Should AC try to gain more time?

If the situation comes up, should Contadore try to get more time on
his 'rivals'?

What if this requires a tactical risk? If he takes off and the other
contenders, Wiggins, Schleck go with him, he risks being attacked,
risks knocking another Astana rider off the podium, expends energy
needlessly.

When he attacked and gained 21 seconds, had he also calculated right
and gotten yellow, then there'd be no talk from the bus. Getting
yellow is getting yellow.

Obviously, if he can attack and get 5 minutes on everyone, then that's
a given. But to attack with no clear result (or plan?) just to gain
seconds; should he try it anyway?

Le 7/12/2009 17:38, Nobody a écrit :
If the situation comes up, should Contadore try to get more time on
his 'rivals'?

No, not if his aim is to lose.
Did you really write this or was it the monkeys?
--
Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

--
-Si les autres parties du monde ont des singes ; l'Europe a des Français.
Cela se compense.
-Arthur Schopenhauer

On Jul 12, 6:56*pm, Sandy wrote:
Le 7/12/2009 17:38, Nobody a écrit : If the situation comes up, should Contadore try to get more time on
his 'rivals'?

No, not if his aim is to lose.
Did you really write this or was it the monkeys?
--
Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

--
-Si les autres parties du monde ont des singes ; l'Europe a des Français.
Cela se compense.
-Arthur Schopenhauer

Of course he should gain more time. That's why you race. When he takes
off nobody will follow. There is no risk when the others can't keep
your wheel.

No, not if his aim is to lose.
Did you really write this or was it the monkeys?

Damn it! Now I'm really ****ed, Those monkeys are suppose to be
practicing their echelon technique and now I learn they are posting
under the alias Nobody

When I see those monkeys I am going to beat the living crap out of
them.

In article ,
Bug wrote:

No, not if his aim is to lose.
Did you really write this or was it the monkeys?

Damn it! Now I'm really ****ed, Those monkeys are suppose to be
practicing their echelon technique and now I learn they are posting
under the alias Nobody

When I see those monkeys I am going to beat the living crap out of
them.

Not before they throw it at you.

--
tanx,
Howard

Caught playing safe
It's a bored game

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

When he attacked and gained 21 seconds, had he also calculated right
and gotten yellow, then there'd be no talk from the bus. Getting
yellow is getting yellow.

And that's about as backward as you could get anything. If AC had gotten
Yellow, he would have risked not just a cold shoulder but team support
for the rest of the race. It would have been the most-idiotic move
possible, because-

#1: He'd be putting the team in the position of having to defend the
jersey for far too long a time

#2: It would essentially be thumbing his nose at Johan's orders.

Taking initiative is one thing... AC can rationalize that he saw an
opportunity that just couldn't be passed up, something that might not
have been apparent to Johan at the time. But placing a HUGE burden on
your team mates is something else again.

It's not like a silly post on the 'net that can be ignored or plonked or
made fun of, depending upon mood.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"Nobody" wrote in message
...
If the situation comes up, should Contadore try to get more time on
his 'rivals'?

What if this requires a tactical risk? If he takes off and the other
contenders, Wiggins, Schleck go with him, he risks being attacked,
risks knocking another Astana rider off the podium, expends energy
needlessly.

When he attacked and gained 21 seconds, had he also calculated right
and gotten yellow, then there'd be no talk from the bus. Getting
yellow is getting yellow.

Obviously, if he can attack and get 5 minutes on everyone, then that's
a given. But to attack with no clear result (or plan?) just to gain
seconds; should he try it anyway?

Le 7/12/2009 22:19, Mike Jacoubowsky a écrit :
Taking initiative is one thing... AC can rationalize that he saw an
opportunity that just couldn't be passed up, something that might not
have been apparent to Johan at the time.

Radios - necessary - essential. Hmmmmm.....
--
Bonne route !

Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

In article ,
Howard Kveck wrote:

In article
,
Bug wrote:

No, not if his aim is to lose.
Did you really write this or was it the monkeys?

Damn it! Now I'm really ****ed, Those monkeys are suppose to be
practicing their echelon technique and now I learn they are posting
under the alias Nobody

When I see those monkeys I am going to beat the living crap out of
them.

Not before they throw it at you.

Most of the monkeys are suicidal and loyal, and are trying to help the
"master" monkeys win.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

In article ,
"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote:

When he attacked and gained 21 seconds, had he also calculated right
and gotten yellow, then there'd be no talk from the bus. Getting
yellow is getting yellow.

And that's about as backward as you could get anything. If AC had gotten
Yellow, he would have risked not just a cold shoulder but team support
for the rest of the race. It would have been the most-idiotic move
possible, because-

#1: He'd be putting the team in the position of having to defend the
jersey for far too long a time

How to put this delicately?

Dumbass: no team is trying to defend "the jersey" per se. The winning
condition is putting time into other plausible GC contenders. Once a GC
contender is actually in yellow, this condition doesn't change.

The list of contenders is fluid, but with limitations.

Contador is already the "double-secret yellow," in that he's the
plausible contender who is highest up the standings; Nocenti is not a
sufficiently plausible challenger (though he did finish only 1:04 back
in the opening TT) to scare anyone.

The only benefit is that AG2R might have been recruited into some
pace-making on these last two stages. Did that actually happen?

Here's the useful point: if a break gets 20 minutes up the road this
week, Astana is equally screwed whether or not they are wearing yellow.
The problem is if they want to win, they still have to either chase down
the break themselves or recruit teams (most of the time, sprinter teams)
who think they have something to gain by reeling in the break.


#2: It would essentially be thumbing his nose at Johan's orders.

Taking initiative is one thing... AC can rationalize that he saw an
opportunity that just couldn't be passed up, something that might not
have been apparent to Johan at the time. But placing a HUGE burden on
your team mates is something else again.

Huge burden? Putting a huge burden on your teammates consists of leaving
yourself ahead of obvious GC contenders by a thin margin, thus making
every breakaway attempt and every bumpy stage a moment of danger.

The teams of riders who are 3 minutes up on GC are very very relaxed.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."

In article ,
wrote:

If the situation comes up, should Contadore try to get more time on
his 'rivals'?

What if this requires a tactical risk? If he takes off and the other
contenders, Wiggins, Schleck go with him, he risks being attacked,
risks knocking another Astana rider off the podium, expends energy
needlessly.

When he attacked and gained 21 seconds, had he also calculated right
and gotten yellow, then there'd be no talk from the bus. Getting
yellow is getting yellow.

Obviously, if he can attack and get 5 minutes on everyone, then that's
a given. But to attack with no clear result (or plan?) just to gain
seconds; should he try it anyway?

The attack put time on his competition

AND

it served notice. Now they know that
Alberto can put the hammer down on them.

--
Michael Press