Critical Mass - productive campaign to promote cycling or...

Blonde wrote:
Simon Brooke wrote:
in message , Steve W
') wrote:

Seems to me the real posers are the multi coloured lycra guys.

I resemble that remark. Why shouldn't I wear my club colours when riding
with (or, more significantly, for) my club?

There's nowt wrong with wanting to look good on yer bike. I've always
worn lycra cycling shorts and cycling specific jerseys as I find 'em
more comfortable than civvies for cycling, but I've recently taken to
wearing pro-team kit, simply cos I like the way it looks. I don't think
that's a bad thing. Just cos I'm a cyclist doesn't mean I have to look
unkempt and sweaty. (Well, OK, I still look like that even in the team
kit).

It's always a good idea thought to keep an eye on the news. I don't
follow racing at all and I could not understand why my Festina jersey
was getting some strange stares in France. I got home to discover that
about a month before Festina had been in that big dope scandel in the
1990s. Ooops!
John Kane
Kingston ON

Hello

Are you trolling?

In uk.rec.cycling, you wrote:
... wanky students showing off their new Treks(and their devotion to
environmental issues in the vain hope of a bunk-up)?

The very fact that they choose the one day of the week when all the
real cyclistos are out on TT's or Audax runs,proves that they are all
posers.

I don't need 'Treetrunk' or 'Jupiter Sunbeam' to teach me about the
benefits of cycling.

I think, however, you do need to look into what the CM movement is
actually about. From the ubran75.com CM page:

"Everyday, all over the world, people are resisting the problem
culture of the car by getting on their bikes and riding, instead of
driving.

Critical Mass is a celebration of the alternatives to cars, pollution,
accidents and the loss of public spaces and freedoms.

Not an organisation or group, but an idea or tactic, Critical Mass
allows people to reclaim cities with their bikes, just by getting
together and out-numbering the cars on the road"

Showing an alternative to the car (which happens to be the bike) is
not the same as promoting cycling.

Try getting British cycling's newest fan(Red Ken) to
organise a weekly
or fortnightly time-trialling course similar to the
London stage of
the ToB.
Invite clubs and individuals from all over Britain to
come down and
ride it.
I'd wouldn't mind going up and down the banks of the
Thames at full
welly on a closed-off and properly marshalled street
course( I've just
got some new tri bars ;- )

Looks like you've entirely missed the point. CM is trying to promote
cycling as an alternative to using a car in a city, not trying to
educate people on the benefits of cycling (other than those gained by
not driving a car). I can't possibly see how a weekly central London
time trial will develop anything but anger and frustration from the
public (inclucing the "real" cyclists who commute to or use bikes at
work) and a nice ego-stroking for you as you howl along the Thames

pretending to be Chris Boardman. Not to mention, of course, a vast
amount of traffic generated by these clubs and individuals coming to
London from all over the country.

So if these unkempt youth got their Leninist-Maoist tree-hugging arses
in gear then they could make a real impact.
3 laps of Piccadilly Circus blowing whistles ain't gonna do it.

These unkempt youth don't want [1] to ride down the A1, arse-up, at 6am
on a Sunday, they want to reduce the ridiculous number of cars in
cities. Of course, the effectiveness of CM is debatable (in a different
debate to this one) but something should be done to demonstrate that
often 4 wheels = bad, two wheels = good.

The benefits of cycling do need more promotion in this country, and it'd
be nice to see cycle sport having a leg-up too, but that's not the
stated point of CM. Don't go pretending it is.

Cheerio

Mark

[1] It's possible that, yes, some of these ukempt youths are just hoping
to get into their comrades pants, but I'd hope that at least some of
them are there because they care for the cause.

On 15 Sep 2005 23:55:37 -0700, "MSeries"
wrote:


The Nottingham Duck wrote:
... wanky students showing off their new Treks(and their devotion to
environmental issues in the vain hope of a bunk-up)?

The very fact that they choose the one day of the week when all the
real cyclistos are out on TT's or Audax runs,proves that they are all
posers.

CMs are on Friday evenings, the last or is it the first Friday in the
month.

I was informed by some hemp-befuddled slacker that it was Sunday
mornings.

So are you respondents gonna besiege 'The Pickle' and force Ken to
close-off the streets next Sunady ?

On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 15:51:40 -0000, Mark
wrote:

Hello

Are you trolling?

Why is someone with a valid,but contrary,point automatically a troll ?

Why do you liberal-types always denounce people because they don't
agree with you ?

In uk.rec.cycling, you wrote:
... wanky students showing off their new Treks(and their devotion to
environmental issues in the vain hope of a bunk-up)?

The very fact that they choose the one day of the week when all the
real cyclistos are out on TT's or Audax runs,proves that they are all
posers.

I don't need 'Treetrunk' or 'Jupiter Sunbeam' to teach me about the
benefits of cycling.

I think, however, you do need to look into what the CM movement is
actually about. From the ubran75.com CM page:

"Everyday, all over the world, people are resisting the problem
culture of the car by getting on their bikes and riding, instead of
driving.

Critical Mass is a celebration of the alternatives to cars, pollution,
accidents and the loss of public spaces and freedoms.

Not an organisation or group, but an idea or tactic, Critical Mass
allows people to reclaim cities with their bikes, just by getting
together and out-numbering the cars on the road"

(see point lower down about annoying the public)

Try getting British cycling's newest fan(Red Ken) to
organise a weekly
or fortnightly time-trialling course similar to the
London stage of
the ToB.
Invite clubs and individuals from all over Britain to
come down and
ride it.
I'd wouldn't mind going up and down the banks of the
Thames at full
welly on a closed-off and properly marshalled street
course( I've just
got some new tri bars ;- )

Looks like you've entirely missed the point. CM is trying to promote
cycling as an alternative to using a car in a city,
How is that possible when its only done once a month ?
If you wanted to promote cycling as an alternative do it every week

not trying to
educate people on the benefits of cycling (other than those gained by
not driving a car). I can't possibly see how a weekly central London
time trial will develop anything but anger and frustration from the
public

But isn't that what Critical Mass is guilty of ?

I bet you an eighth of Skunk that more people were encouraged to get
back on their bikes by watching the London stage of ToB than by CM.

(inclucing the "real" cyclists who commute to or use bikes at
work) and a nice ego-stroking for you as you howl along the Thames
pretending to be Chris Boardman.

So you object to the legitimate use of London's streets by club
cyclists ?
Why are you rejecting allies in this way ?

Not to mention, of course, a vast
amount of traffic generated by these clubs and individuals coming to
London from all over the country.

So your bigoted Regionalist views are surfacing.Why shouldn't people
come down to London.
We f*ckin pay for it.

So if these unkempt youth got their Leninist-Maoist tree-hugging arses
in gear then they could make a real impact.
3 laps of Piccadilly Circus blowing whistles ain't gonna do it.

These unkempt youth don't want [1] to ride down the A1, arse-up, at 6am
on a Sunday, they want to reduce the ridiculous number of cars in
cities. Of course, the effectiveness of CM is debatable (in a different
debate to this one) but something should be done to demonstrate that
often 4 wheels = bad, two wheels = good.

The benefits of cycling do need more promotion in this country, and it'd
be nice to see cycle sport having a leg-up too, but that's not the
stated point of CM. Don't go pretending it is.

Cheerio

Mark

[1] It's possible that, yes, some of these ukempt youths are just hoping
to get into their comrades pants, but I'd hope that at least some of
them are there because they care for the cause.


This was a humurous opener on the need to build on cycling's recent
high profile in London.
Since CM has been going for a while,without much luck, then its
obviously time to try a new campaign.

Red Ken was all over the ToB London Stage lika a rash,so now its time
to 'call in his tab' and get him to set up a regular street-cycling
facility.

You only have to look at the success of the cycling events which
follow the routes of the big Tours to see that lesser cyclists love to
follow in their heroes tyre tracks.

What's worrying is the apparent division between your lot and the
club fraternity.

The Nottingham Duck wrote:

I bet you an eighth of Skunk


Aaahh. That explains a lot. Not ****ed as I assumed in my earlier post,
then.

Here's a hint: Skunk's great fun, but it truly doesn't make you sound
smart. Quite the opposite. Most people who use it realise that, but
some, apparently, haven't figured it out yet.

--
Nobby

On 16 Sep 2005 17:35:51 GMT, Nobody Here
wrote:

The Nottingham Duck wrote:

I bet you an eighth of Skunk


Aaahh. That explains a lot. Not ****ed as I assumed in my earlier post,
then.

Here's a hint: Skunk's great fun, but it truly doesn't make you sound
smart. Quite the opposite. Most people who use it realise that, but
some, apparently, haven't figured it out yet.

Here's another hint :
Try contributing something relevant to the thread,rather than
'sniping' at the poster !

On 2005-09-16, The Nottingham Duck wrote:
On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 15:51:40 -0000, Mark wrote:
Are you trolling?

Why is someone with a valid,but contrary,point automatically a troll ?

'wanky students', 'if these unkempt youth got their Leninist-Maoist
tree-hugging arses into gear', etc.

Why do you liberal-types always denounce people because they don't
agree with you ?

Why are you labelling me as a "liberal-type"?

Your contrary point isn't that contrary - I don't neccessarily agree
with CM either and I think it might be doing more damage than good - but
that wasn't my point.

[snip recommendation to promot cycling by running weekly/fortnightly TTs
in London]
Looks like you've entirely missed the point. CM is trying to promote
cycling as an alternative to using a car in a city,

How is that possible when its only done once a month ? If you wanted
to promote cycling as an alternative do it every week

Good point. I've no idea, I've nothing to do with CM. I doubt it is
helping, but I never said it was.

not trying to educate people on the benefits of cycling (other than
those gained by not driving a car). I can't possibly see how a
weekly central London time trial will develop anything but anger and
frustration from the public

But isn't that what Critical Mass is guilty of ?

See above.

I bet you an eighth of Skunk that more people were encouraged to get
back on their bikes by watching the London stage of ToB than by CM.

An eighth of skunk's no good to me, mate. More people probably did ride
after the ToB than CM, though.

(inclucing the "real" cyclists who commute to or use bikes at
work) and a nice ego-stroking for you as you howl along the Thames
pretending to be Chris Boardman.

So you object to the legitimate use of London's streets by club
cyclists ? Why are you rejecting allies in this way ?

No, of course not. But I'm not naive enough to believe that closing off
the centre of the nation's largest city to hold a bike race each week
will do a lot more than wind people up in the long run.

So if these unkempt youth got their Leninist-Maoist tree-hugging
arses in gear then they could make a real impact. 3 laps of
Piccadilly Circus blowing whistles ain't gonna do it.

These unkempt youth don't want [1] to ride down the A1, arse-up, at
6am on a Sunday, they want to reduce the ridiculous number of cars
in cities. Of course, the effectiveness of CM is debatable (in a
different debate to this one) but something should be done to
demonstrate that often 4 wheels = bad, two wheels = good.

The benefits of cycling do need more promotion in this country, and
it'd be nice to see cycle sport having a leg-up too, but that's not
the stated point of CM. Don't go pretending it is.

[1] It's possible that, yes, some of these ukempt youths are just
hoping to get into their comrades pants, but I'd hope that at least
some of them are there because they care for the cause.

This was a humurous opener on the need to build on cycling's recent
high profile in London. Since CM has been going for a while,without
much luck, then its obviously time to try a new campaign.

Correct. But it's not going to be acheived just by hosting more
competitive cycling events; I dare say most people who could benefit
from cycling (people who just go short distances, mums on the school
run, etc) don't give a hoot about racing. We need a better
infrastructure, education and support from the government.

Red Ken was all over the ToB London Stage lika a rash,so now its time
to 'call in his tab' and get him to set up a regular street-cycling
facility.

Ken would be all over competitive tiddlywinks if it brought enough cash
to London's economy.

You only have to look at the success of the cycling events which
follow the routes of the big Tours to see that lesser cyclists love to
follow in their heroes tyre tracks.

Lesser sporting cyclists, yes. In Holland everyone cycles because it's
sensible and the best way to travel. I doubt most of them care about
sporting cycling at all.

What's worrying is the apparent division between your lot and the
club fraternity.

'[my] lot'? Labelling me again, are you? I don't particularly disagree
with your views on CM; I've never taken part myself and worry that some
people who do are taking the **** and giving cycling a bad name. I just
disagreed with your assertation that the goal of CM is to promote
cycling, when really it's about reducing car usage. The two may be close
but they're not the same.

Bye

Mark

The Nottingham Duck wrote:
On 16 Sep 2005 17:35:51 GMT, Nobody Here
wrote:

The Nottingham Duck wrote:

I bet you an eighth of Skunk


Aaahh. That explains a lot. Not ****ed as I assumed in my earlier post,
then.

Here's a hint: Skunk's great fun, but it truly doesn't make you sound
smart. Quite the opposite. Most people who use it realise that, but
some, apparently, haven't figured it out yet.

Here's another hint :
Try contributing something relevant to the thread,rather than
'sniping' at the poster !

OK, old bean, I will if you will.

--
Nobby

On 16 Sep 2005 21:49:10 GMT, Nobody Here
wrote:

The Nottingham Duck wrote:
On 16 Sep 2005 17:35:51 GMT, Nobody Here
wrote:

The Nottingham Duck wrote:

I bet you an eighth of Skunk


Aaahh. That explains a lot. Not ****ed as I assumed in my earlier post,
then.

Here's a hint: Skunk's great fun, but it truly doesn't make you sound
smart. Quite the opposite. Most people who use it realise that, but
some, apparently, haven't figured it out yet.

Here's another hint :
Try contributing something relevant to the thread,rather than
'sniping' at the poster !

OK, old bean, I will if you will.

I have, dolt.

Look at the name next to the original post .

Please continue to embarass yourself like this.I'm loving it.

an eighth of Skunk

What in the world is Skunk?

--
Peter Headland