the ball further
and throw the ball harder. Also aids
in recovery, allowing an athlete to
be closer to the top of his game for
more extended periods.

Barry Bonds did take anabolic steroids.
http://hedgehogcentral.blogspot.com/2007/05/barry-bonds-chemical-creation.html
http://jeromeprophet.blogspot.com/2007/08/barry-bonds-before-and-after-steroids.html
http://www.babeslovebaseball.com/2007/05/welcome-to-alleged-juicer-round.html

In the same period of time that Bonds weight changed I went from 145 lbs to
200. My hat size increased from 6 7/8ths to 7 1/4th despite my going bald.
My shoe size went from 11 to 12. I never used any sort of steroids in any
form.

Is it your belief that he "bulked up" somehow more than he could have simply
by lifting weights and getting older?

I am convinced that he used anabolic steroids.

--
Michael Press

On Aug 10, 7:00 pm, Michael Press wrote:
In article
k.net,

"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:





"Michael Press" wrote in message
...
In article
et,
"Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:

wrote in message
groups.com...
Listening to a local radiostation talk show right now, discussing if
the justice system is "too hard" on Barry Bonds.

Please explain it to me. I am not from this country originally and I
am not a fan of baseball, so I may be missing something.

Both Bonds and Flyod allegedly did drugs.
Both Bonds and Flyod are ones of the best athletes of their lifetime.

Exactly what is it that you believe that Barry Bonds did that would
improve
his hand-eye coordination? Do you have any idea at all what steroids do?

Let's assume that Bonds did take steroids - all it would do would be to
increase his muscle mass. That ain't what gives you home runs.

Anabolic steroids build muscle mass
and that helps hit the ball further
and throw the ball harder. Also aids
in recovery, allowing an athlete to
be closer to the top of his game for
more extended periods.

Barry Bonds did take anabolic steroids.
http://hedgehogcentral.blogspot.com/2007/05/barry-bonds-chemical-crea...
http://jeromeprophet.blogspot.com/2007/08/barry-bonds-before-and-afte...
http://www.babeslovebaseball.com/2007/05/welcome-to-alleged-juicer-ro...

In the same period of time that Bonds weight changed I went from 145 lbs to
200. My hat size increased from 6 7/8ths to 7 1/4th despite my going bald.
My shoe size went from 11 to 12. I never used any sort of steroids in any
form.

Is it your belief that he "bulked up" somehow more than he could have simply
by lifting weights and getting older?

I am convinced that he used anabolic steroids.

--
Michael Press- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text

He admits he used steroids. That's not even in the discussion. He just
claims he thought it was "flaxseed oil".
The guy who was his "trainer" is still in prison as far as I know.
Bill C

In article ,
Colin Campbell wrote:
wrote:
present. A game played in 1948 is equal to a game played in 2007.

This is very interesting. Don't they try to improve the material that
the bat and the ball are made of? Like, to make the bat swing stronger
and the ball fly further? Not as much freedom for engineering as in
cycling, but still...


Major League bats are still made of the same type of wood that was used
decades ago. Specifications for baseballs have changed several times.
They talk of the "dead ball" era, the "live ball" era, etc., referring
to the tendency of a baseball that is well hit to fly lesser or greater
distances. We're definitely in a "live ball" cycle now, with the home
run being baseball's key hit. Teams still try to advance base runners,
"play the percentages" (which are often wrong from what I've read),
etc., but having some big guy come to the plate and swing for the fences
seems to be "where it's at" these days.

This article identifies some of the ways (over above steroids) that
Bonds has improved his hitting:

http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/c...e-6e097c5c0980

The last player who could hit for a high batting average and with power
was Ted Williams, who missed about five seasons during his prime because
he served in WWII and Korea. He might have matched or passed Babe Ruth
otherwise....

Batting is essentially a contest between the batter's reaction time and
the pitcher's accuracy, trickery, and speed. It is my unexplored and
unsupported theory that the advantage has swung toward pitchers as
people have grown bigger, stronger, better trained, and better
conditioned. I don't think reaction time has improved at all, but more
pitchers can throw faster pitches.